the stamps 2 victories were meaningless   ... I  still think they fight with the Riders for the basement

toronto has enough talent to still win without a QB: special teams + decent D

 

2 minutes ago, Brandon said:

From what I understood on here Chad Kelly's win-loss record doesn't count... but Flutie is an all time great because his win-loss record is allowed to be considered.  

So they focus on the personal stats...   Last season Chad Kelly's QB rating was higher then any season that Doug Flutie had in the CFL.   This year Chad's rating of 98.2 would rank almost the same as Flutie's 3rd best season.   Kelly has a much better completion % and yards per attempt.  The TD/int ratio is nearly the same between them both.    

Kelly is playing at a time where it is far more difficult to put up big numbers because the level of play is so much greater these days then back then.   So once again....  how can anyone dispute that Kelly is playing at a HOF level at this point.  

Only an ignorant fan would suggest that he is not.    

 

 

Nobody plays at a HOF level with only 25 games. That doesn't make any sense. 

HOF level is doing that for many years. It is about being great for a long time. Not great for a season and a half. 

38 minutes ago, Brandon said:

but Flutie is an all time great because his win-loss record is allowed to be considered. 

Honestly I couldn't tell you what fluties win/loss record looked like... he is thr best to ever play up here because his impact on the field was ******* obvious. None of the qbs that have come through since have been anywhere near the player Flutie was.

The idea than anyone the purports themselves as a Bomber fan is here talking about how great Chad Kelly is; just leaves me feeling dirty in a way I don't enjoy...

It's an odd hill to die on that's for sure.

5 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

It's an odd hill to die on that's for sure.

I'm very much facts over "emotions" when it comes to judging talent. 

 

20 minutes ago, GCJenks said:

The idea than anyone the purports themselves as a Bomber fan is here talking about how great Chad Kelly is; just leaves me feeling dirty in a way I don't enjoy...

It's not ,  I'm merely pointing out that several people on here have blue-tinted glasses and can't admit when a player they dislike is really good.     It's very "riderfans" like.    "Chad Kelly is a sex pest derp derp derp he sucks".   That kind of circle-yanking is verrrrry Rider fans like.   Kelly is probably a complete d-bag off the field and anyone can say that,  but you can't say he isn't elite on the field based on his current results.   A qb could be a great player on the field and a complete sexual predator off the field... see my example of Warren Moon.  

As I said before... he is ON PACE... and I clearly said that it could go all downhill.  But until then he's on pace for a HOF career.  His sample size is large enough to make that statement.   How boring would these boards be if nobody plays devils advocate?

 

19 minutes ago, Brandon said:

I'm very much facts over "emotions" when it comes to judging talent. 

 

It's not ,  I'm merely pointing out that several people on here have blue-tinted glasses and can't admit when a player they dislike is really good.     It's very "riderfans" like.    "Chad Kelly is a sex pest derp derp derp he sucks".   That kind of circle-yanking is verrrrry Rider fans like.   Kelly is probably a complete d-bag off the field and anyone can say that,  but you can't say he isn't elite on the field based on his current results.   A qb could be a great player on the field and a complete sexual predator off the field... see my example of Warren Moon.  

As I said before... he is ON PACE... and I clearly said that it could go all downhill.  But until then he's on pace for a HOF career.  His sample size is large enough to make that statement.   How boring would these boards be if nobody plays devils advocate?

 

I'm not sorry for the way I feel. Kelly should never have been allowed to resume his career in the CFL, he shouldn't be "on pace" for anything in this league. I recognize that other platers with criminal records have been allowed to continue to play but Kelly violated league policy within the confines of the team facility. I don't believe if this was any team but the Argos the league would have allowed him to play.

10 minutes ago, GCJenks said:

I'm not sorry for the way I feel. Kelly should never have been allowed to resume his career in the CFL, he shouldn't be "on pace" for anything in this league. I recognize that other platers with criminal records have been allowed to continue to play but Kelly violated league policy within the confines of the team facility. I don't believe if this was any team but the Argos the league would have allowed him to play.

In this case facts align with emotions.

Argos suck.

Does it help any of the Chad haters that we've reached a point where opposition defences could pretty much hit him upside the helmet with Sauron's mace after the whistle and not get flagged?

Jokes aside, there's no denying it: when the Chad is having a good day (which is most of the time) he plays like an MOP.

4 minutes ago, bluto said:

Does it help any of the Chad haters that we've reached a point where opposition defences could pretty much hit him upside the helmet with Sauron's mace after the whistle and not get flagged?

Jokes aside, there's no denying it: when the Chad is having a good day (which is most of the time) he plays like an MOP.

Reffing in the cfl has never been a bigger joke. It’s sad. 
 

thats true, and that’s true of zach, brown vaj, and rourke. The thing is to be a mop, or a hof you have to be consistent with the mop games. None of the QBs in the league are any kind of consistent. 
 Prior to 19, we had Reilly and blm in the elite tier of QBs. And we had less consistent guys like zach, Harris, and nichols a tier below. For two years zach was top tier. Right now, every qb is 2nd tier and lower. Which with the hash change is sad. 

As of today, the Argos are one of, if not the hottest team.......it's sucks in the respect that Chad is part of that and many people from across the league do not like him for what he has done off the field, and many valid arguments can be made and have been made as to him even playing at all...but on the field he is a contributing factor to them being arguably the hottest team right now in the CFL.

 

 

 

2 hours ago, GCJenks said:

The idea than anyone the purports themselves as a Bomber fan is here talking about how great Chad Kelly is; just leaves me feeling dirty in a way I don't enjoy...

For some people, being a predator is a feature, not a fault. 

2 hours ago, Brandon said:

I'm very much facts over "emotions" when it comes to judging talent. 

Opinions... 

I mean on his best days sure Kelly can be one of the top qbs in the league... the point though is being better than broken down old, blm and collaros or old average at best Harris or faj.... well that's a low ******* bar, especially when you invoke the name of Flutie...

He'll what we see now in the cfl ain't even the days of calvillo and Ray and Burris and younger collaros and Harris...

5 minutes ago, JCon said:

For some people, being a predator is a feature, not a fault. 

And then glossing it up, minimizing it as you just Chad Haters, he be a MOP on most days. Ffs.

1 hour ago, bluto said:

Does it help any of the Chad haters that we've reached a point where opposition defences could pretty much hit him upside the helmet with Sauron's mace after the whistle and not get flagged?

Jokes aside, there's no denying it: when the Chad is having a good day (which is most of the time) he plays like an MOP.

His athletic skills have never been in question, and he has the advantage of having a damned good coach, O-line and offensive coordinator.

Kelly: I'm on the fence until he starts and plays well in the playoffs. Last year was beyond abysmal

 

 

The most honest I can be about it: I wish Chad Kelly was as shitty a quarterback as he is a person.

He’s a good-great QB, in the context of the league right now, which sucks because he doesn’t in the least amount deserve the opportunity. Frankly, it really pisses me off. 

 I don’t buy the comparison to Flutie at all. Way different style of player, plus Flutie was just flat out better.

More like David Archer maybe if we’re going back that far. Michael Reilly-ish a bit too. 

Edited October 22, 20241 yr by JohnnyAbonny

On 2024-10-21 at 9:09 AM, Brandon said:

From what I understood on here Chad Kelly's win-loss record doesn't count... but Flutie is an all time great because his win-loss record is allowed to be considered.  

So they focus on the personal stats...   Last season Chad Kelly's QB rating was higher then any season that Doug Flutie had in the CFL.   This year Chad's rating of 98.2 would rank almost the same as Flutie's 3rd best season.   Kelly has a much better completion % and yards per attempt.  The TD/int ratio is nearly the same between them both.    

Kelly is playing at a time where it is far more difficult to put up big numbers because the level of play is so much greater these days then back then.   So once again....  how can anyone dispute that Kelly is playing at a HOF level at this point.  

Only an ignorant fan would suggest that he is not.    

 

 

One could easily argue that because you are trying to compare two different eras of QBing. Compare Kelly to his peers, and compare Flutie to his and then you will grasp what people are saying about Kelly. Kelly has won exactly zero championships and stats wise was the 2nd best QB last year, and is very average in comparison to his peers stats wise this year. No one here is saying that Kelly isn't a good QB, but he is absolutely no shoe in for the HOF either.

Edited October 22, 20241 yr by GCn20

Completion percentage was way lower back in fluties time,  and ints were generally higher too. That's going to skew qb rating stats in a big way as they seem to favour playing a "clean" game. 

 

But hey, someone wants to go ahead and say Chad Kelly is comparable to Flutie go ahead and fill your boots.

On 2024-10-21 at 8:14 AM, blue85gold said:

Nobody plays at a HOF level with only 25 games. That doesn't make any sense. 

HOF level is doing that for many years. It is about being great for a long time. Not great for a season and a half. 

And this factual statement has nothing to do with blue and gold tinted glasses or emotions.

On 2024-10-21 at 8:09 AM, Brandon said:

From what I understood on here Chad Kelly's win-loss record doesn't count... but Flutie is an all time great because his win-loss record is allowed to be considered.  

So they focus on the personal stats...   Last season Chad Kelly's QB rating was higher then any season that Doug Flutie had in the CFL.   This year Chad's rating of 98.2 would rank almost the same as Flutie's 3rd best season.   Kelly has a much better completion % and yards per attempt.  The TD/int ratio is nearly the same between them both.    

Kelly is playing at a time where it is far more difficult to put up big numbers because the level of play is so much greater these days then back then.   So once again....  how can anyone dispute that Kelly is playing at a HOF level at this point.  

Only an ignorant fan would suggest that he is not.    

 

 

The level of play is greater than the Flutie era in Toronto??? Please explain that one. I'd say 95% of the players in that era could play now especially the qbs. 

The CFL could attract a lot of talent in those days from the US when that wage gap wasn't so big. Better getting paid in the CFL, than sitting on the PR down there. Those early 90s teams were stacked. 

15 minutes ago, JCon said:

The CFL could attract a lot of talent in those days from the US when that wage gap wasn't so big. Better getting paid in the CFL, than sitting on the PR down there. Those early 90s teams were stacked. 

 Not to mention the NFL was still stuck in the "qbs below 6'3 need not apply" mindset so qb talent was often overlooked by the NFL for stupid reasons. That doesn't happen anymore.

Just now, 17to85 said:

 Not to mention the NFL was still stuck in the "qbs below 6'3 need not apply" mindset so qb talent was often overlooked by the NFL for stupid reasons. That doesn't happen anymore.

Yeah, I forgot about the "model" the NFL had then. 

The NFL also didn't like to start non caucasian QBs either back then. Guy like Russell Wilson would have been in the CFL in the 90s.

10 minutes ago, rebusrankin said:

The NFL also didn't like to start non caucasian QBs either back then. Guy like Russell Wilson would have been in the CFL in the 90s.

Kyler Murray is cfl tailor made for the 90s also. 

Is BC vs Toronto in BC better for the league than Winnipeg vs Montreal would be?  I’m thinking yes it would be. Kinda the 2 big premier Canadian Cities right. Hope reffing doesn’t play a role in the playoffs 

Edited October 23, 20241 yr by Goalie