TBURGESS Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 We won 6 games in the first half of last season. We've won 5 games since. If O'Shea doesn't get us into the playoffs, then it's time to replace him with someone who can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Dee Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Oh yeah, the "right guy" scenario... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBURGESS Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Oh yeah, the "right guy" scenario... That's right. Glad to see you finally 'get it'. Hire the right people... create a winner. Hire the wrong people... replace them every year or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Dee Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Oh yeah, the "right guy" scenario...That's right. Glad to see you finally 'get it'. Hire the right people... create a winner. Hire the wrong people... replace them every year or two.You keep saying that..hire the right people..in retrospect, but you never say that at the beginning, and you never answer how you know you have the right people, you know, to create that winning atmosphere. blitzmore 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ripper Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 There's no way Khari isn't looking to get out of BC. He gets demoted to receiver's coach. I'd bring him in to replace MB in the offseason. I'd keep Hall who has improved the D as the year has gone on, he is also only in his first season. I'd likely keep O`Shea depending on how things play out. At least next year with Jones on staff you have a coaching candidate on staff to replace O`Shea if he struggles out the gate. Jones was a gun slinger, who better to work with Willy. Not to derail thread, but as a side note, current Rider mess has much to do with Chamblin chasing away- getting rid of any assistant coaches that could have been a threat to take over. I think the Bombers have had too much change in the coaching staff. I`d be looking to tweak things and stay the course. Goalie and SPuDS 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBURGESS Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Oh yeah, the "right guy" scenario...That's right. Glad to see you finally 'get it'. Hire the right people... create a winner. Hire the wrong people... replace them every year or two.You keep saying that..hire the right people..in retrospect, but you never say that at the beginning, and you never answer how you know you have the right people, you know, to create that winning atmosphere. I've said over and over again that we should hire experienced folks who have a winning record over experienced folks with a losing record over rookies trying the job out for the first time. It should come as no surprise that most rookies don't work out so you have to replace them. I said that when we hired Miller/Walters/O'Shea, but no want wanted to listen back then. DR. CFL 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jpan85 Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Oh yeah, the "right guy" scenario...That's right. Glad to see you finally 'get it'. Hire the right people... create a winner. Hire the wrong people... replace them every year or two.You keep saying that..hire the right people..in retrospect, but you never say that at the beginning, and you never answer how you know you have the right people, you know, to create that winning atmosphere. I've said over and over again that we should hire experienced folks who have a winning record over experienced folks with a losing record over rookies trying the job out for the first time. It should come as no surprise that most rookies don't work out so you have to replace them. I said that when we hired Miller/Walters/O'Shea, but no want wanted to listen back then. You really limit your pool of candidates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBURGESS Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Oh yeah, the "right guy" scenario...That's right. Glad to see you finally 'get it'. Hire the right people... create a winner. Hire the wrong people... replace them every year or two.You keep saying that..hire the right people..in retrospect, but you never say that at the beginning, and you never answer how you know you have the right people, you know, to create that winning atmosphere. I've said over and over again that we should hire experienced folks who have a winning record over experienced folks with a losing record over rookies trying the job out for the first time. It should come as no surprise that most rookies don't work out so you have to replace them. I said that when we hired Miller/Walters/O'Shea, but no want wanted to listen back then. You really limit your pool of candidates. A small group of good candidates is better than a large group of inexperienced contenders IMO. I'd also add coaches who've had a lot of successful experience as OC's or DC's at a high level like NFL, CFL or big US Colleges before rookie HC's with very little experience. (Yes I know that Burke falls in this category and he was a failure. Everyone's not going to work out) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17to85 Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 So Toronto did it wrong hiring an inexperienced Milanovich? Or Edmonton with an inexperienced Jones? Come on now let's not be ridiculous. Experienced or inexperienced doesn't matter if they're good at what they do. blitzmore 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iso_55 Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 So Toronto did it wrong hiring an inexperienced Milanovich? Or Edmonton with an inexperienced Jones? Come on now let's not be ridiculous. Experienced or inexperienced doesn't matter if they're good at what they do. "If they're good"... that's the key words here. Jury's out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ripper Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 So Toronto did it wrong hiring an inexperienced Milanovich? Or Edmonton with an inexperienced Jones? Come on now let's not be ridiculous. Experienced or inexperienced doesn't matter if they're good at what they do. Same as bringing in rookie players. You do your homework, make a educated guess, and hope the hell it works out. iso_55 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR. CFL Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Players that don't workout are easily and quickly discarded.....poor coaches less so and with a greater, longer lasting effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ripper Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Players that don't workout are easily and quickly discarded.....poor coaches less so and with a greater, longer lasting effect. Your right but I`ll present exhibit B to my case. The Riders interviewed Milanovich, Chamblin, and O`Shea the same year they hired Marshall as head coach. They went with the experienced guy in true Rider fashion and we threw our 2011 season under the bus. I don`t mind taking a shot at a young coach if he appears to be on the way up as Milanovich clearly was at that time. In fact as I recall, I was mad that we didn`t hire O`Shea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17to85 Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 So Toronto did it wrong hiring an inexperienced Milanovich? Or Edmonton with an inexperienced Jones? Come on now let's not be ridiculous. Experienced or inexperienced doesn't matter if they're good at what they do. "If they're good"... that's the key words here. Jury's out. Yeah but we have someone specifically saying to hire experience. I'm just pointing out that hiring the right person has nothing to do with experience. iso_55 and Fred C Dobbs 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBURGESS Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 So Toronto did it wrong hiring an inexperienced Milanovich? Or Edmonton with an inexperienced Jones? Come on now let's not be ridiculous. Experienced or inexperienced doesn't matter if they're good at what they do. Experience matters a lot. Toronto got it right when they hired the "inexperienced" (Pro coach since 2003 and asst HC in Montreal) Milanovich and Edmonton got it right when they hired "inexperienced" (Pro coach since 1998 including Asst HC/GM in Toronto) Jones. We got it wrong when we hired "inexperienced" (STC since 2010) O'Shea. Rookies are a higher risk whether it's as a player, HC, GM or CEO or any other job for that matter. Take the higher risk and you may get rewarded, but it's more likely that you'll be replacing them more often than an experienced person with a quality track record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iso_55 Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 So Toronto did it wrong hiring an inexperienced Milanovich? Or Edmonton with an inexperienced Jones? Come on now let's not be ridiculous. Experienced or inexperienced doesn't matter if they're good at what they do. "If they're good"... that's the key words here. Jury's out. Yeah but we have someone specifically saying to hire experience. I'm just pointing out that hiring the right person has nothing to do with experience. Millanovich & Jones had a lot more experience as O & D coordinators before they became head coaches. They coached under different head coaches & systems. They were both Grey Cup champions before they became head coaches. MOS was a ST coach & had no experience other than a few seasons doing that in Toronto. I'm sorry but if Mark Killam & Ti Cats DC Orlando Steinhauer were available I wouldn't be hiring Killam. Even though he's been a successful ST coordinator in Calgary the past 5 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17to85 Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 So Toronto did it wrong hiring an inexperienced Milanovich? Or Edmonton with an inexperienced Jones? Come on now let's not be ridiculous. Experienced or inexperienced doesn't matter if they're good at what they do. Experience matters a lot. Toronto got it right when they hired the "inexperienced" (Pro coach since 2003 and asst HC in Montreal) Milanovich and Edmonton got it right when they hired "inexperienced" (Pro coach since 1998 including Asst HC/GM in Toronto) Jones. We got it wrong when we hired "inexperienced" (STC since 2010) O'Shea. Rookies are a higher risk whether it's as a player, HC, GM or CEO or any other job for that matter. Take the higher risk and you may get rewarded, but it's more likely that you'll be replacing them more often than an experienced person with a quality track record. You know we could also look at Pinball Clemons who had basically no experience and made a pretty good head coach. Just get off the experience thing and say what you really mean, stop hiring duds and hire someone good. I mean really you want a proven experienced hire so what are we doing? Dragging Don Matthews or Dave Ritchie out of the old age homes to run the teams for us? Cause other than that the list of guys with experience have been tried and failed. SPuDS 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noeller Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 MOS was *THE* undisputed first choice by virtually all in the know, to be The Next One HC around the league. Maybe he walked into a worse situation than Milano and Jones, or maybe it's something else....but I'm not sure this current situation says MOS is or isn't a good HC.... SPuDS 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atomic Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Lapo had tons of experience before he was hired too. SPuDS 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBURGESS Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 So Toronto did it wrong hiring an inexperienced Milanovich? Or Edmonton with an inexperienced Jones? Come on now let's not be ridiculous. Experienced or inexperienced doesn't matter if they're good at what they do. Experience matters a lot. Toronto got it right when they hired the "inexperienced" (Pro coach since 2003 and asst HC in Montreal) Milanovich and Edmonton got it right when they hired "inexperienced" (Pro coach since 1998 including Asst HC/GM in Toronto) Jones. We got it wrong when we hired "inexperienced" (STC since 2010) O'Shea. Rookies are a higher risk whether it's as a player, HC, GM or CEO or any other job for that matter. Take the higher risk and you may get rewarded, but it's more likely that you'll be replacing them more often than an experienced person with a quality track record. You know we could also look at Pinball Clemons who had basically no experience and made a pretty good head coach. Just get off the experience thing and say what you really mean, stop hiring duds and hire someone good. I mean really you want a proven experienced hire so what are we doing? Dragging Don Matthews or Dave Ritchie out of the old age homes to run the teams for us? Cause other than that the list of guys with experience have been tried and failed. For every Clemons, there are several Burke's, O'Shea's, PLAP's and Kelly's. You seem to be ignoring the term more likely. Tom Higgins has an above .500 record. Yah, he was fired by Montreal, but O'Shea wouldn't have lasted a year and half there either. Mike Benevides has an above .500 record. Yah, he was fired by BC, but that's because they don't take losing lying down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ripper Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 MOS was *THE* undisputed first choice by virtually all in the know, to be The Next One HC around the league. Maybe he walked into a worse situation than Milano and Jones, or maybe it's something else....but I'm not sure this current situation says MOS is or isn't a good HC.... What`s O`Shea`s record as head coach when Willy has been healthy. Seems to me he has had a lot of games with a backup at the helm. Noeller and SPuDS 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR. CFL Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 It is a huge challenge predicting the probability of success of an assistant or a coordinator as a HC. The skill set is completely different. However a significant contributor to a HC's success is having a qualified, experienced staff in all aspects of the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
max power Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 I don't have a problem with the Bombers hiring O'Shea, Walters, or Wade Miller. What worried me was that they hired all three of them when none of them had experience in the position they were being hired for. But what's done is done. Might as well keep them all now until they get enough experience to build a winner instead of starting the process all over again. Hiring Richie Hall as DC was a good first step. Having Willy and Nichols is a good step too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atomic Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 So Toronto did it wrong hiring an inexperienced Milanovich? Or Edmonton with an inexperienced Jones? Come on now let's not be ridiculous. Experienced or inexperienced doesn't matter if they're good at what they do.Experience matters a lot. Toronto got it right when they hired the "inexperienced" (Pro coach since 2003 and asst HC in Montreal) Milanovich and Edmonton got it right when they hired "inexperienced" (Pro coach since 1998 including Asst HC/GM in Toronto) Jones. We got it wrong when we hired "inexperienced" (STC since 2010) O'Shea. Rookies are a higher risk whether it's as a player, HC, GM or CEO or any other job for that matter. Take the higher risk and you may get rewarded, but it's more likely that you'll be replacing them more often than an experienced person with a quality track record. You know we could also look at Pinball Clemons who had basically no experience and made a pretty good head coach. Just get off the experience thing and say what you really mean, stop hiring duds and hire someone good. I mean really you want a proven experienced hire so what are we doing? Dragging Don Matthews or Dave Ritchie out of the old age homes to run the teams for us? Cause other than that the list of guys with experience have been tried and failed. For every Clemons, there are several Burke's, O'Shea's, PLAP's and Kelly's. You seem to be ignoring the term more likely.Tom Higgins has an above .500 record. Yah, he was fired by Montreal, but O'Shea wouldn't have lasted a year and half there either. Mike Benevides has an above .500 record. Yah, he was fired by BC, but that's because they don't take losing lying down. Now I'm confused. So Benevides had enough experience but Lapolice didn't? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR. CFL Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Look back at LaPos staff. His first prerequisite was he wanted "good" teachers. His staff was largely an amateur hour of U.S. Coaches with no pro experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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