2024/2025 CFL (non-Bomber) Off-Season Thread

[Brandon]

I always thought in any sports that "character vets"  were guys who rode the bench and did the motivation from a distance.   They weren't inserted into the starting line up and replacing a better player on the rise.    

[HardCoreBlue]

7 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

When I hear guys say "it's a business" in the sports world it is almost certainly about money. Do guys get cut for diminishing returns....yep....we axed a few this year alone. However, one would have to be without an iota of team building awareness to know that you don't axe every glue guy at one time. I know Booch hates the term, but it is as real as it can be. Talent alone does not dictate roster, and only a moron of a GM and HC would build there team based solely on on-field talent. Same as a businessman must balance the culture of his workplace, so too does a football team.

A happy team is a motivated team. A motivated team is a winning team. I get that from arm's length a lot of us don't understand the optics of some of our roster keeps but that is almost certainly because we don't have a good enough view. When a guy like JT is kept on the roster, there is more at play than what we see on the field. A player can have a very positive impact on a team overall and we will not know about it because the only aspect we see is on the field. If you think that professional athletes are different and that doesn't matter you are dreaming in technicolor. We have no idea what JT's impact is on morale for that team and more importantly what his absence would do to it. In a year we moved on from Bighill and Alexander at skill positions because their diminishing returns are far more weighted to on field than leadership, it is perfectly understandable that we would keep a Jake Thomas on the roster whose diminishing returns on the field are far more easily offset.

I don't know why you keep saying/writing this, no one is saying talent dictates everything. When it comes to a strong culture, everyone, from bottom up top down share a responsibility in building a strong culture with leadership leading the way. Anyone who knows anything about high performing organizations know this. Where we're getting into this debate is your use of the word balance. Finding that sweet spot is an art more than it is a science.

You're right, none of us here have the intimate view in our football team so all of us, including you, are speculating on why players like JT is still an active player on this team. That's what makes these types of conversations engaging with different viewpoints offered up. 

[Booch]

18 minutes ago, rebusrankin said:

The we don't have enough information or a good enough view is a load of crap imo. Coaches make mistakes too.

I have lotsa info...also lots of been there...you need a couple leaders with tenure for sure....but even a 1st or second yr guy actually at times can take that role too...be it speak...attitude or how he plays...players see it and replicate

We have Jefferson...Kramdi...Nichols...Holm...Wilson...Lawson...J.Jones...T.Jones..even Adams and Woods and Ayers who are no longer rookies and play the Bomber way...we have more than enough leaders and voices in the defensive room...aka...glue...which yeah I feelis a stupid term

18 minutes ago, HardCoreBlue said:

I don't know why you keep saying/writing this, no one is saying talent dictates everything. When it comes to a strong culture, everyone, from bottom up top down share a responsibility in building a strong culture with leadership leading the way. Anyone who knows anything about high performing organizations know this. Where we're getting into this debate is your use of the word balance. Finding that sweet spot is an art more than it is a science.

You're right, none of us here have the intimate view in our football team so all of us, including you, are speculating on why players like JT is still an active player on this team. That's what makes these types of conversations engaging with different viewpoints offered up. 

Our culture is there..set in stone...written on the walls of the players sanctuary...its how we do business now...its not gonna erode and yes TALENT should dictate roster now...the foundation is there....This notion that it will all go away with ejecting this vet...or that vet...or even the HC is just a load of crap....It permeated from and thru Wade...he re-ret the Bomber way...and it is what it is now unless we hire some Glieberman's...Jone's...Mike Kelly's...and sign a loser like Manziel or perv boy

[GCn20]

I am glad none of you are our HC or GM. Who by the way have forgotten more about building a sustainable winning football club than any of us will ever know. We can opine until the cows come home but the proof is in the pudding. Laughable that some guys think they know more than Walters and OShea about building a roster. Just the epitome of fan huberus. Can they make a mistake? Sure. Have their mistakes cost us much....not that I can see and don't give me the BS it cost us the last 3 Grey Cups because that is opinion not fact. A very jaded opinion driven by an agenda I might add.

Edited Wednesday at 04:47 PM by GCn20

[Booch]

5 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

I am glad none of you are our HC or GM. Who by the way have forgotten more about building a sustainable winning football club than any of us will ever know. We can opine until the cows come home but the proof is in the pudding. Laughable that some guys think they know more than Walters and OShea about building a roster. Just the epitome of fan huberus. Can they make a mistake? Sure. Have their mistakes cost us much....not that I can see and don't give me the BS it cost us the last 3 Grey Cups because that is opinion not fact. A very jaded opinion driven by an agenda I might add.

proper rostering and some changes to play calls should have us going for our 6th cup WIN in a row...there's that part

and just because guys are pro coaches and GM's doesnt mean they never do anything wrong...have flaws...and yeah....do the wrong thing...

[Fatty Liver]

1 hour ago, HardCoreBlue said:

I don't know why you keep saying/writing this, no one is saying talent dictates everything. When it comes to a strong culture, everyone, from bottom up top down share a responsibility in building a strong culture with leadership leading the way. Anyone who knows anything about high performing organizations know this. Where we're getting into this debate is your use of the word balance. Finding that sweet spot is an art more than it is a science.

You're right, none of us here have the intimate view in our football team so all of us, including you, are speculating on why players like JT is still an active player on this team. That's what makes these types of conversations engaging with different viewpoints offered up. 

Think of Jake Thomas as the lead-hand at the factory with a great work ethic.  He may not be the fastest or the most productive worker, but he shows up consistently everyday on time and works to the end of the day without excuse.  He puts in 100% effort, does his job and doesn't goof around, he takes on overtime or any other assignment with out fuss.  He's a throw-back, his work ethic is not commonly found among young people and he's a great example of hard work and perseverance.

[Booch]

I would hope they all put on 100% effort on my team....or be gone

[Mike]

1 hour ago, GCn20 said:

I am glad none of you are our HC or GM. Who by the way have forgotten more about building a sustainable winning football club than any of us will ever know. We can opine until the cows come home but the proof is in the pudding. Laughable that some guys think they know more than Walters and OShea about building a roster. Just the epitome of fan huberus. Can they make a mistake? Sure. Have their mistakes cost us much....not that I can see and don't give me the BS it cost us the last 3 Grey Cups because that is opinion not fact. A very jaded opinion driven by an agenda I might add.

I love this opinion, especially from someone who loves to throw out “and I did football clinics so trust me bro” whenever it suits their own agenda. 
 

Newsflash: Walters and O’Shea haven’t made decisions that resulted in a Grey Cup win for three seasons now. That means that their decisions, which are based off their own opinions not fact, are not infallible. 

[Booch]

12 minutes ago, Mike said:

I love this opinion, especially from someone who loves to throw out “and I did football clinics so trust me bro” whenever it suits their own agenda. 
 

Newsflash: Walters and O’Shea haven’t made decisions that resulted in a Grey Cup win for three seasons now. That means that their decisions, which are based off their own opinions not fact, are not infallible. 

O'd say it's more on Oshea tho...as we had guys to get it done...but went a different route...and in the end...it's the NC who signs off on the rosters with final say....and our roster and some lame in game decisons....sunk us....

[17to85]

41 minutes ago, Fatty Liver said:

Think of Jake Thomas as the lead-hand at the factory with a great work ethic.  He may not be the fastest or the most productive worker, but he shows up consistently everyday on time and works to the end of the day without excuse.  He puts in 100% effort, does his job and doesn't goof around, he takes on overtime or any other assignment with out fuss.  He's a throw-back, his work ethic is not commonly found among young people and he's a great example of hard work and perseverance.

Thomas is more like the old dude who's been there forever who is just running down the clock until retirement. The younger more productive people roll their eyes at how useless they are.

[Goalie]

Thomas is the Canadian who needs to be replaced by another Canadian and looking at the depth chart, our cdn depth with injuries to a few guys ain’t looking so good. So I don’t see the point in going on about the Canadian players when we don’t have better ones on the roster currently. Or practice roster. Perhaps a couple on IR. But until a hagerty or mackonzo are healthy, it is what it is. 

Edited Wednesday at 06:17 PM by Goalie

[Booch]

3 minutes ago, Goalie said:

Thomas is the Canadian who needs to be replaced by another Canadian and looking at the depth chart, our cdn depth with injuries to a few guys ain’t looking so good. So I don’t see the point in going on about the Canadian players when we don’t have better ones on the roster currently. Or practice roster. Perhaps a couple on IR. But until a hagerty or mackonzo are healthy, it is what it is. 

Cobb could easily took his roster spot...back-up returner with experience....Back-up receiver with experience....plays on cover teams...Lawson and Korndawg would been fine for interior guys...let JT be that glue on sideline...watching the game and seeing what his 25 yrs of experience can garner for insight tothe younger guys

[HardCoreBlue]

58 minutes ago, Fatty Liver said:

Think of Jake Thomas as the lead-hand at the factory with a great work ethic.  He may not be the fastest or the most productive worker, but he shows up consistently everyday on time and works to the end of the day without excuse.  He puts in 100% effort, does his job and doesn't goof around, he takes on overtime or any other assignment with out fuss.  He's a throw-back, his work ethic is not commonly found among young people and he's a great example of hard work and perseverance.

I'm trying correlate this analogy to how he contributes on and off the football field and what I've come up with is this analogy (probably) fits way better with his off field contributions than it does to his on-field contributions. It's a tough gig being a professional head coach I get it but when he is on the field providing no push up the middle taking snaps away from others do these off field contributions cancel that out?

Apparently MOS says yes, he's earned it.

 

[Goalie]

1 hour ago, Booch said:

Cobb could easily took his roster spot...back-up returner with experience....Back-up receiver with experience....plays on cover teams...Lawson and Korndawg would been fine for interior guys...let JT be that glue on sideline...watching the game and seeing what his 25 yrs of experience can garner for insight tothe younger guys

Cobb was injured was he not? Perhaps that plays a role. 

[Fatty Liver]

23 minutes ago, Goalie said:

Cobb was injured was he not? Perhaps that plays a role. 

I think he's recovered, they're giving Corcoran a chance to show he belongs, but I think they'll eventually switch places as Cobb has more versatility.

[wbbfan]

2 hours ago, Booch said:

Cobb could easily took his roster spot...back-up returner with experience....Back-up receiver with experience....plays on cover teams...Lawson and Korndawg would been fine for interior guys...let JT be that glue on sideline...watching the game and seeing what his 25 yrs of experience can garner for insight tothe younger guys

If you aren't going to carry a backup imp Wr, might as well carry 2 Canadians. especially if 1 has actual roster value. 

[Booch]

2 hours ago, Goalie said:

Cobb was injured was he not? Perhaps that plays a role. 

nope...maybe early on but he not now...I know that for a fact

1 hour ago, wbbfan said:

If you aren't going to carry a backup imp Wr, might as well carry 2 Canadians. especially if 1 has actual roster value. 

yup...as a returner and a cover teams guy...

[rebusrankin]

Dru Brown is out for Ottawa this week.

[GCn20]

19 hours ago, Mike said:

I love this opinion, especially from someone who loves to throw out “and I did football clinics so trust me bro” whenever it suits their own agenda. 
 

Newsflash: Walters and O’Shea haven’t made decisions that resulted in a Grey Cup win for three seasons now. That means that their decisions, which are based off their own opinions not fact, are not infallible. 

Players play better we win the last 3 Grey Cups. Who we rostered in those games, with the exception of 2023 GC, to some extent, was not the reason we lost those games. In each and everyone of our last 3 Grey Cups we are 3-4 bad plays and a QB injury away from winning all of them. I guess my point is that if anyone thinks that the decision to keep Fatboi on the roster makes much of a difference in the grand scheme than they are letting the players off the hook if we lose.

18 hours ago, HardCoreBlue said:

I'm trying correlate this analogy to how he contributes on and off the football field and what I've come up with is this analogy (probably) fits way better with his off field contributions than it does to his on-field contributions. It's a tough gig being a professional head coach I get it but when he is on the field providing no push up the middle taking snaps away from others do these off field contributions cancel that out?

Apparently MOS says yes, he's earned it.

 

In limited reps he does not hurt us at all. Last year he got thrown into the fray due to injuries to others and it is unfair to paint that as a coaching error. It's like saying MOS is stupid for starting Strev this week over Zac because Zac is better. The better players is not available. If Lawson is healthy last year we aren't even talking about JT right now.

[Booch]

5 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

Players play better we win the last 3 Grey Cups. Who we rostered in those games, with the exception of 2023 GC, to some extent, was not the reason we lost those games. In each and everyone of our last 3 Grey Cups we are 3-4 bad plays and a QB injury away from winning all of them. I guess my point is that if anyone thinks that the decision to keep Fatboi on the roster makes much of a difference in the grand scheme than they are letting the players off the hook if we lose.

In limited reps he does not hurt us at all. Last year he got thrown into the fray due to injuries to others and it is unfair to paint that as a coaching error. It's like saying MOS is stupid for starting Strev this week over Zac because Zac is better. The better players is not available. If Lawson is healthy last year we aren't even talking about JT right now.

thing id...he doesnt help either....he's ittelevant....AND...we did not need a national taking premium reps there at all to meet ratio....no readon at all last 2 yrs he got reps he did...its just an Osh choice,,,We could have the last 2 seasons been developing a guy there beside just Lawson who would prob be a significant player now...same with WIL....Same with MLB....Tho we have J.Jones but Osh being Osh wont roster him over a journryman guy who is average at best...soley cause he been here already by my guess...that or another mancriush

[wbbfan]

1 hour ago, GCn20 said:

Players play better we win the last 3 Grey Cups. Who we rostered in those games, with the exception of 2023 GC, to some extent, was not the reason we lost those games. In each and everyone of our last 3 Grey Cups we are 3-4 bad plays and a QB injury away from winning all of them. I guess my point is that if anyone thinks that the decision to keep Fatboi on the roster makes much of a difference in the grand scheme than they are letting the players off the hook if we lose.

In limited reps he does not hurt us at all. Last year he got thrown into the fray due to injuries to others and it is unfair to paint that as a coaching error. It's like saying MOS is stupid for starting Strev this week over Zac because Zac is better. The better players is not available. If Lawson is healthy last year we aren't even talking about JT right now.

Coaches coach better same thing happens. Before last year, we played it pretty close down to the wire and came up short. Coaching would've made a bigger difference in those years. Last year was such a mess of poor play and coaching, but we should've been able to beat up on a team QBd by arbuckle. 

[M.Silverback]

1 hour ago, GCn20 said:

Players play better we win the last 3 Grey Cups. Who we rostered in those games, with the exception of 2023 GC, to some extent, was not the reason we lost those games. In each and everyone of our last 3 Grey Cups we are 3-4 bad plays and a QB injury away from winning all of them. I guess my point is that if anyone thinks that the decision to keep Fatboi on the roster makes much of a difference in the grand scheme than they are letting the players off the hook if we lose.

In limited reps he does not hurt us at all. Last year he got thrown into the fray due to injuries to others and it is unfair to paint that as a coaching error. It's like saying MOS is stupid for starting Strev this week over Zac because Zac is better. The better players is not available. If Lawson is healthy last year we aren't even talking about JT right now.

Yup. I'm a critic of Osh's roster decisions, and I think Jake should have retired/been released two seasons ago. But, if anyone thinks that JT is the reason we lost 3 Grey Cups, or that a DT's impact on the game is so great it determines championships (Aaron Donald maybe), you're off base. We lost those games primarily because our star players - marquee star QB primarily - came up short. And, because we made some dumb coaching decisions in game vs only in setting the roster (let's let our star QB, who has been playing poorly, continue in the game when a finger on his throwing hand has almost been amputated). Baffling. 

[Booch]

7 minutes ago, M.Silverback said:

Yup. I'm a critic of Osh's roster decisions, and I think Jake should have retired/been released two seasons ago. But, if anyone thinks that JT is the reason we lost 3 Grey Cups, or that a DT's impact on the game is so great it determines championships (Aaron Donald maybe), you're off base. We lost those games primarily because our star players - marquee star QB primarily - came up short. And, because we made some dumb coaching decisions in game vs only in setting the roster (let's let our star QB, who has been playing poorly, continue in the game when a finger on his throwing hand has almost been amputated). Baffling. 

Jake wasnt reason...sole reason for sure...but rostering was...and he's part of that...we were lean on dline 1st time T.O beat us and our front was gassed by 4th quarter

Mtl...we dressed...and played 5 guys who had no business dressing and were useless....and we had able bodies stand on sidelines and not take a snap...Why you think BOLO left us...He's sure look good in tandem with Clercius right about now

Last yr...piss poor planning....some questionable again roster decisions...then sticking with ZC when he couldnt throw...even said so himself...then proceeded to throw long passes and ignore the MOP/MOC and ended up getting ass hannded to us in an embarrasing fashion

If this was the NFL the OC and HC would have been canned shortly after the dust settled...regardless of what they did in the past...Actuall some organization's in Canada...current and definately in past would have as well....Your past accomplishments as currency only last so long

Edited 10 hours ago by Booch

[17to85]

Players play better we win... maybe better roster usage nets those few plays needed... 

 

[bigg jay]

46 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

Players play better we win... maybe better roster usage nets those few plays needed... 

 

Especially the first 2 GC losses that were so close that a few plays could have made the difference in winning and losing.