Blue Bombers - 2025 Regular Season - Discussion Thread

[Booch]

5 minutes ago, Noeller said:

And this is a big reason why I don't think we necessarily need to throw the baby out with the bathwater. If the Stamps can turn it around with the same management then so can we.

That management and coach shifted how they do it...the smugness here hasn't and from anything he says...and how he acts...Likely won't 

 

2 minutes ago, Blue28 said:

Interesting discussion.

I agree that the HC has significant impact in what type of players/who the GM drafts and signs. The GM is not going to sign someone the HC will not play - does not make economic sense. 

I agree we have spent significant time living in 2019-2022 - and staying consistent with our approach.

We should all acknowledge (and hopefully the powers that be) - that i) we have been unlucky/unwise with the free agent signings, ii) we have held on to some players far past their best before dates, iii) have had some significant injury woes,  iv) seemingly utilized poor roster management, and v) made a questionable choice on OC.

I don't think that the Bombers are at the 'fire everyone' stage, even though as fans we are frustrated, with that frustration stemming from a 'stay the course' attitude - instead of innovating, stagnating. We see from the outside looking in - that the organization seems to be unwilling to evolve. 

Miller/Walters/Osh would be better off to become a bit flexible, be willing to accept a bit of change.

I have been pretty frustrated - but I don't want to go back to the Reinbold years, and almost 30 years without a cup. The understand we are going to lose - but we should not lose due to effort, planning or leadership. 

If Miller/Walters/Osh make strides to better decision making - I will be happy - even if we don't make the playoffs. You can't expect some of the older players to play like all-stars all the time, but one should expect that you have someone rostered who can spell them off - so they are fresh.

Apologies for the rant!

First step in change is almost always the HC...that's where u start...past history...good or bad be damned...means nothing looking forward

[Blue28]

1 minute ago, Booch said:

That management and coach shifted how they do it...the smugness here hasn't and from anything he says...and how he acts...Likely won't 

 

First step in change is almost always the HC...that's where u start...past history...good or bad be damned...means nothing looking forward

I would be good if they just fired Hogan first - just to show some spirit. Hogan's play calling (if not design) leaves much to be appreciated... maybe he will improve... unlikely...

[Booch]

2 minutes ago, Blue28 said:

I would be good if they just fired Hogan first - just to show some spirit. Hogan's play calling (if not design) leaves much to be appreciated... maybe he will improve... unlikely...

Or just demote him...or to save face...as we know Osh won't admit he screwed up...another flaw...just promote Jackson and have them both as co-offensive coordinators

The expectation that Hogan wouldn't struggle and look way out of his element with zero real relevant experience was a fools game from the start

We dragged our feet way to long announcing a hire...Osh said we in no hurry and its all good...pretty much into free agency...prob a good reason why we maybe didnt land one of those top WR that were Free agents...they wanna know who they gonna be playing for...or the guy we promoted got a big ol no thanks from them...as players aren't stupid either

[17to85]

I might have said this before, but basically in 2019ish guys like Thomas and Kramdi were depth pieces, now they're starters... canadian talent fell and I don't really see their plan to improve it. Sure Wallace is an up and comer, but neufeld is on his last legs, Kolankowski never had any legs to start with... Eli been her a while and never gets to start... Brady and demski sure they're great, but demski is not young, clercius good young... but we're looking at a couple nice young pieces, a few older guys and then a lot of meh.... since apparently the linebackers we drafted are just special teamers...

[wbbfan]

33 minutes ago, Tracker said:

You do not have to go far to see CFL examples in the CFL of rapid turnarounds. Calgary, the Riders and TiCats to be exact, and Dickinson rebuilt his team while filling the roles of GM and head coach and spoon-feeding his brother, Why can't we have nice things any more?

Thing is, both those teams fell backwards into MOP level QBs. Like we did late in 19. But who would be available for that type of swing going forward? Zach was hit double-digit times in the LDC, which is the worst case for any QB. How much longer can he hold up under that kind of barrage? Even at that, his arm is just barely enough to get by on deep balls now. We have no margin for error with him now, and no foreseable escape plan at QB. 

32 minutes ago, Mark H. said:

IMO, there have been 2 major shifts in philosophy:

On D, less focus on pressure and more coverage. Richie Hall brought far more pressure, even though he usually had a better secondary than they have now.

On O, more downfield passing and less bully bull 

On STs, interestingly enough, they gone back to more the aggressive style of play we used to see.

Yep, I think both came as a forced evolution due to the fact that neither line is capable of bully ball. 

Hall used to be able to get pressure with 4 guys. it took a while to get the guys able to fit that need, and people hated his soft saggy coverage. But when we had enough guys to rotate through and get pressure with 5 or less his D flourished. 

On O, we went from a team that could run on any one, to a team that could run on most teams, to now a team that can only run on weak run Ds. 

 

31 minutes ago, Noeller said:

And this is a big reason why I don't think we necessarily need to throw the baby out with the bathwater. If the Stamps can turn it around with the same management then so can we.

I don't think full scale blows ups and lengthy rebuilds work out very well in the CFL. But in order to turn it around you 1, have to be willing to spend top dollars on other teams FAs, and 2, find your self with a QB who can win and has enough tread on the tires to play your window of compeitition. I don't think we have either of those factors right now. 

 

27 minutes ago, Tracker said:

O'Shea has repeatedly demonstrated that he is rigid in his thinking and thus resistant to change or criticism. His personality is such that, if pressured, he will double down.

100%. And Walters has shown a reluctance to put on his big boy pants with mos. 

[Mark H.]

@Booch a warning is not a ban. No further comment 

[Booch]

8 minutes ago, Mark H. said:

@Booch a warning is not a ban. No further comment 

Well coukdnt post...so hence...banned from posting....no further comment

[Mark H.]

16 minutes ago, Booch said:

Well coukdnt post...so hence...banned from posting....no further comment

Ok, then I clicked the wrong button, my apologies

[Goalie]

Is this site real cuz I’m a bit mind blown reading some of this stuff from a few of you. I mean the posters who refuse to accept criticism or refuse to actually acknowledge they could be wrong In their opinions don’t like O’Shea cuz he’s smug arrogant and I quote “O'Shea has repeatedly demonstrated that he is rigid in his thinking and thus resistant to change or criticism. His personality is such that, if pressured, he will double down.”  He’s just like you guys who complain the most about him. 

[wbbfan]

19 minutes ago, Goalie said:

Is this site real cuz I’m a bit mind blown reading some of this stuff from a few of you. I mean the posters who refuse to accept criticism or refuse to actually acknowledge they could be wrong In their opinions don’t like O’Shea cuz he’s smug arrogant and I quote “O'Shea has repeatedly demonstrated that he is rigid in his thinking and thus resistant to change or criticism. His personality is such that, if pressured, he will double down.”  He’s just like you guys who complain the most about him. 

Sports attract hard-headed people; how else would sports or teams survive dark eras like the Reinbold, Kelly, etc? 

That said, a higher standard of conduct is to be expected from a professional in any field. Especially in a customer-facing entertainment field. And I don't think that is some crazy, unfair expectation. HCs don't need to be amiable; plenty of the most successful coaches have been grumpy at the best of times. But any HC in any pro sport needs to be able to grow and change with time in order to survive. 

[bigg jay]

2 hours ago, Noeller said:

And this is a big reason why I don't think we necessarily need to throw the baby out with the bathwater. If the Stamps can turn it around with the same management then so can we.

Stamps management was willing to make major changes where ours has been reluctant to do that. Yeah we made (or were forced to make) a couple moves but there definitely could/should have been more.  

[Mike]

1 hour ago, Goalie said:

Is this site real cuz I’m a bit mind blown reading some of this stuff from a few of you. I mean the posters who refuse to accept criticism or refuse to actually acknowledge they could be wrong In their opinions don’t like O’Shea cuz he’s smug arrogant and I quote “O'Shea has repeatedly demonstrated that he is rigid in his thinking and thus resistant to change or criticism. His personality is such that, if pressured, he will double down.”  He’s just like you guys who complain the most about him. 

Literally the most self unaware person ever lol 

[Booch]

32 minutes ago, bigg jay said:

Stamps management was willing to make major changes where ours has been reluctant to do that. Yeah we made (or were forced to make) a couple moves but there definitely could/should have been more.  

being forced....and having the foresight and planning to do so, and actually see your weaknesses before they kill you.......2 different things

[Deiter Fan]

3 hours ago, Noeller said:

And this is a big reason why I don't think we necessarily need to throw the baby out with the bathwater. If the Stamps can turn it around with the same management then so can we.

Unfortunately not everyone is capable of that sort of introspection and change. I look at it from a perspective of what I know (broadcasting/announcing) but I'm sure we could all point to people in our given professions who are just not capable of making changes to their process. At some point in their past they enjoyed a measure of success and decided there was never a need to change.

I look at someone like Rod Smith. He is who he is. Someone gave him a job which reinforced his confidence in his style/process and he has never changed his style and he never will. Unfortunately he really isn't very good. He may have been good enough when he was hired for his first PBP gig...but he's never even bothered to considered improving/changing. So we get endless repetition of already mentioned stats/facts and non sequiturs.

MOS is who he is. He's had success being who he is. I think he feels confident that his process is fine and needs no modification. In his mind if there's issues they lie outside of him and his process.

[Booch]

Looking at our PR....there is probably 6 guys on it who are better and would offer more than what we rostered last game,,,,and we wonder why oir depth seems so shitty and our main guys at times appear to be gassed

If some those main guys were now back-ups, or in rotation and some the dead weight was not rostered...we'd be a helluva lot better

We sat Woods, Adams, J.Jones, Houston, Peterson, Echols 

I'm sure dumping some of or all of Logan, Cobb, Thomas, Lawson Jr. Ayers, Ball, Weitz for those guys would have not hurt us...likely made us immensely better, deeper....

[Mark H.]

The Stamps are putting together a good season with a QB who's slightly above average

Ironically, our QB is better by quite a bit

[Pete]

10 minutes ago, Mark H. said:

The Stamps are putting together a good season with a QB who's slightly above average

Ironically, our QB is better by quite a bit

A look at their offseason signings/  moves explains a lot, even taking the adams acquisition out:

Acquired 

Orimolade - an all cfl end

Green - Starting Canadian corner

Webb - all cfl db (impact on their secondary similar to when we first got Alexander)

T Jones, - dependable low cost reciever

Rhymes - the list goes on

Compare that to Mitchell,White,Logan, Jones, Hagarty, Vaughters etc.

 

 

Edited 21 hours ago by Pete

[wbbfan]

41 minutes ago, Mark H. said:

The Stamps are putting together a good season with a QB who's slightly above average

Ironically, our QB is better by quite a bit

vaj isn’t slightly above average. he hasn’t been that guy since he got to bc. 

We don’t though. on just 4 more attempts vaj has almost 500 more yards, 10.1 yards per vs 8.5, 105.9 qbr vs 98.5, 15/8 vs 13/11. Mop is likely between harris and vaj. 

[Mark H.]

1 minute ago, wbbfan said:

vaj isn’t slightly above average. he hasn’t been that guy since he got to bc. 

We don’t though. on just 4 more attempts vaj has almost 500 more yards, 10.1 yards per vs 8.5, 105.9 qbr vs 98.5, 15/8 vs 13/11. Mop is likely between harris and vaj. 

To heck with stats or MOP awards. ZC played better than Vaj or Harris this weekend. When you conpare what he has to work with, he's the better QB. Based on this past weekend's games, in particular.

[wbbfan]

3 hours ago, Mark H. said:

To heck with stats or MOP awards. ZC played better than Vaj or Harris this weekend. When you conpare what he has to work with, he's the better QB. Based on this past weekend's games, in particular.

one game sure. the season or the last year and a half? no. compare best games to best games this year and still nope. 

[SpeedFlex27]

11 hours ago, Booch said:

IN pro football...a HC will let his G.M and scouting staff know what kind of player and skill set he looking for for about 80 percent of his roster....and the staff will also bring some in outliers they like to fill it out, as well as some prospects....Thats how it works

The G.M for the most part isnt out bird dogging either.....not his role. He's more the make it work within budget/sms guy and completes all the trans actions

He does not cut guys going over the head of the Coach...nor forces guys on field at the behest of his HC

The roster we have/had is the vison of Osh...Not the scouting staff and G.M.....Sure there are some variances here and there and some other circumstances (guys falling in your lap..etc) but they miniscule at best

I sure with some questionable stuff there is discussion about it but if the HC sells his point they gonna trust him until that trust wears thin....are we there now?...who knows

Top to bottom our staff has failed in several capacities the last 3..4 yrs...G.M to H.C....and they reason/problem/disconnect needs to be figured out lickity split or we gonna see this trend continue 

The frustrating part save for the real lack of urgency this yr in player signings, or lack there of and coaching...waiting well into new yr for an O.C only to promote a guy totally not ready/qualified for the job, os that we continue to make a lot of the same stupid mistakes/moves over..and over...and over.....which lends one to think this crew in current format has hit it's best before date and has no answer now and needs to be rebooted

No, needs to get the boot,,,

[GCn20]

On 2025-09-02 at 10:13 AM, Booch said:

IN pro football...a HC will let his G.M and scouting staff know what kind of player and skill set he looking for for about 80 percent of his roster....and the staff will also bring some in outliers they like to fill it out, as well as some prospects....Thats how it works

The G.M for the most part isnt out bird dogging either.....not his role. He's more the make it work within budget/sms guy and completes all the trans actions

He does not cut guys going over the head of the Coach...nor forces guys on field at the behest of his HC

The roster we have/had is the vison of Osh...Not the scouting staff and G.M.....Sure there are some variances here and there and some other circumstances (guys falling in your lap..etc) but they miniscule at best

I sure with some questionable stuff there is discussion about it but if the HC sells his point they gonna trust him until that trust wears thin....are we there now?...who knows

Top to bottom our staff has failed in several capacities the last 3..4 yrs...G.M to H.C....and they reason/problem/disconnect needs to be figured out lickity split or we gonna see this trend continue 

The frustrating part save for the real lack of urgency this yr in player signings, or lack there of and coaching...waiting well into new yr for an O.C only to promote a guy totally not ready/qualified for the job, os that we continue to make a lot of the same stupid mistakes/moves over..and over...and over.....which lends one to think this crew in current format has hit it's best before date and has no answer now and needs to be rebooted

Kyle Walters absolutely bird dogs for the Bombers in Ontario. Absolutely nothing wrong with a coach discussing his needs with his GM. If the GM does not find the player, or bypasses a better player to listen to his coaches wants that is still 100% the fault of the GM. None of you guys will convince me that the talent signed by the GM isn't 100% his responsibility. It goes beyond logic to think otherwise. To suggest the HC pulls the strings on who Walters ultimately signs is ludicrous. Does OSH have input, absolutely, bottom line is it's Walters decision. His decisions have not been good lately.

It is beyond moronic to try and put the loss of Lawler or other all stars onto MOS. Contract negs are 100% the domain of Walters and he did not get it done for us and he could have. PERIOD. NO OTHER REALITY EXISTS.

Edited 4 hours ago by GCn20

[wbbfan]

4 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

Kyle Walters absolutely bird dogs for the Bombers in Ontario. Absolutely nothing wrong with a coach discussing his needs with his GM. If the GM does not find the player, or bypasses a better player to listen to his coaches wants that is still 100% the fault of the GM. None of you guys will convince me that the talent signed by the GM isn't 100% his responsibility. It goes beyond logic to think otherwise. To suggest the HC pulls the strings on who Walters ultimately signs is ludicrous. Does OSH have input, absolutely, bottom line is it's Walters decision. His decisions have not been good lately.

I'm a bit split on that.

On one hand, the gm is ultimately the one responsible for on field product. If he defers to the HC (and I think walters does to mos), and it doens't work out, the gm is as much to blame as the hc. 

I think rookie talent has been where it needs to be in this and the last camp. Not as much the prior year. Even when I look at the current roster, Vaval has been drastically better as a kr than Logan ever has. Logan has been a bust on offence (doesn't look right at all currently.) and peterson has been better for certain.

Adams and Woods are our 2 best DTs by a lot, but are on the PR.

We'd be better off with houston or woodey playing the db reps vaval has gotten, and probably lawson jr too. 

person has been our best Dl and played the fewest snaps. 

We've got young, athletic defenders who make an impact when given a chance in Jjones, shay, smith, and ayers, but we won't let them grow into and over take vets. 

We've wasted soo many final roster spots on guys like korny, Weitz etc but refuse to give bailey a look. \

We keep guys like case kicking around for no reason as well. 

Thats all on mos, and thats before you get into the can of worms that is thomas/kola. 

 

I think the easiest way to fix the problem with the mafia, is to shake up the top end. I think it's easier to find a GM, than a HC, and a gm who would actually be MOS' boss holding him responsible could get him back on the right track possibly. I also don't think we are approaching a point where the only way forward is firing a mafia guy, I think it's long past.  

[Booch]

28 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

Kyle Walters absolutely bird dogs for the Bombers in Ontario. Absolutely nothing wrong with a coach discussing his needs with his GM. If the GM does not find the player, or bypasses a better player to listen to his coaches wants that is still 100% the fault of the GM. None of you guys will convince me that the talent signed by the GM isn't 100% his responsibility. It goes beyond logic to think otherwise. To suggest the HC pulls the strings on who Walters ultimately signs is ludicrous. Does OSH have input, absolutely, bottom line is it's Walters decision. His decisions have not been good lately.

It is beyond moronic to try and put the loss of Lawler or other all stars onto MOS. Contract negs are 100% the domain of Walters and he did not get it done for us and he could have. PERIOD. NO OTHER REALITY EXISTS.

Well really...whats in ontario? Draft prospects...not legit free agents with pro experience or NFL looks kicking around...I agree on that tho...he looks at cis guys there

And stand pat on the notion that osh for some of his good qualities is a shitty evaluator of actual talent or upside...and or values the wrong things over true talent at times

[bearpants]

19 hours ago, bigg jay said:

Stamps management was willing to make major changes where ours has been reluctant to do that. Yeah we made (or were forced to make) a couple moves but there definitely could/should have been more.  

 

19 hours ago, Booch said:

being forced....and having the foresight and planning to do so, and actually see your weaknesses before they kill you.......2 different things

Calgary completely bottomed out... to suggest they weren't forced to make wholesale changes is revisionist.... Hopefully the Bombers can and do make major changes before the bottom falls out, like it did in Calgary