Bombers at TiCats early chat

[wbbfan]

13 minutes ago, Booch said:

Look at top 3 teams...winning record teams

Rotate 7 to 9 guys up front...90 % American...all can play...dominate

Look at Superbowl and how why Philly dominated

Our 2 cup wins...T.O schooling us...all in common...legit front loaded import dlines...Not a coincidence 

Look our 3 losses...and our season to date...osh still can't figure it out

we are rolling 6 dl with 3 canadians. every other team is rolling 8+ with 6 or more imps, except for one team with a very good canadian pass rusher. 

We are the only team under rostering dl, and filling half the spots with fringe roster guys. 

28 minutes ago, Booch said:

He doesn't get it...don't waste your breath 

Probably?? U just confirmed you are bordering on clueless 

truth. a couple people on here are soo lost in cognitive dissonance from their unwavering faith in the mafia doing no wrong and the fact we have been at best a fringe play off team for two years, outside of the insanely flukey stretch streak last year. 

 

[17to85]

18 minutes ago, wbbfan said:

we are rolling 6 dl with 3 canadians. every other team is rolling 8+ with 6 or more imps, except for one team with a very good canadian pass rusher. 

And most of our guys are way on the wrong side of 30 too.

[Mark H.]

2 hours ago, 17to85 said:

And most of our guys are way on the wrong side of 30 too.

This wouldn't matter so much if they had more support and rotation.

[bb1]

2 hours ago, wbbfan said:

we are rolling 6 dl with 3 canadians. every other team is rolling 8+ with 6 or more imps, except for one team with a very good canadian pass rusher. 

We are the only team under rostering dl, and filling half the spots with fringe roster guys. 

truth. a couple people on here are soo lost in cognitive dissonance from their unwavering faith in the mafia doing no wrong and the fact we have been at best a fringe play off team for two years, outside of the insanely flukey stretch streak last year. 

 

No...just no. MOS believes his way( focus on special teams) 9 Cdn because of the flexibility if one gets hurt...that's what he believes..is it right with the talent level we have with CDN players? I will leave that up to a professional coach who has brought us 2 cups and to how many Grey cup games?  I don't always say he is right but i believe he has the right for at least one season to show us he ain't wrong, despite what informed posters on here say...i want the Blue to win as much as anyone but to suggest MOS can't coach or assess talent...would you guys say Dickenson couldn't coach the last 2 years before this one? 

[SpeedFlex27]

Can someone summarize the story in today's Free Press as to why Ken Lawler left the Bombers? There's a paywall so I can't read the story. 

[JohnnyAbonny]

8 minutes ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Can someone summarize the story in today's Free Press as to why Ken Lawler left the Bombers? There's a paywall so I can't read the story. 

It’s a pretty long article but it basically says he felt disrespected by Bomber management. 

“For the star receiver, it boiled down to one main thing: disrespect.

“Y’all signed Dillon Mitchell before me. Who wouldn’t (feel disrespected)?” Lawler shared with the Free Press on Thursday in a one-on-one chat inside Hamilton Stadium.”

…

Now a member of the Hamilton Tiger-Cats, Lawler said he didn’t receive a contract offer from the Bombers until a day before free agency opened at the start of February. His agent only had two brief conversations with Winnipeg, where the club was more focused on gauging the market value for a receiver of his calibre.

For Lawler, there was a more personal issue that needed to be addressed.

The two-time division all-star from Pomona, Calif. — who moved his family up to Winnipeg — had been doing some work on the side helping the city’s grassroots football scene before running into a roadblock.

“It’s not that (the Bombers) didn’t want me to do it — they wanted me to do it under them. They closed my work permit,” Lawler explained.

“I have my own business where I go and run camps and I was starting to do that and was getting momentum and when I had to get my work permit closed it was like, ‘hmm, why is this happening?’ You know what I want to do, I live here in Winnipeg, the full year, and if I am going to be taking a pay cut, which I was doing when I was in Winnipeg the whole time, I’m going to need something else to be able to supplement that. It’s not that I need it, it’s that I want to be able to start it so when I’m done with football I can still live where I’m at and transition right into something else and someone wasn’t seeing that.”

When asked who, specifically, wasn’t on board, Lawler responded with: “I think that’s a question you might have to ask them. And it probably wouldn’t be to anyone that you could probably get an (interview from).”

 

[SpeedFlex27]

22 minutes ago, JohnnyAbonny said:

It’s a pretty long article but it basically says he felt disrespected by Bomber management. 

“For the star receiver, it boiled down to one main thing: disrespect.

“Y’all signed Dillon Mitchell before me. Who wouldn’t (feel disrespected)?” Lawler shared with the Free Press on Thursday in a one-on-one chat inside Hamilton Stadium.”

…

 

Now a member of the Hamilton Tiger-Cats, Lawler said he didn’t receive a contract offer from the Bombers until a day before free agency opened at the start of February. His agent only had two brief conversations with Winnipeg, where the club was more focused on gauging the market value for a receiver of his calibre.

For Lawler, there was a more personal issue that needed to be addressed.

The two-time division all-star from Pomona, Calif. — who moved his family up to Winnipeg — had been doing some work on the side helping the city’s grassroots football scene before running into a roadblock.

“It’s not that (the Bombers) didn’t want me to do it — they wanted me to do it under them. They closed my work permit,” Lawler explained.

“I have my own business where I go and run camps and I was starting to do that and was getting momentum and when I had to get my work permit closed it was like, ‘hmm, why is this happening?’ You know what I want to do, I live here in Winnipeg, the full year, and if I am going to be taking a pay cut, which I was doing when I was in Winnipeg the whole time, I’m going to need something else to be able to supplement that. It’s not that I need it, it’s that I want to be able to start it so when I’m done with football I can still live where I’m at and transition right into something else and someone wasn’t seeing that.”

When asked who, specifically, wasn’t on board, Lawler responded with: “I think that’s a question you might have to ask them. And it probably wouldn’t be to anyone that you could probably get an (interview from).”

 

There's a definite pattern here as Lawler isn't the first player at free agency to feel that way.

Edited 15 hours ago by SpeedFlex27

[SpeedFlex27]

Thanks for the article, Johnny Abony. 

[Deiter Fan]

13 hours ago, Booch said:

And the "yeah but" crowd just kept ya buttin'

At a time like this I'm reminded of the many times the team won a close game and you or someone else pointed out flaws and people would chastise you/them for not just being happy with the win and how "good teams find ways to win close games"...when...in point of fact...good teams are constantly analyzing, adjusting, critiquing and improving so there aren't so many close games.

Edited 14 hours ago by Deiter Fan

[17to85]

9 hours ago, Mark H. said:

This wouldn't matter so much if they had more support and rotation.

Exactly my point. Expecting old players to play that much is just a bad idea.

[Booch]

11 hours ago, 17to85 said:

And last years defense was much much better than this years...

Adams hit a wall a bit but if allowed to work through it woulda been fine I bet...Woods was real good all yr when he got to play

Adams thus yr as well....our most consistent interior guy and was rostered during our better defensive performances as well....made plays...allowed some space for the ends

[Booch]

11 hours ago, wbbfan said:

we are rolling 6 dl with 3 canadians. every other team is rolling 8+ with 6 or more imps, except for one team with a very good canadian pass rusher. 

We are the only team under rostering dl, and filling half the spots with fringe roster guys. 

truth. a couple people on here are soo lost in cognitive dissonance from their unwavering faith in the mafia doing no wrong and the fact we have been at best a fringe play off team for two years, outside of the insanely flukey stretch streak last year. 

 

One of our 6 being a limebacker with zro experience there...and only getting on on short yardage to basically account for offense's spreading opit the oline

 

9 hours ago, Mark H. said:

This wouldn't matter so much if they had more support and rotation.

our vet ends would be fine with actual consistent rotation with Person, and with 2 other guys on the dline that cause problems and are active and possess yech skill ...and younger

Thomas has none of that now...and is so easy to defend...straight forward push...no hand skills so teams just wash him left...wash him right...spin him aroind or just engage him one on one and let him push forward, and they run plays past him...cant get off...no backside pursuit

Dline works in tandem and a weak link...let alone 2 really hampers the others and what you wanna do

7 hours ago, JohnnyAbonny said:

It’s a pretty long article but it basically says he felt disrespected by Bomber management. 

“For the star receiver, it boiled down to one main thing: disrespect.

“Y’all signed Dillon Mitchell before me. Who wouldn’t (feel disrespected)?” Lawler shared with the Free Press on Thursday in a one-on-one chat inside Hamilton Stadium.”

…

 

Now a member of the Hamilton Tiger-Cats, Lawler said he didn’t receive a contract offer from the Bombers until a day before free agency opened at the start of February. His agent only had two brief conversations with Winnipeg, where the club was more focused on gauging the market value for a receiver of his calibre.

For Lawler, there was a more personal issue that needed to be addressed.

The two-time division all-star from Pomona, Calif. — who moved his family up to Winnipeg — had been doing some work on the side helping the city’s grassroots football scene before running into a roadblock.

“It’s not that (the Bombers) didn’t want me to do it — they wanted me to do it under them. They closed my work permit,” Lawler explained.

“I have my own business where I go and run camps and I was starting to do that and was getting momentum and when I had to get my work permit closed it was like, ‘hmm, why is this happening?’ You know what I want to do, I live here in Winnipeg, the full year, and if I am going to be taking a pay cut, which I was doing when I was in Winnipeg the whole time, I’m going to need something else to be able to supplement that. It’s not that I need it, it’s that I want to be able to start it so when I’m done with football I can still live where I’m at and transition right into something else and someone wasn’t seeing that.”

When asked who, specifically, wasn’t on board, Lawler responded with: “I think that’s a question you might have to ask them. And it probably wouldn’t be to anyone that you could probably get an (interview from).”

 

I had mentioned several times here that Lawler would have stayed...at a reasonable cost, and wanted to...but all wasnt as it seemed here as this perfect regime....people called me out...said I was full of it 

But there ya go.....I have convo/contact with many aspects of team and players that media don't and know a lot more than what they feed fans

It's not the love fest many like to believe andd there is a lot of frustration on many levels but you wont hear it in media

[wbbfan]

9 hours ago, Mark H. said:

This wouldn't matter so much if they had more support and rotation.

or if half of them happened to be pro football level athletes at any point before they turned 30. 

 

9 hours ago, bb1 said:

No...just no. MOS believes his way( focus on special teams) 9 Cdn because of the flexibility if one gets hurt...that's what he believes..is it right with the talent level we have with CDN players? I will leave that up to a professional coach who has brought us 2 cups and to how many Grey cup games?  I don't always say he is right but i believe he has the right for at least one season to show us he ain't wrong, despite what informed posters on here say...i want the Blue to win as much as anyone but to suggest MOS can't coach or assess talent...would you guys say Dickenson couldn't coach the last 2 years before this one? 

 

First, it’s not flexibility. when you don’t take those canadians off and use the extras to get better players on at strategic points and times, it’s just wasted excess. 

Second, it’s not injury insurance, that’s what quality canadian depth is. starting extra guys who are fringe players doesn’t make you less susceptible to injury because you don’t have the back up imps to replace if the canadians go down. 

won the last gc 4 years ago. that doesn’t buy a coach an eternity of mistakes. neither does pissing away 3 championship games to bad coaching. 

Thing is, you require less canadians now than we did when he came up with this due to nat canadian role. so not only are we over the min, we are massively over it. 

Meanwhile our 2/4 2/3 canadian dl is our biggest weak spot. 

It’s been more than a year. with his pissing away 3 gc games, 2 that should’ve been easy wins, and then last year only being salvaged by a ridiculous lucky streak at the end of the year, and this year, he’s had tons of rope. 

Thing is, these are the same problems mos had before 19. he hasn’t improved at all. His roster management isn’t even debatable at this point. 

[Mark H.]

I mostly agree with the above points. But based on the way Arbuckle has played this year, and the shutdown D and solids STs that the Argos had last year, last year's GC was not the gimme that many believed it was 

[wbbfan]

if kenny lawler thinks his last contract here was playing at a discount, he’s lost the plot. he was making 285k+ 

 Also, for a guy who crapped the bed with his own pass port status and missed a big chunk of a year, and missed them with a dui incident, he doesn’t get to complain about his work status with us. 

I love the guys talent, but he’s tough to listen to at times. 

He is right though, that the bombers did a piss poor job of trying to retain him, as we’ve often done in free agency the last several years. Seriously, has taman been face off’d with walters or some thing? 

[wbbfan]

19 minutes ago, Mark H. said:

I mostly agree with the above points. But based on the way Arbuckle has played this year, and the shutdown D and solids STs that the Argos had last year, last year's GC was not the gimme that many believed it was 

I get what you're saying and I don't entirely disagree. Though in a championship game, a back up qb should not beat you. Also, I don't think Arbuckle was the guy last year he is his year. I'm also not entirely sure how much of his performance is putting up stats on a bad team.

MTL was really well coached as well as toronto, If we didn't spot each of the last 3 GC competitors with significant roster advantages, we could've won all of em. especially if our prep, execution, and game plans were on par with what we played against.  

[bigg jay]

8 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Can someone summarize the story in today's Free Press as to why Ken Lawler left the Bombers? There's a paywall so I can't read the story. 

• Disrespected because instead of trying to re-sign him, they went after Mitchell first. 
• Didn't even receive an offer until the day before FA opened.  His agent only had 2 brief conversations with them during the off-season.  They wanted to let the market determine his value rather than coming to an early agreement, 
• Bombers shut down his side business working in grassroots football in the city.  Said it wasn't that they didn't want him doing it but they wanted it to be under their organization so his work permit got cancelled.

[Goalie]

10 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Can someone summarize the story in today's Free Press as to why Ken Lawler left the Bombers? There's a paywall so I can't read the story. 

He wanted more money. Bombers were like nope. This is what we offering. Hamilton said ok we will give you what you want Kenny and now Kenny is a ticat. Pretty much. And the minute you turn heel and leave your current team, you then talk **** about them but ignore your dui and other off field issues. I mean classic pro wrestling heel turn. 

Edited 5 hours ago by Goalie

[GCn20]

15 hours ago, wbbfan said:

we are starting 9 canadians. we could go down plus use the naturalized rule. 

We also have ayers who doesn’t play D and isn’t a DL, and we have 3 back up imp dbs. wouldn’t be hard to rebalance the line to stick in a couple more imps even into the starting line up. 

!00% agree on the bolded. It wont make much of a difference because Streveler is a below average QB and the guys we would play instead are ham and eggers, but your point is 100% valid. Play the strongest lineup you can. This would at least expose Walters awful GMing.

[17to85]

1 hour ago, GCn20 said:

!00% agree on the bolded. It wont make much of a difference because Streveler is a below average QB and the guys we would play instead are ham and eggers, but your point is 100% valid. Play the strongest lineup you can. This would at least expose Walters awful GMing.

Just so we are clear here.... you're saying they're not playing the strongest lineup they can?

[GCn20]

9 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

Just so we are clear here.... you're saying they're not playing the strongest lineup they can?

I've never stated otherwise. I have always said that MOS's roster use is not up to snuff and the fact we don't use the naturalized import is a head scratcher. Where we differ is how much of a difference it would make. I don't believe for one second we have the overall talent to do any better than what we've done so far. With Collaros out I don't expect to win more than a couple more games this year.

Edited 2 hours ago by GCn20

[17to85]

Just now, GCn20 said:

I've never stated otherwise.

so then what the **** are you arguing about all the damn time? 

[GCn20]

8 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

so then what the **** are you arguing about all the damn time? 

I'm arguing about the impact roster usage has in our over all ability to win. You guys seem to think it makes a big impact and I don't think it would. I don't think that replacing Thomas for Woods or dressing another DL for Ayers would make a lick of difference. It is head scratching for sure, our roster usage, until I look at how poor our depth is. My biggest beef with the last 3 years on this forum is how myopic it has become. We have spent 20000 posts talking about roster slots 51 thru 53 and about 100 posts talking about the massive talent drain that's been going on. The lack of talent retention is 95% of what our biggest problem is right now and all you guys want to key in on is how we are not putting in scrubs to replace scrubs. Lets talk about how a Joey Corcoran makes our team and plays actual games because our receiving corps is hot garbage, let's talk about how our OL went from dominant to the worst in the CFL. let's talk about Chris Streveler now being our starting QB and the guy is not a CFL calibre starter. These are the reasons we will not win going forward. MOS has flaws but he has clearly demonstrated an ability to win if you give him players. Walters has not done that.

Edited 2 hours ago by GCn20

[17to85]

so you just hand wave away the fact that the coach isn't using the pieces he has to the best of his ability... to what end? when you start trouble shooting things you don't ignore problems to look for bigger ones. You start by addressing the obvious ones and seeing what that resolves. first problem: put the best roster on the field and see where you are actually at and then you can properly address the other issues. 

your way is just back asswards.

[Goalie]

I’d agree that Walters should probably be taking more heat than O’Shea. I think part of it is O’Shea is actually doing daily interviews and Walters has said nothing since free agency. Osh is In the spotlight. Kyle be very very very quiet. 

Edited 2 hours ago by Goalie