Run Based O?

[AtlanticRiderFan]

 

 

Does anyone have a truck full of cow manure and Marcel Bellefeuille's home address? No reason in particular, just wondering...

 

Really pissed off at my coaching too. I want to borrow the truck too.

 

In the meantime, I'll trade you Brohm for Sunseri straight up.

 

 

Deal.

[Brandon]

Sunseri is probably only a smidge better then Brohm.

[Fatty Liver]

My question is to all the "put Marve in" backers - who were screaming for MOS's head for not playing Marve, are you willing to admit he was right?

I think the Bombers have slowly realized how flunked they are at QB...hence the bringing in of those two QBs on the roster.

Marve, right now, is no more than a long shot...as a third stringer. Elevate Davis and eliminate Brohm.

It's the only move we have right now. We have to beat Saskatchewan and I don't care if they have to bring back Yantz to do it.

Don't give Brohm any more reps...cut him, give the reps to Davis.

 

If this is true, why in the hell couldn't the 6-8 highly paid professional "mutton heads" in the war room come to this conclusion in the off-season?  The QB lineup they presented at training camp was an absolute sham as they put all of their chips down on the new and improved O-Line being able to protect their golden Willy all the way to the Grey Cup game and left nothing in the basket for "Plan-B" from outer space.

[Guest J5V]

Sunseri is probably only a smidge better then Brohm.

It's a win-win deal. Sunseri has the arm to throw the ball deep and zip the shorter passes for us and the Riders can use Brohm to clean up the gophers Sask is famous for. 

[Mr Dee]

 If this is true, why in the hell couldn't the 6-8 highly paid professional "mutton heads" in the war room come to this conclusion in the off-season?  The QB lineup they presented at training camp was an absolute sham as they put all of their chips down on the new and improved O-Line being able to protect their golden Willy all the way to the Grey Cup game and left nothing in the basket for "Plan-B" from outer space.

I do not know why ALL the old group was brought back. Surely to hell, they could have foreseen Portis was too far off...as he had been around already. Marve was intriguing I guess, and Brohm? Well I suppose they thought he was the safety net.

EVERYBODY, it seems, in the last ten years, or so, can't find a guy, who knows a guy, that can get us a friggin' Quarterback. That should have been the #1 priority in the last off season...not believing that they were safe because they had 4 guys signed already.

The biggest failure in recruiting. We're paying the price for shortsightedness...and I'm not talking about Bellefeuille's height.

[AtlanticRiderFan]

Sunseri is probably only a smidge better then Brohm.

 

I don't think he is better than Brohm.

[iso_55]

I don't know if Marve will ever be a starter in this league but do you not think we might be giving up on him a little too soon? 

 

Wasn't he something like 11/12 at the half?  At least that's what I thought I saw on TSN.    

For what, 62 yards? That's Justin Goltz bad. 

[Atomic]

 

I don't know if Marve will ever be a starter in this league but do you not think we might be giving up on him a little too soon? 

 

Wasn't he something like 11/12 at the half?  At least that's what I thought I saw on TSN.    

For what, 62 yards? That's Justin Goltz bad. 

 

 

His numbers looked just like Justin Goltz's actually

[SPuDS]

Now im not defending marve OR bellfool but you guys DO realize it takes any QB a few games or weeks to acclimate to being a starter right? This isnt madden 2015.. You cant just expect a QB to step in and be lights out every game. Hes going to struggle..nthose struggles are going to be made worse by a sub par supporting cast..

Also, you have to assume bellfool is keeping things simple by design to ease marve (and goose) into a simple rthym. I know its crap and i know its painful to witness but it is what it is... I honestly dont know if a "top tier" OC would look good or make the offense look good.. Theres just so much youth and inexperience on this squad.

[Brandon]

Now im not defending marve OR bellfool but you guys DO realize it takes any QB a few games or weeks to acclimate to being a starter right? This isnt madden 2015.. You cant just expect a QB to step in and be lights out every game. Hes going to struggle..nthose struggles are going to be made worse by a sub par supporting cast..

Also, you have to assume bellfool is keeping things simple by design to ease marve (and goose) into a simple rthym. I know its crap and i know its painful to witness but it is what it is... I honestly dont know if a "top tier" OC would look good or make the offense look good.. Theres just so much youth and inexperience on this squad.

 

Hard to accept when Franklin tosses 300+ yards,  Cato moves the ball efficiently,   Smith (despite the yank yesterday) walks in and can move the ball down field....

 

Why is it that our QB's need to be babied and need a dozen games to gel?   I'm not expecting Madden like numbers but at least move the ball and make the mistakes while doing so (I.E. Joey Elliott).   When it's two and outs and balls missing easy targets that's just not acceptable. 

[pigseye]

Doug Brown stated on the post game last night that Winnipeg needs to switch to a run heavy offense. Makes sense. So MB's refusal to do so is that

1. An inability to design such an offense?

2. An OL that can't run block?

3. Pitiful Running Backs?

4. All of the above

 

This is what is puzzling because the Bombers have shown that when they involve their RB's heavily in the offense they win, at least have won this season.

 

First Win

 

27 touches, 20/145 rushing 7/92 receiving

 

Second Win

 

20 touches, 16/44 rushing 4/49 passing

 

Third Win

 

17 touches. 15/59 rushing 2/27 passing

 

What is happening though is that the number of touches have been steadily decreasing to the point of the backs being taken out of the game. If you can't get your RB involved on the ground and in the air then most times you will lose, like the Bombers have been. This team can run the ball and use the backs as effective receivers as we seen early on, they have just gone away from it more and more. Marcel needs to wake up and get back to what worked early in the year or he needs to be removed in favor of someone who can.

[Guest J5V]

 

Doug Brown stated on the post game last night that Winnipeg needs to switch to a run heavy offense. Makes sense. So MB's refusal to do so is that

1. An inability to design such an offense?

2. An OL that can't run block?

3. Pitiful Running Backs?

4. All of the above

 

This is what is puzzling because the Bombers have shown that when they involve their RB's heavily in the offense they win, at least have won this season.

 

First Win

 

27 touches, 20/145 rushing 7/92 receiving

 

Second Win

 

20 touches, 16/44 rushing 4/49 passing

 

Third Win

 

17 touches. 15/59 rushing 2/27 passing

 

What is happening though is that the number of touches have been steadily decreasing to the point of the backs being taken out of the game. If you can't get your RB involved on the ground and in the air then most times you will lose, like the Bombers have been. This team can run the ball and use the backs as effective receivers as we seen early on, they have just gone away from it more and more. Marcel needs to wake up and get back to what worked early in the year or he needs to be removed in favor of someone who can.

 

Early in the season Willy was healthy and teams had to respect his arm. Now they don't worry about that and focus on stopping our run.

[pigseye]

 

 

Doug Brown stated on the post game last night that Winnipeg needs to switch to a run heavy offense. Makes sense. So MB's refusal to do so is that

1. An inability to design such an offense?

2. An OL that can't run block?

3. Pitiful Running Backs?

4. All of the above

 

This is what is puzzling because the Bombers have shown that when they involve their RB's heavily in the offense they win, at least have won this season.

 

First Win

 

27 touches, 20/145 rushing 7/92 receiving

 

Second Win

 

20 touches, 16/44 rushing 4/49 passing

 

Third Win

 

17 touches. 15/59 rushing 2/27 passing

 

What is happening though is that the number of touches have been steadily decreasing to the point of the backs being taken out of the game. If you can't get your RB involved on the ground and in the air then most times you will lose, like the Bombers have been. This team can run the ball and use the backs as effective receivers as we seen early on, they have just gone away from it more and more. Marcel needs to wake up and get back to what worked early in the year or he needs to be removed in favor of someone who can.

 

Early in the season Willy was healthy and teams had to respect his arm. Now they don't worry about that and focus on stopping our run.

 

 

Nope, Willys numbers started to dip when teams started blitzing because they knew he tends to hold onto the ball too long. Had we stuck with a heavy of running backs, they would have had to back off, just piss poor game calling by Marcel.

[blitzmore]

 

 

Doug Brown stated on the post game last night that Winnipeg needs to switch to a run heavy offense. Makes sense. So MB's refusal to do so is that

1. An inability to design such an offense?

2. An OL that can't run block?

3. Pitiful Running Backs?

4. All of the above

 

This is what is puzzling because the Bombers have shown that when they involve their RB's heavily in the offense they win, at least have won this season.

 

First Win

 

27 touches, 20/145 rushing 7/92 receiving

 

Second Win

 

20 touches, 16/44 rushing 4/49 passing

 

Third Win

 

17 touches. 15/59 rushing 2/27 passing

 

What is happening though is that the number of touches have been steadily decreasing to the point of the backs being taken out of the game. If you can't get your RB involved on the ground and in the air then most times you will lose, like the Bombers have been. This team can run the ball and use the backs as effective receivers as we seen early on, they have just gone away from it more and more. Marcel needs to wake up and get back to what worked early in the year or he needs to be removed in favor of someone who can.

 

Early in the season Willy was healthy and teams had to respect his arm. Now they don't worry about that and focus on stopping our run.

 

If you give up a ton of points on special teams early...becomes very difficult to use an effective running game.

[17to85]

 

 

 

Doug Brown stated on the post game last night that Winnipeg needs to switch to a run heavy offense. Makes sense. So MB's refusal to do so is that

1. An inability to design such an offense?

2. An OL that can't run block?

3. Pitiful Running Backs?

4. All of the above

 

This is what is puzzling because the Bombers have shown that when they involve their RB's heavily in the offense they win, at least have won this season.

 

First Win

 

27 touches, 20/145 rushing 7/92 receiving

 

Second Win

 

20 touches, 16/44 rushing 4/49 passing

 

Third Win

 

17 touches. 15/59 rushing 2/27 passing

 

What is happening though is that the number of touches have been steadily decreasing to the point of the backs being taken out of the game. If you can't get your RB involved on the ground and in the air then most times you will lose, like the Bombers have been. This team can run the ball and use the backs as effective receivers as we seen early on, they have just gone away from it more and more. Marcel needs to wake up and get back to what worked early in the year or he needs to be removed in favor of someone who can.

 

Early in the season Willy was healthy and teams had to respect his arm. Now they don't worry about that and focus on stopping our run.

 

 

Nope, Willys numbers started to dip when teams started blitzing because they knew he tends to hold onto the ball too long. Had we stuck with a heavy of running backs, they would have had to back off, just piss poor game calling by Marcel.

 

Just like that huh? How about this: when the offense is clicking the runningbacks naturally get more touches, when the offence stagnates and bogs down they get less touches. This isn't rocket science. It's easy to give the backs lots of touches when you're leading or having success all around on offence, but when you're losing and your offence can't string first downs together they don't get that many opportunities. The OL is not consistent enough to just hand off all the time, that's a surefire way to find yourself in 2nd and long more than we already are. 

[pigseye]

 

 

 

 

Doug Brown stated on the post game last night that Winnipeg needs to switch to a run heavy offense. Makes sense. So MB's refusal to do so is that

1. An inability to design such an offense?

2. An OL that can't run block?

3. Pitiful Running Backs?

4. All of the above

 

This is what is puzzling because the Bombers have shown that when they involve their RB's heavily in the offense they win, at least have won this season.

 

First Win

 

27 touches, 20/145 rushing 7/92 receiving

 

Second Win

 

20 touches, 16/44 rushing 4/49 passing

 

Third Win

 

17 touches. 15/59 rushing 2/27 passing

 

What is happening though is that the number of touches have been steadily decreasing to the point of the backs being taken out of the game. If you can't get your RB involved on the ground and in the air then most times you will lose, like the Bombers have been. This team can run the ball and use the backs as effective receivers as we seen early on, they have just gone away from it more and more. Marcel needs to wake up and get back to what worked early in the year or he needs to be removed in favor of someone who can.

 

Early in the season Willy was healthy and teams had to respect his arm. Now they don't worry about that and focus on stopping our run.

 

 

Nope, Willys numbers started to dip when teams started blitzing because they knew he tends to hold onto the ball too long. Had we stuck with a heavy of running backs, they would have had to back off, just piss poor game calling by Marcel.

 

Just like that huh? How about this: when the offense is clicking the runningbacks naturally get more touches, when the offence stagnates and bogs down they get less touches. This isn't rocket science. It's easy to give the backs lots of touches when you're leading or having success all around on offence, but when you're losing and your offence can't string first downs together they don't get that many opportunities. The OL is not consistent enough to just hand off all the time, that's a surefire way to find yourself in 2nd and long more than we already are. 

 

 

You can involve your RB's in the passing game too, doesn't always have to be the read option hand off.

[17to85]

So you pass to them short and you're still in 2nd and long if the blocking isn't there. I don't know if you've noticed or not but our receivers aren't great at blocking downfield either. Other teams use screens and hitches much more effectively than we do and a big part of it is there's too often too many guys not being blocked by those downfield. 

[pigseye]

So you pass to them short and you're still in 2nd and long if the blocking isn't there. I don't know if you've noticed or not but our receivers aren't great at blocking downfield either. Other teams use screens and hitches much more effectively than we do and a big part of it is there's too often too many guys not being blocked by those downfield. 

 

I'm just pointing what worked in our 3 wins, not saying the offense doesn't have it warts, because it does.

But involving your RB's more, especially with a green qb, is never a bad idea.

[17to85]

 

So you pass to them short and you're still in 2nd and long if the blocking isn't there. I don't know if you've noticed or not but our receivers aren't great at blocking downfield either. Other teams use screens and hitches much more effectively than we do and a big part of it is there's too often too many guys not being blocked by those downfield. 

 

I'm just pointing what worked in our 3 wins, not saying the offense doesn't have it warts, because it does.

But involving your RB's more, especially with a green qb, is never a bad idea.

 

And I'm pointing out that correlation does not always equal causation. You say more touches for rbs means the offense work better, I'm saying that it's the offence working better that gives the runningbacks more touches. 

[Mr Dee]

Stop...you're both right. But it does involve actually knowing your opponent. Surely, there are weaknesses to be exploited in a team's run defence that we can attack right of the bat that would open up the run game. Did anybody expect Montreal to run their asses off against BC their last game? (and I do know about Montreal's O-line)

[pigseye]

Stop...you're both right. But it does involve actually knowing your opponent. Surely, there are weaknesses to be exploited in a team's run defence that we can attack right of the bat that would open up the run game. Did anybody expect Montreal to run their asses off against BC their last game? (and I do know about Montreal's O-line)

 

Actually, there are no examples of the offense 'clicking' without involving the RB's so I don't think he has a case.

[Goalie]

Stop...you're both right. But it does involve actually knowing your opponent. Surely, there are weaknesses to be exploited in a team's run defence that we can attack right of the bat that would open up the run game. Did anybody expect Montreal to run their asses off against BC their last game? (and I do know about Montreal's O-line)

Actually, there are no examples of the offense 'clicking' without involving the RB's so I don't think he has a case.

Tell that to Hamilton who has no run game at all really.

[17to85]

 

Stop...you're both right. But it does involve actually knowing your opponent. Surely, there are weaknesses to be exploited in a team's run defence that we can attack right of the bat that would open up the run game. Did anybody expect Montreal to run their asses off against BC their last game? (and I do know about Montreal's O-line)

 

Actually, there are no examples of the offense 'clicking' without involving the RB's so I don't think he has a case.

 

Are there any examples of the offense clicking without the passing game working? You are still trying to argue that correlation = causation. 

[Goalie]

Yeah honestly, when your QB can't pass the ball, you are pretty screwed. BIG TIME.  You can't really run the ball until you at least have some threat of a passing game... really, if i was opposing D's and Marve is playing... I do what Calgary did, I basically just sit back, send very little pressure, make him throw the ball, i take away the run game, just like Calgary did early on and i make Marve try to beat me with his arm... It won't happen. 

 

Not sure how anyone can honestly defend a qb who can't throw accurately more than 5 or 6 yards. Not sure to be honest how anyone thinks thats acceptable even... glossing over the issue really, Marve isn't good. Yeah he's a rookie but... he's a rookie who can't even throw the ball. 

 

I'm not at the point of saying Marve should be cut or anything but.... honestly, it's close