With the loss of Justin Sorensen yesterday, Kirk Penton of the Winnipeg Sun is reporting that the Bombers are looking at moving Steve Morley to centre this season.  Thoughts on whether he would be an upgrade over Sorensen? 

 

If this were to occur, and assuming we draft Lavertu, I'd see Lavertu starting mid-season, or at the latest in 2015. 

 

Which position is 'easier' to play as an OL, centre or guard? By easier, I mean getting by at the position with a sub-par o-lineman.

Guard. Less to think about. Basically a barroom brawler who just has to physically beat up the guy across. C has so much more to do on the field, incl calling formation and such.

 

I actually believe that centre is the less physically demanding position. As long as a guy can snap and has a brain in his head should be able to play centre. 

 

 

Which position is 'easier' to play as an OL, centre or guard? By easier, I mean getting by at the position with a sub-par o-lineman.

Guard. Less to think about. Basically a barroom brawler who just has to physically beat up the guy across. C has so much more to do on the field, incl calling formation and such.

 

I actually believe that centre is the less physically demanding position. As long as a guy can snap and has a brain in his head should be able to play centre. 

 

...why it's a harder/more demanding position to play. Gotta be able to read the D and call the formation, then snap the ball, then get your head up fast, then beat at least two guys across from you, if not more. It's a tough position. Matt Sheridan was the perfect Guard, 'cause all he had to do was fight. Obby was a pretty good C, 'cause he's a smart dude.

Which position is 'easier' to play as an OL, centre or guard? By easier, I mean getting by at the position with a sub-par o-lineman.

 

Very different.  First off, the QB-centre exchange is the most important skill in football.  You can't do anything without it.  You can't just plug anyone in at centre and expect them to be able to get the ball to the QB at a CFL level, which is the problem with guys like Kowalczuk and Parenteau etc.  That is a huge skill in and of itself.  The centre makes some calls to protections, but this is way overrated in Canadian football, most plays have the protections built in and basically what both the centre and QB both do is count how many guys are inside the tackles and which gap the defence is centered on, basically what they are playing as the strong side, which 99% of the time mirrors the offence or the width of the field anyways.  This is different than American football, mostly the strong side of the field down south depends on the strong hand of the QB since the field is not nearly as wide.   This is most of what the calls are, and the protection adjusts based on it, but every guy can see that when they look up, and if you're playing somewhere noisy, there's not a lot you can change at the line.   Everyone is watching for potential blitzers, that mostly falls on the QB to make a call to react to that. adjust a route.  OL have to block from their inside gaps out and do their best to take whoever comes...that's why you'll often see guys coming off the edge free when a defence sends more than 5.  When you see guys come free through the 4 middle gaps, that means someone really screwed up, either took the wrong block or got completely dominated physically.

 

Zone run blocking, it doesn't matter where the defence lines up or how many, they are blocking gaps and chipping upfield.  Zone plays head to a side of the field, not a specific gap, you're basically creating a 3 on 2 situation for your blockers all along the LOS on the play side, allowing at least one of those guys to chip and get to the next level to take a LB or HB.  The RB reacts and finds the opening.  So really a centre doesn't call anything there, every OL needs to read their initial block and come out of their stance properly to get that done.  The first 3 steps are key, can't waste any if you need to get upfield, or get a bit wider.

 

I guess it depends what you think a sub-par lineman is.  IMO, most of the centres in the league lately have all been subpar, meaning they'd really suck if you moved them to another spot where they actually ended up blocking someone 1 on 1 on the majority of snaps.  But that's where the snapping part comes in, a guy who can snap very well and consistently can make a career, even if he struggles to make a block.  Just look at a guy like Dominic Picard.  If I had a dime for everytime he's literally been carried through the pocket by a DT, I could pay for my season tickets this year.  Mostly you're just hoping they can be a good speed bump.  Guards need to be more mobile, presumably you want them to be able to get to the 2nd level (LB's, HB's) in run blocking, although there are enough guys around the league lately that don't really have that ability (Kabongo for one).  They both need to be smart enough to know where their block is and guards need to be patient enough in pass protection to not give up their inside gaps.  Patience in OL is a sign of intelligence and football smarts IMO.  This is really what the blitz is all about, challenging the OL to give up their inside gaps and a more direct route to the QB, the QB can read the outside rush, when it's coming right at him there's not much he can do.

Even Morley himself admitted he wasnt playing well. I'm inclined to believe if he was meant to be a center... He'd be one by now.

Maybe Penser is poised for a breakout year this year =/ plus a center from the draft... Ehhh...

Centre has the luxury or virtually getting help on most plays from one of the guards.

Walters mentioned in his presser that 2 of the top OL prospects in this years draft are centers. Lavertu is one. Who is the other...Goossen?

 

Which position is 'easier' to play as an OL, centre or guard? By easier, I mean getting by at the position with a sub-par o-lineman.

 

Very different.  First off, the QB-centre exchange is the most important skill in football.  You can't do anything without it.  You can't just plug anyone in at centre and expect them to be able to get the ball to the QB at a CFL level, which is the problem with guys like Kowalczuk and Parenteau etc.  That is a huge skill in and of itself.  The centre makes some calls to protections, but this is way overrated in Canadian football, most plays have the protections built in and basically what both the centre and QB both do is count how many guys are inside the tackles and which gap the defence is centered on, basically what they are playing as the strong side, which 99% of the time mirrors the offence or the width of the field anyways.  This is different than American football, mostly the strong side of the field down south depends on the strong hand of the QB since the field is not nearly as wide.   This is most of what the calls are, and the protection adjusts based on it, but every guy can see that when they look up, and if you're playing somewhere noisy, there's not a lot you can change at the line.   Everyone is watching for potential blitzers, that mostly falls on the QB to make a call to react to that. adjust a route.  OL have to block from their inside gaps out and do their best to take whoever comes...that's why you'll often see guys coming off the edge free when a defence sends more than 5.  When you see guys come free through the 4 middle gaps, that means someone really screwed up, either took the wrong block or got completely dominated physically.

 

Zone run blocking, it doesn't matter where the defence lines up or how many, they are blocking gaps and chipping upfield.  Zone plays head to a side of the field, not a specific gap, you're basically creating a 3 on 2 situation for your blockers all along the LOS on the play side, allowing at least one of those guys to chip and get to the next level to take a LB or HB.  The RB reacts and finds the opening.  So really a centre doesn't call anything there, every OL needs to read their initial block and come out of their stance properly to get that done.  The first 3 steps are key, can't waste any if you need to get upfield, or get a bit wider.

 

I guess it depends what you think a sub-par lineman is.  IMO, most of the centres in the league lately have all been subpar, meaning they'd really suck if you moved them to another spot where they actually ended up blocking someone 1 on 1 on the majority of snaps.  But that's where the snapping part comes in, a guy who can snap very well and consistently can make a career, even if he struggles to make a block.  Just look at a guy like Dominic Picard.  If I had a dime for everytime he's literally been carried through the pocket by a DT, I could pay for my season tickets this year.  Mostly you're just hoping they can be a good speed bump.  Guards need to be more mobile, presumably you want them to be able to get to the 2nd level (LB's, HB's) in run blocking, although there are enough guys around the league lately that don't really have that ability (Kabongo for one).  They both need to be smart enough to know where their block is and guards need to be patient enough in pass protection to not give up their inside gaps.  Patience in OL is a sign of intelligence and football smarts IMO.  This is really what the blitz is all about, challenging the OL to give up their inside gaps and a more direct route to the QB, the QB can read the outside rush, when it's coming right at him there's not much he can do.

 

dude.... nice!

 

you a coach or something? Play in the CIS maybe?

No he just stayed at a Holliday Inn last night.

 

Which position is 'easier' to play as an OL, centre or guard? By easier, I mean getting by at the position with a sub-par o-lineman.

 

Very different.  First off, the QB-centre exchange is the most important skill in football.  You can't do anything without it.  You can't just plug anyone in at centre and expect them to be able to get the ball to the QB at a CFL level, which is the problem with guys like Kowalczuk and Parenteau etc.  That is a huge skill in and of itself.  The centre makes some calls to protections, but this is way overrated in Canadian football, most plays have the protections built in and basically what both the centre and QB both do is count how many guys are inside the tackles and which gap the defence is centered on, basically what they are playing as the strong side, which 99% of the time mirrors the offence or the width of the field anyways.  This is different than American football, mostly the strong side of the field down south depends on the strong hand of the QB since the field is not nearly as wide.   This is most of what the calls are, and the protection adjusts based on it, but every guy can see that when they look up, and if you're playing somewhere noisy, there's not a lot you can change at the line.   Everyone is watching for potential blitzers, that mostly falls on the QB to make a call to react to that. adjust a route.  OL have to block from their inside gaps out and do their best to take whoever comes...that's why you'll often see guys coming off the edge free when a defence sends more than 5.  When you see guys come free through the 4 middle gaps, that means someone really screwed up, either took the wrong block or got completely dominated physically.

 

Zone run blocking, it doesn't matter where the defence lines up or how many, they are blocking gaps and chipping upfield.  Zone plays head to a side of the field, not a specific gap, you're basically creating a 3 on 2 situation for your blockers all along the LOS on the play side, allowing at least one of those guys to chip and get to the next level to take a LB or HB.  The RB reacts and finds the opening.  So really a centre doesn't call anything there, every OL needs to read their initial block and come out of their stance properly to get that done.  The first 3 steps are key, can't waste any if you need to get upfield, or get a bit wider.

 

I guess it depends what you think a sub-par lineman is.  IMO, most of the centres in the league lately have all been subpar, meaning they'd really suck if you moved them to another spot where they actually ended up blocking someone 1 on 1 on the majority of snaps.  But that's where the snapping part comes in, a guy who can snap very well and consistently can make a career, even if he struggles to make a block.  Just look at a guy like Dominic Picard.  If I had a dime for everytime he's literally been carried through the pocket by a DT, I could pay for my season tickets this year.  Mostly you're just hoping they can be a good speed bump.  Guards need to be more mobile, presumably you want them to be able to get to the 2nd level (LB's, HB's) in run blocking, although there are enough guys around the league lately that don't really have that ability (Kabongo for one).  They both need to be smart enough to know where their block is and guards need to be patient enough in pass protection to not give up their inside gaps.  Patience in OL is a sign of intelligence and football smarts IMO.  This is really what the blitz is all about, challenging the OL to give up their inside gaps and a more direct route to the QB, the QB can read the outside rush, when it's coming right at him there's not much he can do.

 

 

I just got a knowledge boner.

 

This is probably the most intelligent post I've read on this forum.

 

 

This is probably the most intelligent post I've read on this forum.

 

Then you obviously didn't read through the Arland Bruce thread...

 

 

Which position is 'easier' to play as an OL, centre or guard? By easier, I mean getting by at the position with a sub-par o-lineman.

 

Very different.  First off, the QB-centre exchange is the most important skill in football.  You can't do anything without it.  You can't just plug anyone in at centre and expect them to be able to get the ball to the QB at a CFL level, which is the problem with guys like Kowalczuk and Parenteau etc.  That is a huge skill in and of itself.  The centre makes some calls to protections, but this is way overrated in Canadian football, most plays have the protections built in and basically what both the centre and QB both do is count how many guys are inside the tackles and which gap the defence is centered on, basically what they are playing as the strong side, which 99% of the time mirrors the offence or the width of the field anyways.  This is different than American football, mostly the strong side of the field down south depends on the strong hand of the QB since the field is not nearly as wide.   This is most of what the calls are, and the protection adjusts based on it, but every guy can see that when they look up, and if you're playing somewhere noisy, there's not a lot you can change at the line.   Everyone is watching for potential blitzers, that mostly falls on the QB to make a call to react to that. adjust a route.  OL have to block from their inside gaps out and do their best to take whoever comes...that's why you'll often see guys coming off the edge free when a defence sends more than 5.  When you see guys come free through the 4 middle gaps, that means someone really screwed up, either took the wrong block or got completely dominated physically.

 

Zone run blocking, it doesn't matter where the defence lines up or how many, they are blocking gaps and chipping upfield.  Zone plays head to a side of the field, not a specific gap, you're basically creating a 3 on 2 situation for your blockers all along the LOS on the play side, allowing at least one of those guys to chip and get to the next level to take a LB or HB.  The RB reacts and finds the opening.  So really a centre doesn't call anything there, every OL needs to read their initial block and come out of their stance properly to get that done.  The first 3 steps are key, can't waste any if you need to get upfield, or get a bit wider.

 

I guess it depends what you think a sub-par lineman is.  IMO, most of the centres in the league lately have all been subpar, meaning they'd really suck if you moved them to another spot where they actually ended up blocking someone 1 on 1 on the majority of snaps.  But that's where the snapping part comes in, a guy who can snap very well and consistently can make a career, even if he struggles to make a block.  Just look at a guy like Dominic Picard.  If I had a dime for everytime he's literally been carried through the pocket by a DT, I could pay for my season tickets this year.  Mostly you're just hoping they can be a good speed bump.  Guards need to be more mobile, presumably you want them to be able to get to the 2nd level (LB's, HB's) in run blocking, although there are enough guys around the league lately that don't really have that ability (Kabongo for one).  They both need to be smart enough to know where their block is and guards need to be patient enough in pass protection to not give up their inside gaps.  Patience in OL is a sign of intelligence and football smarts IMO.  This is really what the blitz is all about, challenging the OL to give up their inside gaps and a more direct route to the QB, the QB can read the outside rush, when it's coming right at him there's not much he can do.

 

 

I just got a knowledge boner.

 

This is probably the most intelligent post I've read on this forum.

 

 

There will be a test before the start of training camp.

I think the centre becomes a much bigger factor when you're lining against a dominant DT - eg. Doug Brown

 

Which position is 'easier' to play as an OL, centre or guard? By easier, I mean getting by at the position with a sub-par o-lineman.

 

Very different.  First off, the QB-centre exchange is the most important skill in football.  You can't do anything without it.  You can't just plug anyone in at centre and expect them to be able to get the ball to the QB at a CFL level, which is the problem with guys like Kowalczuk and Parenteau etc.  That is a huge skill in and of itself.  The centre makes some calls to protections, but this is way overrated in Canadian football, most plays have the protections built in and basically what both the centre and QB both do is count how many guys are inside the tackles and which gap the defence is centered on, basically what they are playing as the strong side, which 99% of the time mirrors the offence or the width of the field anyways.  This is different than American football, mostly the strong side of the field down south depends on the strong hand of the QB since the field is not nearly as wide.   This is most of what the calls are, and the protection adjusts based on it, but every guy can see that when they look up, and if you're playing somewhere noisy, there's not a lot you can change at the line.   Everyone is watching for potential blitzers, that mostly falls on the QB to make a call to react to that. adjust a route.  OL have to block from their inside gaps out and do their best to take whoever comes...that's why you'll often see guys coming off the edge free when a defence sends more than 5.  When you see guys come free through the 4 middle gaps, that means someone really screwed up, either took the wrong block or got completely dominated physically.

 

Zone run blocking, it doesn't matter where the defence lines up or how many, they are blocking gaps and chipping upfield.  Zone plays head to a side of the field, not a specific gap, you're basically creating a 3 on 2 situation for your blockers all along the LOS on the play side, allowing at least one of those guys to chip and get to the next level to take a LB or HB.  The RB reacts and finds the opening.  So really a centre doesn't call anything there, every OL needs to read their initial block and come out of their stance properly to get that done.  The first 3 steps are key, can't waste any if you need to get upfield, or get a bit wider.

 

I guess it depends what you think a sub-par lineman is.  IMO, most of the centres in the league lately have all been subpar, meaning they'd really suck if you moved them to another spot where they actually ended up blocking someone 1 on 1 on the majority of snaps.  But that's where the snapping part comes in, a guy who can snap very well and consistently can make a career, even if he struggles to make a block.  Just look at a guy like Dominic Picard.  If I had a dime for everytime he's literally been carried through the pocket by a DT, I could pay for my season tickets this year.  Mostly you're just hoping they can be a good speed bump.  Guards need to be more mobile, presumably you want them to be able to get to the 2nd level (LB's, HB's) in run blocking, although there are enough guys around the league lately that don't really have that ability (Kabongo for one).  They both need to be smart enough to know where their block is and guards need to be patient enough in pass protection to not give up their inside gaps.  Patience in OL is a sign of intelligence and football smarts IMO.  This is really what the blitz is all about, challenging the OL to give up their inside gaps and a more direct route to the QB, the QB can read the outside rush, when it's coming right at him there's not much he can do.

 

 

Relating this excellent post to Morley... we would be better with him at centre than at guard IF he was a satisfactory snapper, because his blocking inadequacies would be marginalized?  Seems like a match made in heaven for Morley.

 

 

Which position is 'easier' to play as an OL, centre or guard? By easier, I mean getting by at the position with a sub-par o-lineman.

 

Very different.  First off, the QB-centre exchange is the most important skill in football.  You can't do anything without it.  You can't just plug anyone in at centre and expect them to be able to get the ball to the QB at a CFL level, which is the problem with guys like Kowalczuk and Parenteau etc.  That is a huge skill in and of itself.  The centre makes some calls to protections, but this is way overrated in Canadian football, most plays have the protections built in and basically what both the centre and QB both do is count how many guys are inside the tackles and which gap the defence is centered on, basically what they are playing as the strong side, which 99% of the time mirrors the offence or the width of the field anyways.  This is different than American football, mostly the strong side of the field down south depends on the strong hand of the QB since the field is not nearly as wide.   This is most of what the calls are, and the protection adjusts based on it, but every guy can see that when they look up, and if you're playing somewhere noisy, there's not a lot you can change at the line.   Everyone is watching for potential blitzers, that mostly falls on the QB to make a call to react to that. adjust a route.  OL have to block from their inside gaps out and do their best to take whoever comes...that's why you'll often see guys coming off the edge free when a defence sends more than 5.  When you see guys come free through the 4 middle gaps, that means someone really screwed up, either took the wrong block or got completely dominated physically.

 

Zone run blocking, it doesn't matter where the defence lines up or how many, they are blocking gaps and chipping upfield.  Zone plays head to a side of the field, not a specific gap, you're basically creating a 3 on 2 situation for your blockers all along the LOS on the play side, allowing at least one of those guys to chip and get to the next level to take a LB or HB.  The RB reacts and finds the opening.  So really a centre doesn't call anything there, every OL needs to read their initial block and come out of their stance properly to get that done.  The first 3 steps are key, can't waste any if you need to get upfield, or get a bit wider.

 

I guess it depends what you think a sub-par lineman is.  IMO, most of the centres in the league lately have all been subpar, meaning they'd really suck if you moved them to another spot where they actually ended up blocking someone 1 on 1 on the majority of snaps.  But that's where the snapping part comes in, a guy who can snap very well and consistently can make a career, even if he struggles to make a block.  Just look at a guy like Dominic Picard.  If I had a dime for everytime he's literally been carried through the pocket by a DT, I could pay for my season tickets this year.  Mostly you're just hoping they can be a good speed bump.  Guards need to be more mobile, presumably you want them to be able to get to the 2nd level (LB's, HB's) in run blocking, although there are enough guys around the league lately that don't really have that ability (Kabongo for one).  They both need to be smart enough to know where their block is and guards need to be patient enough in pass protection to not give up their inside gaps.  Patience in OL is a sign of intelligence and football smarts IMO.  This is really what the blitz is all about, challenging the OL to give up their inside gaps and a more direct route to the QB, the QB can read the outside rush, when it's coming right at him there's not much he can do.

 

 

Relating this excellent post to Morley... we would be better with him at centre than at guard IF he was a satisfactory snapper, because his blocking inadequacies would be marginalized?  Seems like a match made in heaven for Morley.

 

Obby Khan started out as a tackle then guard then centre, Morley was a tackle to start then guard now maybe centre, seems like the natural career progression for those guys who just aren't talented enough to play the outside positions. 

Thanks everyone...especially JBR.  After reading this thread, I am more comfortable with Morley as our new centre.  He comes accross as a smart guy, so should have no problems reading defenses etc.  Seems like the big thing is the centre to QB snap. 

Cedric Gagné-Marcoux is a free-agent and I believe he hasn't retired yet. A vet OL, played C, and played under Bellefuille. Maybe Walters can sign him.

Why didn't he play in 2013?

Why didn't he play in 2013?

Easy answer would be because no one signed him.

Why didn't he play in 2013?

Easy answer would be because no one signed him.

That must mean he's not very good then! In that case the Bombers must be trying to sign him to a multi year contract! lol

Never well liked by his teammates has been the issue

Never well liked by his teammates has been the issue

So tell him to get counseling on how to be a nice guy and go from there. Perhaps he could get some sensitivity training from Richie Incognito.

Walters mentioned in his presser that 2 of the top OL prospects in this years draft are centers. Lavertu is one. Who is the other...Goossen?

Yes, Goosen is a center. 

I wonder if Kyle is able to finagle a move up the ladder if he sees Goosen is still available? He's got a few later round picks to dangle, plus Cauchy...

Its good to know we'll at least be getting a good Center prospect.

Its good to know we'll at least be getting a good Center prospect.

It's good to know that we won't have Mack forcing the Bombers to take a WR or LB prospect instead of an OL this year. Load up on OL!