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This is true, but as a group our receivers are garbage. Like we got some guys who are solid good receivers, but we don't have a true go to guy and instead of taking that and going 5 deep across the position we've got 3 ok guys and a couple replacement level players. It's just dumb. Then we dress guys like Chris-Ike and Daniels with the idea that we will just go play bully ball, but then wind up trying to pass all the time anyway. Basically we built a team for a Lapo or Pierce style offense and then hired an OC without any idea how to run that.

There are many things wrong with the current roster and coaching staff but I think that a first step in the right direction could be made by adjusting the O-line. To my eye Bryant, although a future hall-of-famer, is way past his prime and, if O'Shea is not going to bench or cut him, something as simple as swapping the tackles might help out (Broxton to LT and Bryant to RT). It may not work but I'd give it a try as it could save our QBs a lot of grief.

That's a significant failure by our GM. Guys dropping balls is another significant problem we are experiencing way too much. The fact we are sitting here discussing a ham and egger like Wheatfall as one that got away tells us where our receiving recruitment is at.

This. I don't get where this "Wheatfall is our missing piece" idea came from. But he's not making this offense that much better. One massive difference in his play this year, compared to last is a supporting WR who demands attention from the defence. Wheatfall comes here...we still don't have that. We also don't have a QB who can hit a WR in stride past 30yrds. Wheatfall would be an upgrade over Cobb....but that's not saying much. NEED wheatfall? no. We just need someone who can play WR at this level.

We were the 7th offense in the league last year, with Edmonton taking a nap for the first 10 games, with Wheatfall as our #2-3 receiver (Wilson came back and took targets away). We are the 7th offense in the league without Wheatfall....and one of the teams worse than us is the team he plays for. We NEED Wheatfall. It couldn't be more clear.

Just to add a bit of push back about MOS not using guys. Listening to Jaylen(?) Smith interview with ed Tait right now. He spoke about how his mental health wasnt great last year and he wasnt sure if he still wanted to play. Gave MOS credit for treating him well and speaking everyday.

to me, it's all about the line... the old adage of building from the lines out still holds true today... if you're going to be starting 3 Americans on the OL... they better be dominating... our OL has been below average... the receivers, QB, and Brady don't matter if the OL isn't holding up their end

we need any reciever with a pair of hands and a pulse who can play...we have 2 duds starting who average combined 2 catches a game for about 30 yards....not good enough

Yup, it's very obvious that there's zero correlation between being a good player and being a good coach. Completely different skill sets.

You're quoting Booch, not me. But I also never suggested he should be #1 or that anyone was implying that. I simply said he failed to secure a roster spot so we worked to upgrade him. We re-signed Pokey, grabbed White in FA and our top 3 were Demski, Pokey, and White. Wheatfall would be, at best, our #4. They decided they could recruit another guy. And if you want to discuss their failures at being able to scout receivers, I am all for that conversation, but based on Wheatfall's play I was more than happy to see him move on. And again, nothing this year has made me believe otherwise.

I don't ever remember a time on these boards or anywhere else that anyone ever said Jake Thomas was a fine or a talented player. He was just a guy who was just there. I also don't remember ever going to a game and hearing the crowd roar when the PA announcer would get excited after a big Jake Thomas play. I do still have memories in my head from 30 years ago when the PA guy would say "K.....D... WILLIAMS" after the dude would make a big play. Thomas could be a good coach, I'll give him a chance.

all we heard was ZC got pissy about something...if anything our receivers the last few yr should be pissy to him about the suicide balls. As for issues with teamates i've never heard rhar And sitting out reps? if on 6 game you cant practice but where is evidence of this now?...and if true then why hasn't the HC done anything about it...or cut him? Not a very in tune HC then When ball comes to him...he catches it...and generally gets yards after the catch The dude has a 75% catch rate over his career...and 1/3 his t=yards are yac...so not like he is useless...just not used right...and not surprising as many guys here both side of the ball are not used right...Hes played 3 games...targeted 2x..pretty hard to show anything with that use, and its not an issue of him not being open

Also JT was a fine NI DT for years... He just got too many reps toward the end. But this narrative that he was shitty is false. He was a good player for a number of years. And I have zero doubts that he's a great teacher.

I got into a bit of a discussion with a poster on another forum about the Bombers’ defensive play. I suggested (might have been stronger) that Ball and Kelly, while good ST players, should not be on the field taking regular snaps with the defence. He disagreed, saying that I was too quick in my judgement of Ball given that he had just returned from injury (and was reinjured) and that Kelly was looking pretty good at safety. So, it dawned on me that the Bombers seem have a lot of ST players on this team, perhaps too many. I had a look at the official CFL stats, last year’s and this year’s only. Through week 11 last year, the Bombers were 5-4 and the CFL stats package had their defense ranked at #5, while their STs were ranked at #2. By the end of the 2025 regular season the D had moved up to #3 and the STs took over the top spot. (I didn’t bother with the O.) This season through week 11, we’re (guess what?) at 5-4 with our D is ranked #6 and our STs ranked #1. It will be interesting to see where both are at the end of the season but I’m hoping though not overly optimistic, that the D can move up a tad and the way the STs are playing, I’d guess that they’ll still be at or near the top. I guess what I’m trying to say is that the Bombers seem to be really good at drafting or finding ST players but maybe are not so good at drafting or finding really good players for the other 2/3 of this team sport. So, IMO, Ball and Kelly are fine on STs but please keep them off the field for defensive purposes. Anyone with thoughts on the matter?

This way of thinking has been proven wrong a million times in every sport.

Before this week Wheatfall had like 80 yards more than Nield on the season and both had 0 TDs so let's not act like Wheatfall is tearing up the league, he'd be #4 on the Bombers and probably get as much use here as Nield does. He had a big week and based on his career so far that's going to be followed up by 4 weeks of nothing.

more about scheme and how you use the players I think..There are tons of ways to compensate for an inferior line and hide it...we dont do that When we actually use the run as the focal point...mix in some tempo and hot/quick read plays we look very effective and firing on all cylinders But when we try to be this passing juggernaut which requires timing...time from the oline and a Qb that can get it out quick and hit spots...we flounder cause well...we have a one dimensional inferior WR group...an oline that isnt constructed now for the heavypass game, and a QB that ant do that now...ther's the issue..Square peg in round hole syndrome....and the insanity of just keep trying it

There are too many problems on this team for any kind of quick fix, and there is NO indication that help of any kind is coming. The team, including coaches and GM, needs to be burned down to the waterline. Hell, I would probably even include Miller. Suck it up, folks, we're scrooged for this year and will be lucky to get more than a couple of wins more this year, and are likely to stagger into the playoffs, then bomb out.

I dont think any player dumped..pr'd...whatever u wanna call it is a case of a player not securing a spot under an Osh led team...we seen too many times players who have apparently "secured" a spot having no business in that spot...some even being on a roster The basis of the argument is we didnt retain a guy who would have been cheap...had experience...and could be easily cut if we found better that would make our group as it is now with the current top 3 guys better...over what Neild and the Cobb/Corc duo is...that's the argument...esecially when we dont need to go 3 Canadians. People always tend to fly off wild tangents warping what a poster says right outta context I have never ever said he would be a top #1 kinda guy....only that seeing as we dont need 3 Canadians for ratio he would give us more...and allow space for our top 3...who as a collective group themselves are nowhere near the top 3 groups of top 3 groups in the league. In all honesty any import with real tasty metrics ...even one fresh off the street would give us that too...We have 2 guys on the PR...and not even trying one of them "just to see" if it improves anything is gross negligence on this coaching staff. Not trying to get better...especially when your passing attack ranks in bottom of the league territory 2 yrs running now is pretty pathetic, when you seem to do nothing about it, or just think its good enough If anyone of you in your job were failing...but you had options to possibly make it better, but ignored/refused to even try....you think you be employed long?

I never suggested Wheatfall is a Number 1 receiver so get that notion outta your head, Jesse. I never said that. he would have been a #2 or 3 on our roster. We'd have been a better team with him then without him. He's outplaying Lawler, the Ti Cats unabashed #1. As compared to Cobb? Nield?? Au contraire, mon ami. I think he'd have made us better.

JT is doing an excellent job. Not sure what you are on about now. Our DL is playing well. Totally. JT can absolutely evaluate their tech and fine tune it without demonstrating it himself. That's just nonsense. By that logic 80% of the position coaches in the entirety of football should not be in their respective positions. Bob Wylie ever jump on the line and demo tech? Nope. One of the best tech teachers the CFL has ever seen.⁷ Just another drive by at JT. Let it go Booch.

First things first....Glad we won and is always what I want/hope for. But that was not a game to give anyone warm fuzzy feelings and hopes of optimism, but here are some of my takes from it Smith....Let the kid be on the field all the time. He has shown he can be a difference and play maker at SAM and WILL....so let him grow and evolve as he is on fast track to becoming one of the best Canadian Defensive players in the league...period! We also don't need all of Ayers, Woodbey, Wilson and Jones it's redundant and doesn't really serve a purpose. Jones sure he gets tackles but was exposed over and over in space...losing his angle on tackles and generally doesn't know where to drop back into coverage to disrupt anything. Wilson is not an all-star type anymore, but he serves a purpose and has fewer holes, still will make impact plays and can play multiple LB spots...Jones can't....use that import spot elsewhere Woodbey is young...athletic...can play several LB spots, as well as a modified Jack...as can Ayers and while Griffen is out a starting unit of Woodbey/Ayers/Smith with Wilson as the swing guy gives us a much better crew...younger...faster..athletic...all versatile and all with upside, and experience already...Griffin back then you go Smith...Ayers/Woodbey....Griffin Kelly...Hallett...Ball should never...ever be on the field with those 2 safety looks...ever! I guess with Ball looking to be done for the yr we can avoid that now, but that is just ridiculous, not needed for ratio and just makes us a poor defense. Isit the osh wanting to push the Canadiana?...Just ineptness in coaching...Both?...but it's pointless. And while Kramdi wasn't ideal at safety while he is out the Kelly experiment there needs to end....He has shown over 2 seasons now he isn't an answer at that 2 safety look....or at starting safety. We have Stuart who was lights out on teams...actually has HB potential....and size...so there's the guy we should slot in at Safety right now and let him grow there...Likely he becomes a staple there. We also have the Global Oyelola...get him on the roster...see what he can do...as opposed to rotting on the PR. Relatively young...several yrs in NFL honing his game...he must have some skill to stick for almost 3 yrs...Time for his shot instead of recycling the same end of roster guys in different roles. If it wasn't proven last night our offense and it's identity flows through BO then all the coaches should be cut loose...Used like Harris circa 2019/2021 and well we saw what can happen...and that's also one of the ways to compensate for a suspect O-line. And start installing progression plays off of it. I also would like to see us implement some packages and extended plays with Perkins...Especilly with some tempo and pre snap motions...we kinda just wastinghis skillset soley as a guy taking the plunge...Would also better set us up in 2027 for TC and having a true battle for #1 with him..Dru and TE... WR group tho...yikes...worst in league...poorly utilize what we do have and no home run hitter let alone true #1...and that's gotta change fast. If it means bringing in Lewis...or just starting Singer or Womack....or actually go out and find a physical playmaker then do it. Our group is small...weak...and very one dimensional. If you look at a lot of the incompletions...especially intermediate and long it's because we have no guys who will attack the ball...Demski can a bit and can make some those contested catches with guys all over him, but you shouldn't rely on a receiver built like him for that. Wilson is especially bad and has zero fight at all for the ball...he be ideal #3 as he is shifty and greasy and when gets ball in his hands in space is good at yac and making a 3 yard catch into a 10+ yd one...but he is no #1 by any stretch...Not sure what's up with Nield...can he not get open/separate?...never in right spot but man with him and Cobb out there we basically have 3 guys that are garnering any attention. Give that spot to Big kev...he is our only physically dominant wr...has great hands...and can do something after the catch...we have seen it...and inside he would be a handful...Is he not getting the reps or that spot because Nield was supposed to be this bigtime FA score?...Wouldnt shock me with Osh...But man we are weak and wont go far in the season let alone playoffs with this crew as it is Oline not sure what to do there other than like I mentioned create an offense to compensate..lotsa runs...lots slide protections and movement moving the QB's launch point..there's ways to accommodate but treating them and playing them like the lines we had when we won the Cups is not gonna work. And if we gonna run 3 imports on the line...all3 should be top grade beef...all 3 are not and sacrificing a skilled position player on offence for defence for that is just effectively slitting your own throte Which leads me to my final opinion...based on what we saw in the game again...the leadup...the non urgency to change anything...we wont win or have any Cup aspirations until this team moves away from some coaches

Isn't an issue the fact that our three main receivers: Wilson, White and Demski are all similar players? I feel like @JuranBoldenRules , @wbbfan , @Booch and @GCn20 have all stated this.

Great point. I was thinking about that, realistically if we had kept Wheatfall I can't imagine we wouldn've signed Nield. I would take nield between the two as well. Better fit and passport. Plus reliable. We are just using Nield really really poorly currently.

Or a whole committee including coordinators??

yeah Dunk actually is good...he can actually get legit stuff

I would agree with you about 3DN except it was Dunk stating it. The rest of the guys are garbage connection wise but Dunk is pretty plugged in.

3downnation talked a out it earlier this season on their podcast. Ill see if I can find it.

Offence is 7th in net yards and points scored. Defence is 6th in net yards and points allowed. Mediocre all around and the record reflects it.

💯 Speedy thought he had a win over me there. Let’s let him have it. It’s been a while.

Jake was a fine backup guy. It was when they decided he was a starter that things got stupid. But his career is over and it appears he’s a solid coach and a smart football mind. Rumour has it he was always in the film room. So he will make a good coach.

never said the dline wasnt playingwell...prob the one unit thats been consistently good all yr...But it's not because of JT's coaching is all I am saying...If it was his leadership and glue traits and how he played to show others how to do it wouldnt have had our dline bottom of barrel last 2..3 yrs And in all honesty..Positional coaches save for a legit QB coach in the CFL are pretty much all ado about nothing...Just a position to over see the drills...thats on all teams btw...not just here And I agree...there are some gys who never played a down who made a great coach...never said its not true....all I said was a guy who had zero tech...no hand skills isnt the best to demonstrate it to a et...and if he had all this abiity he would have shown it...man some hyou people here sure get yer panties twisted And yeah if i wanna drive by anyone...for good reason I will...so theres that too...deal with it

Special Teams are important and the Bombers play it very disciplined and have a game breaker of a returner. But even with that going into Week 11 they were 7th in the league in average start position behind only Hamilton and BC and were dead last in opponents start position. It seems to me being able to move the ball on offense and stop the ball on defense should be a higher priority than filling the special teams. Obviously the analytics in the CFL are sparse compared to the NFL but a yard of field position is worth about 0.05 points in the NFL. The difference in opponents average punt return for the Bombers and the last place team in that space is roughly 5 yards per return... napkin math bombers had punted 44 times, so that is 220 extra yards, Bombers opponents have had 106 possessions, so lets move the ball up for them an average of 2 yards a possession because our special teams stink now. 106 drives with an extra 2 yards per drive means they would be expected to give up about... 11 extra points over those 9 games. I'm sure if you were to focus scouting and drafting on impact skill players you could find one or two that would give you a better return of just over a point per game than a potpourri of teams players who will never (or should never) play on offense or defense. The aggregate defensive ranking for the Bombers in the stat package is what it is... they are pretty high because they have a bunch of sacks and knockdowns and are good on 2nd down... but it gets balanced out a bit because they much more horrendous against the run than they are good against the pass. EDIT As a counter point to why special teams are important... The Chargers in 2010 finished first in total offense and first in total defense and still missed the playoffs because their special teams were historically trash. So as with everything... it depends

Mahomes would have been a great one if his main offensive coach wasn’t a 500 pound ogre who played football when the edges of the ball were still squared.

You can see why we match up well against Ottawa. We can't stop the run and they don't bother trying to run. I don't know what happened to Greg Bell, the guy was no Blink or anything but he was a shifty scarback who could hurt you in space or if he got to the second level. But he's been hit hard by the Ottawa free agent curse and he looks like he's running in cement out there. This is gonna sounds weird but I think Maier is underrated. Put him on an otherwise solid team and he'd game manage some wins. But you can't take a B- quarterback like him and win with him throwing the ball 40+ times a game. You need something else going on on O.

and minimal fight for contested balls....we have guys who will sit back and wait on a ball...as it gets broken up as opposed to guys who instinctively attack the ball...that's a huge issue...especially with Wilson not as bad for White...but he is guilty of that often

Clercius has been healthy, active and playing the last 3 games. He's only been targeted twice in those games (both completions) but sure it's his fault that he's barely being used.

How do people know that it's the receivers that are the problem.... Vs the coordinator.... Vs the QBs.... Vs the OL.... Vs "the entire offense as a whole is a problem".... ?

Keric Wheatfall would have helped us this year. That should tell us all we need to know about KW and the scouts ability to find receiver talent. Keric is a pretty replaceable guy and the fact we haven't is pretty telling.

who didnt disappears yr tho?...As a first yr starter...in 16 games...as essentially a 3rd option at best how is 655 yards..4 td's and 15.7 yards per catch considered a throw away? Especially in our crap system last yr? Hate to keep harping and saying the same thing but the argument was not him being a 1A and a guy who would take us to the promised land...but augment our group...give others some space and if we did find better in camp he could be easily cut and cost us nothing in process....Our crew is worse than last yr really as we have 2 spots doing absolutely nothing Saying he played himself off the team is kind of a dumb statement,,,and White isnt Wheatfalls replacement...He's Schoen replacement...or whoever was considered out number 1....If White was to be a 3rd..4th guys replacement...who is our legit number 1...game breaker?...Thats what White was signed as and touted for not even just gave up...hardly given the chance...His first yr shouldnt be a factor as he was really a bit player...but last yr in a Hogan offence he certainly didnt fall on his face...Not his fault our scheme and QB'ing was crap

The Wheatfall narrative continues to baffle. By all accounts he was a reasonable dude when he was here, but if you are going 3 NIs which the Bombers did, you aren't going to take him over Wilson or White so where does he fit in? If the Bombers went 3 Imports he would be a serviceable 3rd guy (which he really is behind Smith and Lawler in Hamilton) but he was here for a season and a half and his production isn't too far off then and now... 2 really nice games, a few games he completely disappeared and a bunch of serviceable games in the middle. As other people are saying... you SHOULD be able to scout another one of those guys and maybe hit a home run. Maybe Singer is that guy but as of right now it's looking like we'll never know. The Elks brought in 2 of them with Luther and Cephus. Argos brought in Kahmann.

I just looked at the numbers. Opposing QBs are not having these extraordinary games against us. They're completing at or below their yearly averages in yards and completion percentage. Our focus is ovbiously on the Bombers, but scoring is at an incredible clip right now against all teams. The bigger problem is that our offence isn't keeping up with the pack.

Broxton at left, vanterpool at right plz and thanks.

Having Reese and Fletcher has really helped the D line. They actually cut Fletcher but that could have been because he was injured. They both have been pleasant surprises.

I wonder if it would make sense to bring in Eugene Lewis and move Wilson inside to Nield's spot and move Nield to field WR.

Blah blah blah this same talent nonsense. There are those of us have been screaming for Smith to start all season.... You see why, gonna pretend it's only because he was less talented? We have some talent gaps sure, but the roster construction and usage doesn't get the most out of what they DO have.

Smith is not only one of our best linebackers he's one of our best Canadians. Absolutely criminal that he's not a full time starter. We draft all these linebackers and they want to go with a million Americans, we draft 0 receivers and think we can play 3 Canadians there. Make it make sense

This is Ottawa. We should be expected to win. Not Saskatchewan or Montreal. Really, what kind of a team did we beat? One that hasn't won for a year. And looks like it could go another year before they win again. Lordy, if the Bombers had lost. Our next 6 games are against Edmonton, Montreal, Saskatchewan back to back, Toronto & Montreal. They way we looked offensively last night other than Oliveira running wild, we could be 5-10 by the beginning of October.