Stamps at Bombers early chat

[17to85]

I also maintain that with better quarterbacking we might see more from receivers. I dunno but we really didn't see many people really bitching about the receivers after game 1.

Just seems there's a real disconnect between what the team is bringing in vs. what works with collaros, yet they are so committed to collaros. I dunno feels like there's a turning point coming soon in terms of how things are being done.

[Booch]

39 minutes ago, wbbfan said:

Vanterpool at T is a big one for sure. He took a big step forward this year, he needs to end up a T to stick though, and boy with age are we in need of the next guy up. 
 
 

 

I don’t think it’s mental stuff, he hasn’t been moving well. I think it’s physical issues. Yeah I think the knee is not where it needs to be. 
 If he can get it to where he needs to be to start easing back in this year then that’s great. But given the time lost and snaps on a banged up body I’m not optimistic. 
 If he’s on the 6, with 6 weeks in, I don’t think we have much chance of him being 100% healthy and back up to conditioning levels this year. Some chance sure, but not a lot. 
 

id love for us to do that, maybe vanterpool at T will help with run blocking. That should be the plan, but Calgary will be ready for the run too. 

Yeah...originally I don't think the mental stuff was there...it will be now tho mind you I have a feeling he won't be seen until labor dayish now

You can come back like he did but sometimes even tho "healed" it takes a good year once back to playing to get full range of motion...lose the tight feeling...build the neighboring muscles and stuff up...and was obvious he wasn't there 

Id be shocked to see him resemble what he was pre injury this yr...he may be done for yr even...which makes it more imperative that they gave Mitchell the shot now as he showed he can be a game breaker...we know what Case is...Sterns with lighter skin..less experience and likely less upside...parking his arse on the PR for a few more weeks would have made zero difference for his development...Mitchell needs the chance to show what he has...or we cut bait and bring some guys in

[HardCoreBlue]

11 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

I also maintain that with better quarterbacking we might see more from receivers. I dunno but we really didn't see many people really bitching about the receivers after game 1.

Just seems there's a real disconnect between what the team is bringing in vs. what works with collaros, yet they are so committed to collaros. I dunno feels like there's a turning point coming soon in terms of how things are being done.

Yup I think you're onto something here.

Right now with what we got we need to control the line of scrimmage, establish the run to open up the playbook, give ZC that extra steamboat to minimize him forcing it to Demski and minimizing him lobbing it up for hopes and prayers.

[Booch]

11 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

I also maintain that with better quarterbacking we might see more from receivers. I dunno but we really didn't see many people really bitching about the receivers after game 1.

Just seems there's a real disconnect between what the team is bringing in vs. what works with collaros, yet they are so committed to collaros. I dunno feels like there's a turning point coming soon in terms of how things are being done.

ZC needs game breakers and guys who can win battles and have big catch radius now...we have Clercius who is dependable and can battle...Demski who can be a game breaker when not beat up and having to win contested catches in traffic...and wheatfall who can be real effective...with help...hes still leaning and with the other crap we have..sterns and now Case...he not gonna get a lot of help...nor are those 2 guys gonna elevate ZC game

But a Geno Lewis...Rhymes...Coxie..Dunbar...to name a few would have gave us and ZC a target he could utilize and make us better than scrap heaping White and Sterns...and just not using Mitchel for whatever reason they have...some guys just don't shine unless yhe lights are on...and we are the worst organization in league with giving fresh blood chances...and it's killing us

[ShyGuy]

12 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

I also maintain that with better quarterbacking we might see more from receivers. I dunno but we really didn't see many people really bitching about the receivers after game 1.

Just seems there's a real disconnect between what the team is bringing in vs. what works with collaros, yet they are so committed to collaros. I dunno feels like there's a turning point coming soon in terms of how things are being done.

Looking at the stats, Collaros is throwing it a bit deeper per attempt (9.4 depth yards vs 8.5 depth yards) but Streveler was way more successful on passes 20+ deep at a similar pace... against BC he was 4/5 whereas in Collaros' 3 games he has been 5/16 and has 2 picks.

Kind of points to the fact that Collaros really doesn't have much going on those deep passes... the only QBs worse than Collaros percentage wise are Masoli (known to be cooked) and Shiltz and Crum... anyone clamoring for the good old days the actual started closest to Collaros is Brown at 37.5% (6/17)... there must be something in the water in Ottawa because all those QBs are terrible deep. Oh and I guess MBT is 0-9(!!!!!)

[Booch]

1 minute ago, ShyGuy said:

Looking at the stats, Collaros is throwing it a bit deeper per attempt (9.4 depth yards vs 8.5 depth yards) but Streveler was way more successful on passes 20+ deep at a similar pace... against BC he was 4/5 whereas in Collaros' 3 games he has been 5/16 and has 2 picks.

Kind of points to the fact that Collaros really doesn't have much going on those deep passes... the only QBs worse than Collaros percentage wise are Masoli (known to be cooked) and Shiltz and Crum... anyone clamoring for the good old days the actual started closest to Collaros is Brown at 37.5% (6/17)... there must be something in the water in Ottawa because all those QBs are terrible deep. Oh and I guess MBT is 0-9(!!!!!)

Strev can so get ball out lightning fast and run tempo...ZC can't no more

[HardCoreBlue]

1 minute ago, Booch said:

Strev can so get ball out lightning fast and run tempo...ZC can't no more

I know he needs more reps but I'm just curious to get a better understanding on how much growth is still there with Strev until we know he has hit his limit and what you see is what you get with him.

 

[17to85]

26 minutes ago, HardCoreBlue said:

I know he needs more reps but I'm just curious to get a better understanding on how much growth is still there with Strev until we know he has hit his limit and what you see is what you get with him.

 

Well he's probably pretty much there anyway... which based on game 1 ain't so bad....

[bearpants]

Mitchell still not making the active roster is concerning... did they not evaluate his skills and abilities at all... or did they assume he would beat out Wheatfall for that spot??

I'm happy Person is finally getting a shot.... hopefully he'll get a bunch of snaps and make an impact... still concerned we haven't seen J Jones yet... seemed like a solid addition and we have refused to use him... Kyrie Wilson is still great when healthy and of course he manages to stay healthy when there are as good (or better) and much younger options on the squad...  

[Brandon]

I don't really think we have that major of an issue at receiver.   Wheatfall has shown he can make the big plays ,  Demski has shown he can do what he's always does,  Clercius is physical and an improvement over previous NI,  and as much as people hate on Sterns he has made 13 receptions on 16 targets and isn't dropping balls or doing anything bad at all.  

From my non coach eyes the issues on our passing game has come to careless deep balls that are more 40/60 then 50/50 balls where Zach is tossing it into double or triple coverage forcing our receiver to either make an insane catch or at least fight the defender to knock the ball away.   In the before time it seemed like he would be doing this in one on one battles where a guy like Schoen/Lawler who are above average can win these battles on a regular basis.  I don't mind them going deep when needed... but in a close game with plenty of time left I don't understand the hope and a prayer deep bomb.   

 

[Fatty Liver]

Just now, voodoochylde said:

Lawler is what he is - his game hasn't changed.  What has changed is he has a QB (and an offense) that can feed him the ball.

Make note, Hamilton still doesn't make effective use of their running game, they may look like the "Belle of the Ball" during the summer with BLM filling the air with footballs, but their magic likely fades away in the fall when his fingers turn to ice. 

[3rdand1.5]

Lawler is really good, but he has not been durable.......

[Fatty Liver]

Just now, rebusrankin said:

I like the addition of Person and hope he gets a decent number of reps.

Case-Not excited at all. Our WR recruitment was a complete bust this year.

Looks like Case has some pretty decent skills, all depends whether the QB can get the ball to him or not.  Holm says he's the 2nd fastest player on the team next to himself.

 

[do or die]

Why is Mitchell still around, then?  To pull pranks at practice?

 

[rebusrankin]

8 minutes ago, Fatty Liver said:

Looks like Case has some pretty decent skills, all depends whether the QB can get the ball to him or not.  Holm says he's the 2nd fastest player on the team next to himself.

 

1. Every player in the CFL has a highlight reel like this.

2. He failed to make a catch during his one year in the Big Ten.

3. He did little in his three games last year.

4. He did little in either pre season this year or last.

5. Its not even like he was standing out in camp this year. The guys we kept hearing about during camp were Wheatfall and Myron Mitchell who we cut.

So add all that together and I see little reason to be excited by Case or to expect that he is going to step up and be this big weapon for us.

[GCn20]

4 hours ago, wbbfan said:

I’m not gonna write off schoen for life. I think he can still be a very effective player, when he’s 100%. 
 We are close to the half way point and he’s injured, and was a fraction of his former self to start the year. As such, I am basically writing off any expectations for him this year. I think we are a couple weeks away from the point where he should be shut down for the year so we can get what ever best he has left for next year and going forward. 
 

Yeah it’s been a lot of whiffs and not finding any in league gems. And that’s a huge part of success in the cfl. Previously, we did great at finding guys off other teams scrap heaps who were amazing. 

It’s a good point that we regretted letting Lawler walk then paid him then refused to continue paying him that sum. He did have two stupid off field mistakes, but you can’t think those would repeat. 

You’re right, that he’s mos’ boss and he should be reining him in and off setting his weaknesses. He has to be ultimately accountable for failing to develop mos further the last few years too. 

At the end of the day the GM is the guy who offers the contracts. The fact that Jake Thomas or other long in the tooth guys are still here is 100% on Walters. I could give a crap if MOS wants these guys, sometimes as GM you gotta save a coach from himself. I look at his body of work over the past 3 years and I see a big fat F grade for Walters. Our depth is suspect, our OL and DL are average at best, and our NAT content is deteriorated compared to when we were the envy of the league. That's on the GM. I'm not trying to give MOS an out with these comments either, he needs to be better. 

Edited 4 hours ago by GCn20

[Fatty Liver]

Just now, rebusrankin said:

1. Every player in the CFL has a highlight reel like this.

2. He failed to make a catch during his one year in the Big Ten.

3. He did little in his three games last year.

4. He did little in either pre season this year or last.

5. Its not even like he was standing out in camp this year. The guys we kept hearing about during camp were Wheatfall and Myron Mitchell who we cut.

So add all that together and I see little reason to be excited by Case or to expect that he is going to step up and be this big weapon for us.

Why waste energy pre-judging, wait and see what he does, he made the team for a reason.

[blue85gold]

31 minutes ago, do or die said:

Why is Mitchell still around, then?  To pull pranks at practice?

 

For when Wheatfall gets hurt.

[GCn20]

2 hours ago, Booch said:

Yeah...originally I don't think the mental stuff was there...it will be now tho mind you I have a feeling he won't be seen until labor dayish now

You can come back like he did but sometimes even tho "healed" it takes a good year once back to playing to get full range of motion...lose the tight feeling...build the neighboring muscles and stuff up...and was obvious he wasn't there 

Id be shocked to see him resemble what he was pre injury this yr...he may be done for yr even...which makes it more imperative that they gave Mitchell the shot now as he showed he can be a game breaker...we know what Case is...Sterns with lighter skin..less experience and likely less upside...parking his arse on the PR for a few more weeks would have made zero difference for his development...Mitchell needs the chance to show what he has...or we cut bait and bring some guys in

We absolutely need to bring some guys in at receiver. Our receiving corps is sub par.

[rebusrankin]

14 minutes ago, Fatty Liver said:

Why waste energy pre-judging, wait and see what he does, he made the team for a reason.

So did such underperformers as Josh Johnson. If I'm wrong, I'll admit it but right now I stand by my feeling that he's not a quality CFL receiver. 

[GCn20]

2 minutes ago, rebusrankin said:

So did such underperformers as Josh Johnson. If I'm wrong, I'll admit it but right now I stand by my feeling that he's not a quality CFL receiver. 

I'm willing to give him a chance, but I am not particularly optimistic. 

[Fatty Liver]

Just now, rebusrankin said:

So did such underperformers as Josh Johnson. If I'm wrong, I'll admit it but right now I stand by my feeling that he's not a quality CFL receiver. 

Zach provides his opinion on Case and Stearns.

 

[17to85]

46 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

Our depth is suspect, our OL and DL are average at best, an

I actually think the depth is OK, it's just how the roster is built that makes is seem bad. OL I think is OK and DL again is more how the roster is put together more than anything else.

[Bigblue204]

52 minutes ago, Fatty Liver said:

Why waste energy pre-judging, wait and see what he does, he made the team for a reason.

He made it last year as well....and in his opportunities when they needed a rec to step up in a big way...he didn't.

[JuranBoldenRules]

1 hour ago, Bigblue204 said:

He made it last year as well....and in his opportunities when they needed a rec to step up in a big way...he didn't.

He played under 30 snaps at receiver last year.  He was targeted twice.  He was on as returner.  Most reps in Toronto the game when they got stuffed on 3rd and short in range to kick winning FG.

He's 5'10 with giant hands.  Mitchell is 6'1 and has 1/4 inch smaller hands.  Better 40, better shuttle, better bench.

You watch how South Dakota used him, all levels, but especially for vertical shots.  Lined up all over, see him winning on every single type of route.  Everything on Case is about how he competes.  Everything on Mitchell says "lacks focus, discipline, doesn't play fast, concern with maturity level, too many focus drops, non-factor as a blocker."

We need some reliability honestly.  Demski can't be the go to guy.  Be nice to see Wheatfall step up, and given the opportunity to get more touches at all levels.  Clercius is what he is.  If he's getting double digit targets we're probably ******.  Nice release valve, 5th target.  Get some YAC, screen game going along with the vertical shots.  Everyone going to sit on the vertical stuff until we beat zone.