2024/2025 Blue Bombers Off-Season Thread

[Booch]

1 hour ago, rebusrankin said:

Fine with the extension for ZC but agree that I hope that its 500k next year not 600k.

 

1 hour ago, Bigblue204 said:

500K is still too much imo.

450 should be his ceiling now...that and no big upfront money and he has to prove he is clearly head and shoulders the best QB in town...not given the job based on yrs past...especially if he does the big choke...again 

 

1 hour ago, wbbfan said:

Who gives a 37 year old qb coming off his worse season in years a future contract extension, before the start of the current season? 
 Woof this is ugly and going to get worse. Even if zach is mop quality this year, it screams of “he plays till he gets carted off for good.” 
This would need to be the most team friendly deal ever to make any sense. 

100% he’s the best blocker of the new WRs. TBH, Dmitch is the least engaged in blocking. Sterns is significantly better, but he’s one of those little blood n guts guys like dressler was. If sterns gets in games, every one is gonna in love with that kid. 

 

 

Yep should be very low guaranteed higher incentives. 

Yup...case of us resting on laurels and complacency again...not earned but given.

Lets say this yr...Strev lights it up in first game...Zc struggles in next...Strev comes in and commands things again...happens throughout first 3rd of season?? What's the smart coach do...what does Osh do? 

I think talk of extension should been talked about..but let first 3rd...even half the season play out first to see if it is the smart move...no rush whatsoever to extension now...he ain't t at risk going anywhere until feb 2026

50 minutes ago, Mike said:

What would be the point of that now?

Considering a ton was guaranteed and a big portion up front 

[wbbfan]

49 minutes ago, Mike said:

What would be the point of that now?

We might have used a bunch of the extended salary cap to front load two years for him so he’d be dirt cheap next year and after. 
 Still wouldn’t love that move, but I could see some logic to it. Especially since they are married to Zach. (Who has had a really good camp) 

[BigBlue]

52 minutes ago, Mike said:

What would be the point of that now?

I believe I read on 3D that it was for $550k

 

[wbbfan]

2 minutes ago, Booch said:

 

450 should be his ceiling now...that and no big upfront money and he has to prove he is clearly head and shoulders the best QB in town...not given the job based on yrs past...especially if he does the big choke...again 

 

Yup...case of us resting on laurels and complacency again...not earned but given.

Lets say this yr...Strev lights it up in first game...Zc struggles in next...Strev comes in and commands things again...happens throughout first 3rd of season?? What's the smart coach do...what does Osh do? 

I think talk of extension should been talked about..but let first 3rd...even half the season play out first to see if it is the smart move...no rush whatsoever to extension now...he ain't t at risk going anywhere until feb 2026

Considering a ton was guaranteed and a big portion up front 

It’d take a lot for me to say he’s earned more than 400k even at this point. 

Im worried about strevy from what I’ve seen. But pre season performance is worth 10x more than camp. So hopefully he has a good pre season. Similarly, zachs camp could evaporate with live rounds and hits. 
 I’ve got that familiar sinking feeling when it comes to roster management out of this camp. The big saving grace this year is going to be the young athletic depth we’ve amassed. 
 

We should’ve moved off Zach with brown. At this point I think we will run with zach till he physically can’t lace em up any more or quits. 

[Goalie]

Obviously means Streveler ain’t the guy and Wilson and the other kid ain’t ready. If nothing else Zach is a starting QB in the cfl, the starter of the team who has been to 5 straight cup finals now. Reality is he’s better than everyone else we have and a year extra ain’t gonna change things. Should have would have could have but didn’t. And here we are today. Zach is the best QB on the roster. You don’t move on if you don’t have the next guy ready.  The next guy isn’t Streveler. It’s Wilson Chase A or Elgersma. 

Edited 7 hours ago by Goalie

[B140]

1 hour ago, BigBlue said:

I believe I read on 3D that it was for $550k

 

In 2022

[JuranBoldenRules]

3 hours ago, M.O.A.B. said:

Barring pre-season injury, Im expecting our starting receivers will be: Wheatfall, White Jr, Demski, Schoen and Clercius.

Dillon Mitchell will be (not so) surprised cut.

I'd be pretty surprised if Wheatfall made the opening roster, barring injuries.  D Mitchell is kind of the speed element at all levels and screen game, kind of your Lawler replacement.  Wheatfall hasn't really looked good on anything but a couple verticals, and really hasn't finished a ton of plays.  Could be a 2nd year breakout candidate I guess but just don't see a spot for him to get on Game 1.  He'd be a PR guy again if he doesn't get beat out by someone who looks like a better fit.  

To me White Jr and Stearns are in a battle for the 3rd slot position.  Maybe can get both on if Stearns can return.  If White is in good health I could see him and Schoen (if he's healthy too) being devastating targets down the middle.

[Fatty Liver]

1 hour ago, Booch said:

 

450 should be his ceiling now...that and no big upfront money and he has to prove he is clearly head and shoulders the best QB in town...not given the job based on yrs past...especially if he does the big choke...again

Yah, I doubt Zach's agent is going to agree to a massive pay cut after he's led the Bombers to the Grey Cup 5 years running and elite QB pay is still $500k+ and potentially headed up.  It's not like he's failed to produce winning seasons like BLM  did for a few years before he accepted a substantial chop in pay.

[wbbfan]

42 minutes ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

I'd be pretty surprised if Wheatfall made the opening roster, barring injuries.  D Mitchell is kind of the speed element at all levels and screen game, kind of your Lawler replacement.  Wheatfall hasn't really looked good on anything but a couple verticals, and really hasn't finished a ton of plays.  Could be a 2nd year breakout candidate I guess but just don't see a spot for him to get on Game 1.  He'd be a PR guy again if he doesn't get beat out by someone who looks like a better fit.  

To me White Jr and Stearns are in a battle for the 3rd slot position.  Maybe can get both on if Stearns can return.  If White is in good health I could see him and Schoen (if he's healthy too) being devastating targets down the middle.

I think this start is that big shot for him, the guys who stick around and make the next camp seem to get this shot. I do think he’s a long shot to make the ar. 
 I think sterns is a real sleeper to stick and make a niche for him self. 
I think white is gonna win the spot if he stays healthy. Hes so much in the mold we like. 

[Brandon]

2 hours ago, Goalie said:

Obviously means Streveler ain’t the guy and Wilson and the other kid ain’t ready. If nothing else Zach is a starting QB in the cfl, the starter of the team who has been to 5 straight cup finals now. Reality is he’s better than everyone else we have and a year extra ain’t gonna change things. Should have would have could have but didn’t. And here we are today. Zach is the best QB on the roster. You don’t move on if you don’t have the next guy ready.  The next guy isn’t Streveler. It’s Wilson Chase A or Elgersma. 

How does these guys develop and get real game time sitting on the PR or playing 3rd string.    

I would of rather they play out the contract this year and if he returns to form then pay him big at the end of the season.   I'm anticipating that next year these boards will be pissed that they gave away a large chunk of money to a broken QB who is no longer worth the money.   

[JuranBoldenRules]

28 minutes ago, Brandon said:

How does these guys develop and get real game time sitting on the PR or playing 3rd string.    

I would of rather they play out the contract this year and if he returns to form then pay him big at the end of the season.   I'm anticipating that next year these boards will be pissed that they gave away a large chunk of money to a broken QB who is no longer worth the money.   

How did Dru Brown develop?

4th string for a year, time share backup with Prukop in 22, then established #2 in 23.  Starts 3 games in 3 seasons.

[wbbfan]

31 minutes ago, Brandon said:

How does these guys develop and get real game time sitting on the PR or playing 3rd string.    

I would have rather they play out the contract this year and if he returns to form then pay him big at the end of the season.   I'm anticipating that next year these boards will be pissed that they gave away a large chunk of money to a broken QB who is no longer worth the money.   

That’s one of the biggest hurdles to developing QBs. You can only do so much with out sacrificing games. Some guys hit that point of diminishing returns faster or slower. But they all hit it and you never know how far they will go after. 
 Teams gotta be smart with trash time and use it like the high value time it is, for back ups. 
 

Yeah, move just doesn’t make much sense. I believe we could wave him before the season say next year and save that money still, what ever isn’t guaranteed. But this move shows we won’t move off him as long as he’s willing to play, even if he can’t get it done any more. 

[wbbfan]

2 minutes ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

How did Dru Brown develop?

4th string for a year, time share backup with Prukop in 22, then established #2 in 23.  Starts 3 games in 3 seasons.

Brown took big steps forward from his first game action (where he was brutal) to the next camp. I mean he took leaps and bounds at every step too. 
 I’m also not sure he’s a product of our development at all. We get credit for giving him time and having patience for sure. But I think he developed through his own work. I think he would’ve developed most places if he got to stick around. 
 
 I think it’s very arguable that many successful QBs across all levels develop due to their own work ethic and intangibles. I think far more teams ruin QBs than ever actually develop guys. 

[JuranBoldenRules]

4 minutes ago, wbbfan said:

Brown took big steps forward from his first game action (where he was brutal) to the next camp. I mean he took leaps and bounds at every step too. 
 I’m also not sure he’s a product of our development at all. We get credit for giving him time and having patience for sure. But I think he developed through his own work. I think he would’ve developed most places if he got to stick around. 
 
 I think it’s very arguable that many successful QBs across all levels develop due to their own work ethic and intangibles. I think far more teams ruin QBs than ever actually develop guys. 

No kidding.  I don't think teams ruin a lot of guys.  The high level NCAA guys are already running their own show.  Most of the decent U Sports guys these days are too.  Anyone going to even that level is taking charge of their own development when they are 14-15.  They know how to train themselves and their technical abilities are pretty baked in.  Nobody at a club level is practicing in a way that's going change that in this era.  You're mostly getting set to play games, not playing around with mechanics.  People can complain about opportunity but no one with undeniable ability was ever denied at that position.  Everyone is dying for consistently average QB play.  There's no other position where you get a chance to develop like that in football, other than maybe Canadian OL in this league.  We're splitting hairs on guys who really aren't at the level of the guys who are franchise QB's because we maybe saw a flash that made us hope the guy was something he wasn't.

I think a lot of teams see some redeeming quality that allows them to overlook severe flaws in potential quarterbacks.  Like Alex Brink not being able to pass the ball yet spending like 4 years here as QB in waiting.

People would be shocked at how even at pretty high levels coaches are still in awe of guys who are throwers with no passing ability.  Like people in our city making a living training QB's and sometimes other football players who get themselves involved in provincial teams and cannot evaluate them at all...even in the scenario of "we play games next month, who of the 4 QB's that we've just repped and worked with for 6 weeks is the best at moving the offense we've installed."  Or totally blinded by an athlete who can't pass with any accuracy.  Draw up a lot of plays for what you could do off RPO looks but no matter what you draw the guy can't pass well enough to execute anything accurately and consistently.  Reads are a huge thing, arguably THE huge thing, get on same page with receivers, do things at speed.  Even if you can put it on a spot 70 yards away, doesn't matter if you can't make a decision on time.  

That was a big Lapo flaw back to the CFL.  If a QB can't attack at all 3 levels as a passer they really can't run a good CFL offense.  Everything else will simply be adjusted to over a season by other good teams.  Sure you can catch someone lacking and have your QB run for 170 yards sometime, but it's not happening every week.

[Booch]

Did ZC lead us tho to 5 cups...or was he the QB of the team that went to 5?

Not trying to be a nit picker here but sure he solidified the QB spot but several of the cup appearances were more due to other factors and the ones we won he was average at best...and when we had roster issues and a much weaker defensive front and decided to play injured guys...he didnt drag us to victory either...so I kinda on the fence as him being anything over 450k at this point

[GCn20]

1 hour ago, Booch said:

Did ZC lead us tho to 5 cups...or was he the QB of the team that went to 5?

Not trying to be a nit picker here but sure he solidified the QB spot but several of the cup appearances were more due to other factors and the ones we won he was average at best...and when we had roster issues and a much weaker defensive front and decided to play injured guys...he didnt drag us to victory either...so I kinda on the fence as him being anything over 450k at this point

He won MOP in two of those years while being the number one QB in the league. So yea, I would say he played a large role. But that was then and this is now, so I get where you are coming from.

Edited 1 hour ago by GCn20

[GCn20]

8 hours ago, wbbfan said:

He hasn’t started the step up yet from what I’ve seen and heard. Which is very disappointing to me. He could still do it. The first pre season game is pretty much the latest time he can start really showing out. 
Mos seems pretty high on white too. 

Some guys thrive under the Friday night lights. Wanna see him in game action before writing him off.

2 hours ago, wbbfan said:

That’s one of the biggest hurdles to developing QBs. You can only do so much with out sacrificing games. Some guys hit that point of diminishing returns faster or slower. But they all hit it and you never know how far they will go after. 
 Teams gotta be smart with trash time and use it like the high value time it is, for back ups. 
 

Yeah, move just doesn’t make much sense. I believe we could wave him before the season say next year and save that money still, what ever isn’t guaranteed. But this move shows we won’t move off him as long as he’s willing to play, even if he can’t get it done any more. 

All depends what he is getting up front imo. 

[wbbfan]

2 hours ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

No kidding.  I don't think teams ruin a lot of guys.  The high level NCAA guys are already running their own show.  Most of the decent U Sports guys these days are too.  Anyone going to even that level is taking charge of their own development when they are 14-15.  They know how to train themselves and their technical abilities are pretty baked in.  Nobody at a club level is practicing in a way that's going change that in this era.  You're mostly getting set to play games, not playing around with mechanics.  People can complain about opportunity but no one with undeniable ability was ever denied at that position.  Everyone is dying for consistently average QB play.  There's no other position where you get a chance to develop like that in football, other than maybe Canadian OL in this league.  We're splitting hairs on guys who really aren't at the level of the guys who are franchise QB's because we maybe saw a flash that made us hope the guy was something he wasn't.

I think a lot of teams see some redeeming quality that allows them to overlook severe flaws in potential quarterbacks.  Like Alex Brink not being able to pass the ball yet spending like 4 years here as QB in waiting.

People would be shocked at how even at pretty high levels coaches are still in awe of guys who are throwers with no passing ability.  Like people in our city making a living training QB's and sometimes other football players who get themselves involved in provincial teams and cannot evaluate them at all...even in the scenario of "we play games next month, who of the 4 QB's that we've just repped and worked with for 6 weeks is the best at moving the offense we've installed."  Or totally blinded by an athlete who can't pass with any accuracy.  Draw up a lot of plays for what you could do off RPO looks but no matter what you draw the guy can't pass well enough to execute anything accurately and consistently.  Reads are a huge thing, arguably THE huge thing, get on same page with receivers, do things at speed.  Even if you can put it on a spot 70 yards away, doesn't matter if you can't make a decision on time.  

That was a big Lapo flaw back to the CFL.  If a QB can't attack at all 3 levels as a passer they really can't run a good CFL offense.  Everything else will simply be adjusted to over a season by other good teams.  Sure you can catch someone lacking and have your QB run for 170 yards sometime, but it's not happening every week.

You have a point, the higher the level the better chance a team messes it up. Especially with the ladder nature of drafts. 
 

You’re 100% right that QBs get a development path few other positions do in football.

virtually ever qb gets a high volume of chances, while few get quality. MacLeod bethel Thompson is a good example. Barely any hs or college snaps as qb1. But like 10 nfl teams, cfl pr cut and picked up with no snaps up here. Usually when highly talented guys flop out fast, they have serious deficiencies. 
 Baseball is still figuring out how best to use and develop guys, with an insane amount of pro infrastructure.
Out side of speeding guys up to the pro level of game play and playbook sizes it’s about not messing guys up when done right. This is why I think nfl tc for Elgersma is great. His primary need is just that to jump the gap from cis to pro level. 
 

You’re right on the money. Especially in the modern cfl. The level of talent and refinement we see in qb prospects is as far behind down south as I’ve ever seen. So teams get stuck on guys who they think have a tangible or intangible that can over come the deficiencies. 
 

Weve passed the tipping point where QBs coming up know more about qbing than their coaches. And they know it. Coaching is softer and QBs are harder. 
 Up here it’s a lot of former position players rising up the coaching ranks too. The long maligned Canadian qb role has left us out the generation of qb coaches and former qb oc/hc. 
 Teams at all levels fall in love with raw arm talent and athleticism. At the sub pro levels you see so many kids just take over games with that, and you get swept up in it. If you can’t manufacture it, you fake it and hope. 
 

Yeah the top tier oc minds in college and hs I see down south aren’t excelling with the best qb talent. They are finding kids with strong intangibles, who are able to fit rpo and their specific brand of niches. Having a system that can run rpos fast and efficiently is way better than having a world beating arm. 
 

Some guys like Maas have done a good job of covering up some qb deficiencies and making their worst throws the easiest in his system. But mostly teams really struggle to offset their QBs skill set. Every one is looking for the same perfect arm that can do every thing instead of setting up for the easiest repeatable success. Rpos that set up catch and run plays are much easier. You still need to threaten and be able to hit home runs, but no one sustains offensive out put based around the deep ball. 
 You can stretch the field a lot by going side line to side line, and back field to mid range. 

[wbbfan]

2 hours ago, Booch said:

Did ZC lead us tho to 5 cups...or was he the QB of the team that went to 5?

Not trying to be a nit picker here but sure he solidified the QB spot but several of the cup appearances were more due to other factors and the ones we won he was average at best...and when we had roster issues and a much weaker defensive front and decided to play injured guys...he didnt drag us to victory either...so I kinda on the fence as him being anything over 450k at this point

That’s a fair point. I feel like he lead us to the big games after 21. Though our d did a lot to carry last year. But he wasn’t the guy who lead us in any of the gcs. 
 If we exchanged Zach for any other top 3 league qb in the last 5 years I think we play in atleast 4 gcs maybe all 5 and likely win one more atleast. 
 

45 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

He won MOP in two of those years while being the number one QB in the league. So yea, I would say he played a large role. But that was then and this is now, so I get where you are coming from.

The awards are a sham imo. But he was the best qb in that time range, out side of grey cup games. Idk if he was the best qb in many of the gc games. Maybe 1? 

 

36 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

Some guys thrive under the Friday night lights. Wanna see him in game action before writing him off.

100%. Proof is gonna be in pre season pudding. 
 I actually think camp competition hasn’t been as close as I expected it to be. I think we have a pretty clear divide between starter calibre and depth. We could cut half the WRs and dbs. 
 But I also think we have less spots to fill fill than previous years. We are stocked up with experienced guys to compete for spots and they are just as good as the new guys. 
 Gowan might be the only cfl “rookie” that sees significant reps early.  He and to a lesser extent Shay and smith. 
 

I think Gowan and Parker are taking the started jobs in the secondary. Lber should be Ayers and j jones. But probably both jones and kyrie while Ayers goes to pr till kyrie gets hurt again. Vaughters opposite wj, back up depends on health. Lawson needs to get to 100%.  So we probably know what happens at dt. 
 I think Wallace is gonna take 1 guard spot and Randolph at T. Sterns and white at wr with kev schoen and Demski.