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Yeah but prior to coming here the history suggested that collaros wouldn't be healthy enough to make grey cup games Yeah everyone knows he played a long time...

can easily be said our cup wins were not due to ZC brilliance...but the 3 losses...a lot of that could be hung on him...he was awful

I would take all or any of those trade offs with a big smile on my face. I would even take prime WIllie in a tie with prime Hunt. Tony Jack I thought he said....something about a jack anyway....no relation to Brian Jack I hope.

He looks a lot more athletic than I thought he would. Very interesting player to watch over TC.

I don't think you can rank them, I think you've gotta tier them. S-tier is Flutie and Moon A-tier is Ray and Calvillo B-tier is the rest of the top ten plus a ton of other guys. Lulay and Durant are on the bubble of B-tier for me. C-tier is Nichols, Glenn, Pierce, Bell, Maas, Slack, K. Joseph, Jarious -- guys who could start and win games and who had extended careers in places, and who occasionally shoot the lights out. D-tier is Bishop, Q. Porter, Jyles -- guys who showed just enough to win a starting job for a season or three, but never found their home. Would put the one-season wonders like Printers or J. Jennings in there too. The tweeners are the interesting guys. Glenn is a C-tier quarterback who had a B-tier career. Allen was a B-tier quarterback who had an A-tier career. That dude won a lot of Grey Cups in a lot of different situations, was freakishly durable despite being a pretty little guy, and went out on top.

The thing is that on the eve of camp, MOS doesn't really know what he's got. Guys haven't even reported for physicals yet, except for rookies and a select few others. Every year some guys come in as a tire fire and you have to pivot, Tui, for example, was that guy a couple years ago who came to camp and needed some conditioning to put it politely. If he does that this year, does that alter our plan to start the season? Probably. Motivation is another. What kind of work ethic did a guy come in with...is he half arsing? We've also had too much of that over several training camps with a blind eye turned. I am hoping that MOS see that as something that must stop. I agree that Doug would provide better questions, but I don't think MOS changes his interview style. He throws out cliches so that you have your sound bite, but he's never going to tell the media anything about any of his players good or bad.

Calvillo's greatest strength was longevity and the fact that he was so good so late in his career... but I'd agree that prime Ricky >> prime Calvillo

love this, thanks!... but it does bug me to see Wilson listed at WIL with 3 better options listed behind him...

Matty paid and is still paying the price.

No Calvillo? I always thought he was better than Ray Most career passing yards (79,816) Most career touchdown passes (455) Most career pass completions (5,892) Most career pass attempts (9,437) Most career passing yards in Grey Cup games (2,470 yards)

It's Flutie, Moon, Ray in that order... The rest can be debated. Saying Dunigan would have won 4 in a row here. The history suggests he would have been injured and we wouldn't make the GC games. Dunigan won exactly ONE GC that he started in (1991) and as heroic as he was to even try playing in that game, I wouldn't say it was him that won it.

You're forgetting Moon. He's got to be in the convo. And there just isn't a world where I'm putting KG above Collaros in a list of all timers. The question on BLM vs Collaros is a good one. Both had fantastic starts to their careers...then fizzled....then came back, though on the ZC has an advantage on the come back....BLM advantage on the start.

so you're finally warming up to Tony Jones... 😆

don't have ad block on the phone

Im sure they are all real with Shein being 100% Chinesium and Wayfair is probably half way there. Could always block the retailer. Works for a while.

That's true to an extent, but watch the GC games he lost, or his playoff games, and you'd wonder how he lasted so long. I think Matty wins 4 gcs in a row here. First ballot hof? I hate that the time you go in is a thing, but he is for sure. Is he a top 10 QB? I hadn't thought about it, that's kind of interesting. For me, Flutie, Ac, Ray, Hank, BLM, and Allen are ahead of him. Between KG, Danny Mac, Lancaster, Dunigan, Ham, Clements, and Zach, you have 2 hard cuts to make the top 10. With guys like Austin, Harris, Brock, and Reily on the outside edge. Personally, I'd push Danny and Lancaster to the bottom of that pack. However, I could see someone pushing KG down instead of Lancaster. Or maybe bumping Reilly up for one of those guys. Top 10 QBs of all time? Yeah, right now I think I'd put him in the 8-10 range. Though Harris could still move up, Zach might even be able to catch BLM. I am trying to be easier on the older QBs due to the era they played in, part of me wants to downgrade guys like Allen, Mac, and Lancaster a good bit. It is, however, a privilege to get to watch BLM, Harris, and Zach battle down the stretch of their respective careers. They've all had a wild ride, including being written off and making unreal comebacks. Neck and neck down the stretch, all battling for current and career accolades.

I hate looking at the ads for Shein and Wayfair on Facebook no way those products are real

I think there's a lot of revisionist history re: Zach because of the last couple years, which may or may not have been his fault (shoddy OL, lack of weapons, etc...) If you ever forget what he looked like at his peak, go watch some Game Recaps on YouTube from 21/22... It was something special. I'm pretty sure Zach is a first ballot CFL HOF-er, and his placement among the Top 10 all time QBs is a question for debate when his career is done. The next year or two will determine how much shine gets removed from his resume.

"And just like that, the parade is back on in Toronto." Laughed so hard my employees came to check on me.

Id love to hear an honest appraisal of expectations and excitement for camp. FA and the draft were big wins for the front office and staff. I wouldn't expect him to single guys out, but talking positionally about how guys are gonna get a shot at DE or C would be good. Talking about how we moved to a younger, more athletic roster, and it'll be interesting to see how that plays out vs the vets. Personally, I'm numb to the fact that the last thing mos wants to do in any interview or coaches show is talk Xs/Os, positional play, players, etc. It is what it is. You can do that, though, without having to walk a line like a politician as a coach. Anyone who walks up to Mos or Walters can have a great conversation on all things football. But put a semi-formal setting around mos, and you get drivel. To be fair, I bet the coaches' show would be a lot better if it were with brown or both PBP and color. Doug would push far more interesting questions, and if he got chippy, mos would brush it off but take it well. But that content, and his interviews in general are not aimed at fans like myself or most of the people here. It's aimed at the senior citizens who listen to OB and sit in coffee shops.

So I was thinking about peak Collaros vs. 1992-1994 Dunigan and for me, it's Zach because peak Zach was much more durable and more clutch. Matty had teams good enough to win Grey Cups, but in 1992 the Calgary D owned him and 1993 he had an Achilles tear. Thinking about durability, though -- if you look at games before the 2000s, there was very little official protection for the QBs. Pass rushers would routinely torpedo a QB two or three steps after he delivered the ball, no flag. It's astonishing to see some of the hits that old-school QBs would pop up from. So it's kind of a function of the era that makes Zach more durable ... tho Zach doesn't seek contact like Matty did.

I am a big enough Clements fan to have him as my avatar, but I dunno how 1987 MOP Tom Clements would stack up nowadays. Hard to compare QB play over the years. Quarterbacks are so much more careful with the ball now. Watching vintage Clements games, sometimes he'd make a ridiculous backfoot prayer throw into a crowd of DBs just because throwing a pick or three was no big deal back then, picks were just something that happened. QBs had to be really good at throwing picks, like Vince Ferragamo good, before their careers would suffer. Hell, Sonny Wade stuck around for a decade with the Alouettes despite throwing 2x many interceptions as TDs.