Canadian Politics

[Mark H.]

30 minutes ago, TrueBlue4ever said:

Point is that this is the clip the reporter is basing his statement on, and he’s not incorrect. Like so much of media, sound bites and spin can warp perspective to tailor a narrative to suit a skewed perspective and create confirmation bias. 

I can also find clips and sources that tell me the world is flat.

[TrueBlue4ever]

50 minutes ago, Mark H. said:

I can also find clips and sources that tell me the world is flat.

True. And actual video showing a boat fall off the edge would be more persuasive than just hearing it. Even if that video was out of context. 

[Mark H.]

38 minutes ago, TrueBlue4ever said:

True. And actual video showing a boat fall off the edge would be more persuasive than just hearing it. Even if that video was out of context. 

The point should be to research the entire story. This is exactly the kind of misleading crap that fuels things like the anti - vax movement. All she did was stop clapping first. 

[TrueBlue4ever]

6 minutes ago, Mark H. said:

The point should be to research the entire story. This is exactly the kind of misleading crap that fuels things like the anti - vax movement. All she did was stop clapping first. 

Agreed, important to show all the clips. It is weird to see that one though where everyone is clapping and she isn’t though, and it is like that for a few seconds. Maybe she started late or finished early, who knows. 

[bigg jay]

Just now, TrueBlue4ever said:

Agreed, important to show all the clips. It is weird to see that one though where everyone is clapping and she isn’t though, and it is like that for a few seconds. Maybe she started late or finished early, who knows. 

In that twitter clip, there's at least 4-5 others not clapping so to single her out or portray it as she was the only one not clapping, isn't right either.

[Bigblue204]

2 hours ago, GCn20 said:

LMAO. That is boogey man politics of the highest quality right there. The CPC is not now, and never will be coming after medicare. No political party in Canada ever will. It is political suicide. I don't understand why people equate private clinics, or extension and expansions of current health care by private enterprise as health care being privatized. There can certainly be a healthy balance of public and private medical services paid for by a medicare system. Healthcare becomes privatized when we allow it to go to the highest bidder and set it's own rates for reimbursement of services while eliminating public owned medical services, if set up properly a public/private owned health care service delivery does not do anything but enhance.

Technically I agree with you. However, once you add in humans (especially those in charge of making change/progress/being leaders) to that equation it's literally only a matter of time before the system is corrupted. I think that's what a lot of people fear, and rightfully so. I have absolutely zero faith in our governments ability to keep corruption out of anything.
 

17 minutes ago, bigg jay said:

In that twitter clip, there's at least 4-5 others not clapping so to single her out or portray it as she was the only one not clapping, isn't right either.

I actually think it IS warranted. She isn't just another politician. She is the "leader" of a major political party, one that has very recently come under fire for their support of the convoy. The same convoy who apparently has a lot of members supporting russia. The way the world works now, she needs to be very conscious of what she is or is not doing when it comes to showing support or not for any given cause.

[GCn20]

49 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

Technically I agree with you. However, once you add in humans (especially those in charge of making change/progress/being leaders) to that equation it's literally only a matter of time before the system is corrupted. I think that's what a lot of people fear, and rightfully so. I have absolutely zero faith in our governments ability to keep corruption out of anything.
 

I actually think it IS warranted. She isn't just another politician. She is the "leader" of a major political party, one that has very recently come under fire for their support of the convoy. The same convoy who apparently has a lot of members supporting russia. The way the world works now, she needs to be very conscious of what she is or is not doing when it comes to showing support or not for any given cause.

On your first point, if your argument is that politicians are corrupt therefore we should not allow private health care to co-exist with public, then I have to ask what you think prevents politicians from the same level of corruption in public health care? 

On your 2nd point, while I agree that Ms. Bergen, and any other political leader, needs to be always on guard to their public perception the tweet and the premise of it is bizarre really. Just gross that some clown has to make a tweet like that. Ms. Bergen spoke passionately and earnestly about her party's and all of Canada's unwavering support of Ukraine and how Canada should be doing more. As for a LOT of members supporting Russia from the convoy...did someone poll them or something? There are a few on the left of the political spectrum that support Russia as well. I will cede that it was very stupid for any of the polticians to give even tacit support to the convoy though.

Edited March 16, 2022 by GCn20

[Bigblue204]

2 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

On your first point, if your argument is that politicians are corrupt therefore we should not allow private health care to co-exist with public, then I have to ask what you think prevents politicians from the same level of corruption in public health care? 

On your 2nd point, while I agree that Ms. Bergen, and any other political leader, needs to be always on guard to their public perception the tweet and the premise of it is bizarre really. Just gross that some clown has to make a tweet like that. Ms. Bergen spoke passionately and earnestly about her party's and all of Canada's unwavering support of Ukraine and how Canada should be doing more. As for a LOT of members supporting Russia from the convoy...did someone poll them or something? There are a few on the left of the political spectrum that support Russia as well. I will cede that it was very stupid for any of the polticians to give even tacit support to the convoy though.

I didn't say there was no corruption. That's actually kind of my point. We as a society are essentially incapable of keeping corruption out. It's inevitable at pretty much every level of society. Some systems hide it better than others and CAN have checks and balances in place to keep it from getting completely out of control (see our healthcare system), but that usually involves voting and not relying on the free market to decide. And no I do not have an answer to that situation that wouldn't involve loads of chaos. The truth still stands though.

[GCn20]

18 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

I didn't say there was no corruption. That's actually kind of my point. We as a society are essentially incapable of keeping corruption out. It's inevitable at pretty much every level of society. Some systems hide it better than others and CAN have checks and balances in place to keep it from getting completely out of control (see our healthcare system), but that usually involves voting and not relying on the free market to decide. And no I do not have an answer to that situation that wouldn't involve loads of chaos. The truth still stands though.

I agree with you. A private/Public mix of healthcare would have to be set up properly to eliminate as many avenues for corruption as possible for sure. I just don't think that it should be automatically viewed as evil if private clinics etc. pop up. So long as a strong and efficient public funded and operated system coincides with it, why does anyone care if private clinics or hospitals for that matter exist? I hear a lot of grousing about two tiered health care but if someone wants to pay out of pocket to get better health care and it is available why does this threaten public health care? With the caveat, that the public health care system remains robustly funded and accessible to all who cannot afford it I see no threat to our current system at all. I see problems for unions in this, I see opportunity for fear mongering, but that is all.

Edited March 16, 2022 by GCn20

[Bigblue204]

13 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

I agree with you. A private/Public mix of healthcare would have to be set up properly to eliminate as many avenues for corruption as possible for sure. I just don't think that it should be automatically viewed as evil if private clinics etc. pop up. So long as a strong and efficient public funded and operated system coincides with it, why does anyone care if private clinics or hospitals for that matter exist? I hear a lot of grousing about two tiered health care but if someone wants to pay out of pocket to get better health care and it is available why does this threaten public health care? With the caveat, that the public health care system remains robustly funded and accessible to all who cannot afford it I see no threat to our current system at all. I see problems for unions in this, I see opportunity for fear mongering, but that is all.

The biggest concern is quality of care. Private clinics would likely have the opportunity to pay their employees (doctors/nurses etc) more than a publicly funded one. Meaning the best doctors etc would only be available to those who could afford to pay for them...and if it starts snowballing eventually you're left with a public system that is over worked, understaffed and under qualified. Even if the public system is well funded it likely won't be able to compete with a free market.
I had a family friend who moved south a few decades ago because she got a job offer from a hospital in chicago to do the same job but doubled her salary (I actually believe it was a bit more than doubled) and payed for the moving expenses including their rent until they found a house they liked. Now obviously that anecdotal but it's the premise people worry about.

[rebusrankin]

30 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

The biggest concern is quality of care. Private clinics would likely have the opportunity to pay their employees (doctors/nurses etc) more than a publicly funded one. Meaning the best doctors etc would only be available to those who could afford to pay for them...and if it starts snowballing eventually you're left with a public system that is over worked, understaffed and under qualified. Even if the public system is well funded it likely won't be able to compete with a free market.
I had a family friend who moved south a few decades ago because she got a job offer from a hospital in chicago to do the same job but doubled her salary (I actually believe it was a bit more than doubled) and payed for the moving expenses including their rent until they found a house they liked. Now obviously that anecdotal but it's the premise people worry about.

Australia, New Zealand, UK, France have public/private systems that seem to work. I know in Australia, if you pay for a private MRI, you are also funding the cost of a MRI in the public system.

[Bigblue204]

8 minutes ago, rebusrankin said:

Australia, New Zealand, UK, France have public/private systems that seem to work. I know in Australia, if you pay for a private MRI, you are also funding the cost of a MRI in the public system.

Funny I was actually thinking about making the Private clinics/profits pay into the public funding. That actually seems like a pretty solid way to keep things fairly even.

[rebusrankin]

I am not an expert and certainly can't give an in depth look but I know several countries have mixed systems that seem to function better than ours. I think its worth a look. Personally if I needed an MRI etc and could speed up the timeline by paying, even if it meant paying for all or part of an MRI in the public system, I would do it if I could.

[HardCoreBlue]

56 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

The biggest concern is quality of care. Private clinics would likely have the opportunity to pay their employees (doctors/nurses etc) more than a publicly funded one. Meaning the best doctors etc would only be available to those who could afford to pay for them...and if it starts snowballing eventually you're left with a public system that is over worked, understaffed and under qualified. Even if the public system is well funded it likely won't be able to compete with a free market.
I had a family friend who moved south a few decades ago because she got a job offer from a hospital in chicago to do the same job but doubled her salary (I actually believe it was a bit more than doubled) and payed for the moving expenses including their rent until they found a house they liked. Now obviously that anecdotal but it's the premise people worry about.

Yup, the crux of the issue described in seven words.

[WildPath]

I can't for the life of me figure out how to embed a tweet anymore, but this is disgusting:

FullSizeRender (streamable.com)

Stefanson's response just screams out of touch to me.

[rebusrankin]

Horrible response. I really hope they lose that by election and that they're out in 2023. Notice Friesen and Gordon sitting there mindlessly smiling.

[Tracker]

1 hour ago, rebusrankin said:

I am not an expert and certainly can't give an in depth look but I know several countries have mixed systems that seem to function better than ours. I think its worth a look. Personally if I needed an MRI etc and could speed up the timeline by paying, even if it meant paying for all or part of an MRI in the public system, I would do it if I could.

Anyone that wants SAP medical service can head down to the US. The biggest arguments against private medical care is that immediately you create a two-tier system and experience has shown that for-profit medical care prizes profit at the expense of providing care.  This has been revealed in the nursing home infections/death rates in private care homes here in Manitoba vs public not-for-profit facilities, and the Australian experience has been similar. My wife had a mother in a private care facility in Ontario, and it was a bad experience.

[Bigblue204]

20 minutes ago, WildPath said:

I can't for the life of me figure out how to embed a tweet anymore, but this is disgusting:

FullSizeRender (streamable.com)

Stefanson's response just screams out of touch to me.

Again, we REALLY need a WTAF button. cause What the actual **** was that? Wow that was in such poor taste.

[Tracker]

26 minutes ago, WildPath said:

I can't for the life of me figure out how to embed a tweet anymore, but this is disgusting:

FullSizeRender (streamable.com)

Stefanson's response just screams out of touch to me.

Agreed. I think she was probably chosen to be a sacrificial offering. She has been so inept as to get people to forget how bad Pallister was, yet better than she has been. Any PC leader who can string sentences together and not crap all over themselves will look good by comparison.  Its the only card the PCs have to play.

Edited March 16, 2022 by Tracker

[bigg jay]

46 minutes ago, WildPath said:

I can't for the life of me figure out how to embed a tweet anymore, but this is disgusting:

FullSizeRender (streamable.com)

Stefanson's response just screams out of touch to me.

 

[Bigblue204]

More on the CPC will never go after public health:

https://twitter.com/doreennicoll61/status/1504114985382862849?t=R7yVzppBJ_uMR7C2-nqDqA&s=19

[SpeedFlex27]

Anyone follow Max Bernier on twitter? His posts are becoming more unhinged. The Ukraine should be left to the Russians. The War isn't real. Everything is a conspiracy. Every  politician in Canada but him is a member of the World Economic Forum & Klaus Schwab is Enemy Number 1. The man is dangerous & I see more & more people seemingly agreeing with his hatred & rhetoric everyday on Twitter.

The man to me, is a threat to our security as a nation. He's also a nutbar. A dangerous nutbar. His wwords are working up his base into a frenzy as far as I can see. To think this guy was Canada's Foreign Affairs Minister & then wanted to be leader of the CPC is chilling. He's becoming more & more radicalized. 

Edited March 16, 2022 by SpeedFlex27

[Tracker]

2 hours ago, Bigblue204 said:

More on the CPC will never go after public health:

https://twitter.com/doreennicoll61/status/1504114985382862849?t=R7yVzppBJ_uMR7C2-nqDqA&s=19

A Tory doing Tory things. Nothing to see here. Move along now.

[HardCoreBlue]

3 hours ago, bigg jay said:

 

Wow. It’s like if any of us at work were in the boardroom, meeting room, lunchroom whatever and someone asked us to say a few words to help comfort a colleague who lost a child and we start off by celebrating our sons football championship win or daughters hockey championship win. What in actual f. Show some class, some empathy. Your timing to share a proud parent moment sucked royally. 

[SpeedFlex27]