Rich

I don't think the two are mutually exclusive.  
 
Yes, I think winning is job #1 and I think they understand that.
 
They also realize that creating a fun environment and listening to what their fan base wants is another avenue towards success.  It really does take both.  You can argue whether or not bringing the beer snake back is creating a "fun environment".   But I think it represents more the gesture then whether or not it will actually sell more tickets.  It is trying to say we value you us customers to our product and we will try to give you and entertain you in the way you want to be entertained (as long as they can do it safely), rather then a take it or leave it proposition.   They are trying to put the "fun" back into going to the game.  Trying to make it an event, an atmosphere. 
 
You can see the beginnings of that this year with the party tent outside the stadium before the game.  The DJ "traffic busters" after the game.  Getting fans to raise the flag before each game.  Getting people to stand and cheer on all kick-offs.  It is all part of a bigger picture to create a culture and atmosphere that people enjoy and want to be a part of.  (Even though a lot of it is copied from Seattle)   Some of it will work, some of it won't.  But at least they are trying different things.
 
Of course they want to win and build a winner.  But nothing is guaranteed.  Sure they believe the right people are in place to do the job or they wouldn't be there.  But we really don't know if they CAN do the job for another year or two (whether you want to hear that or not).   Nothing, especially in professional sports, is certain.  
 
So yes, they are trying to build a winner.  But that doesn't mean they can't try and build a fun atmosphere outside of that.  It is only smart business to hedge your bets like that.  And in a perfect world, when the team starts winning, and all of these things they are trying combine together, IGF will be an amazing, fun rocking place to be. And when the younger fans go and experience that first hand .... that is how you build long term support of the club.

As someone who doesn't care about the beer snake or section S one way or another, I find it extremely nitpicky to be upset that they happened to announce a change in policy.  How are people supposed to know otherwise?  Seems like the introduction of a "student" section is something that people would have to know about for it to actually work.

I don't think the two are mutually exclusive.  
 
Yes, I think winning is job #1 and I think they understand that.
 
They also realize that creating a fun environment and listening to what their fan base wants is another avenue towards success.  It really does take both.  You can argue whether or not bringing the beer snake back is creating a "fun environment".   But I think it represents more the gesture then whether or not it will actually sell more tickets.  It is trying to say we value you us customers to our product and we will try to give you and entertain you in the way you want to be entertained (as long as they can do it safely), rather then a take it or leave it proposition.   They are trying to put the "fun" back into going to the game.  Trying to make it an event, an atmosphere. 
 
You can see the beginnings of that this year with the party tent outside the stadium before the game.  The DJ "traffic busters" after the game.  Getting fans to raise the flag before each game.  Getting people to stand and cheer on all kick-offs.  It is all part of a bigger picture to create a culture and atmosphere that people enjoy and want to be a part of.  (Even though a lot of it is copied from Seattle)   Some of it will work, some of it won't.  But at least they are trying different things.
 
Of course they want to win and build a winner.  But nothing is guaranteed.  Sure they believe the right people are in place to do the job or they wouldn't be there.  But we really don't know if they CAN do the job for another year or two (whether you want to hear that or not).   Nothing, especially in professional sports, is certain.  
 
So yes, they are trying to build a winner.  But that doesn't mean they can't try and build a fun atmosphere outside of that.  It is only smart business to hedge your bets like that.  And in a perfect world, when the team starts winning, and all of these things they are trying combine together, IGF will be an amazing, fun rocking place to be. And when the younger fans go and experience that first hand .... that is how you build long term support of the club.

I don't think the two are mutually exclusive.  
 
Yes, I think winning is job #1 and I think they understand that.
 
They also realize that creating a fun environment and listening to what their fan base wants is another avenue towards success.  It really does take both.  You can argue whether or not bringing the beer snake back is creating a "fun environment".   But I think it represents more the gesture then whether or not it will actually sell more tickets.  It is trying to say we value you us customers to our product and we will try to give you and entertain you in the way you want to be entertained (as long as they can do it safely), rather then a take it or leave it proposition.   They are trying to put the "fun" back into going to the game.  Trying to make it an event, an atmosphere. 
 
You can see the beginnings of that this year with the party tent outside the stadium before the game.  The DJ "traffic busters" after the game.  Getting fans to raise the flag before each game.  Getting people to stand and cheer on all kick-offs.  It is all part of a bigger picture to create a culture and atmosphere that people enjoy and want to be a part of.  (Even though a lot of it is copied from Seattle)   Some of it will work, some of it won't.  But at least they are trying different things.
 
Of course they want to win and build a winner.  But nothing is guaranteed.  Sure they believe the right people are in place to do the job or they wouldn't be there.  But we really don't know if they CAN do the job for another year or two (whether you want to hear that or not).   Nothing, especially in professional sports, is certain.  
 
So yes, they are trying to build a winner.  But that doesn't mean they can't try and build a fun atmosphere outside of that.  It is only smart business to hedge your bets like that.  And in a perfect world, when the team starts winning, and all of these things they are trying combine together, IGF will be an amazing, fun rocking place to be. And when the younger fans go and experience that first hand .... that is how you build long term support of the club.

I think Mike takes care of those types of problems....  

This is a message board.  When has that ever stopped anyone?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_CFL_Draft
 
It really depends on what the conditions were on what the Brohm and Portis trades were.    Can't see Portis being a 2nd round pick given playing time.  It was reported that the Brohm trade was at least a 4th rounder.  Don't know what the high end was, or what the conditions were.
 
We do get an extra 4th rounder from the Alex Hall deal from SK.

At the very least, Bucknor is the type of guy where even if his spot is upgraded and isn’t a starter next year, he has proven he is capable of stepping in.
 
His presence on the roster allows for an injury replacement in game from a Canadian if a DB goes down.
 
He isn’t a must sign, but it is guys like this that build the depth for a championship team.  And this team really needs to keep all the NI depth it can.
 
Special Teams wise, he only has 1 tackle on record.  Have to admit though, I never really watched for him on special teams to assess his play.

I believe it is a combination of scheme and players.  Yes, we could get better play from our front 4.
 
But a lot of Etch's schemes involve putting a large number of players on the LOS for confusion.  Sometimes it is an all out blitz, sometimes they drop back in coverage.
 
When we are blitzing, we need to get more pressure on the QB consistently.   This wasn't always the case in the later half of the year.
 
When we are dropping back into coverage, this is when we are more susceptible to the run, because if the RB makes it past the initial line of attack, we don't have linebackers in a more "classic" formation to cover the running back (because they were on the LOS and are retreating to get back into position), so the running gains tend to be bigger.
 
Personally, I prefer a much more in your face, smash mouth, simple defense.  We do what we do and we do it well.   Something you can deliver like BC when you have players like Elimimian and Bighill to bring the hurt.  I do realize those players don't come along every day, but I prefer that style to the disguise and confuse of Etch.    

I believe it is a combination of scheme and players.  Yes, we could get better play from our front 4.
 
But a lot of Etch's schemes involve putting a large number of players on the LOS for confusion.  Sometimes it is an all out blitz, sometimes they drop back in coverage.
 
When we are blitzing, we need to get more pressure on the QB consistently.   This wasn't always the case in the later half of the year.
 
When we are dropping back into coverage, this is when we are more susceptible to the run, because if the RB makes it past the initial line of attack, we don't have linebackers in a more "classic" formation to cover the running back (because they were on the LOS and are retreating to get back into position), so the running gains tend to be bigger.
 
Personally, I prefer a much more in your face, smash mouth, simple defense.  We do what we do and we do it well.   Something you can deliver like BC when you have players like Elimimian and Bighill to bring the hurt.  I do realize those players don't come along every day, but I prefer that style to the disguise and confuse of Etch.    

I believe it is a combination of scheme and players.  Yes, we could get better play from our front 4.
 
But a lot of Etch's schemes involve putting a large number of players on the LOS for confusion.  Sometimes it is an all out blitz, sometimes they drop back in coverage.
 
When we are blitzing, we need to get more pressure on the QB consistently.   This wasn't always the case in the later half of the year.
 
When we are dropping back into coverage, this is when we are more susceptible to the run, because if the RB makes it past the initial line of attack, we don't have linebackers in a more "classic" formation to cover the running back (because they were on the LOS and are retreating to get back into position), so the running gains tend to be bigger.
 
Personally, I prefer a much more in your face, smash mouth, simple defense.  We do what we do and we do it well.   Something you can deliver like BC when you have players like Elimimian and Bighill to bring the hurt.  I do realize those players don't come along every day, but I prefer that style to the disguise and confuse of Etch.    

Curious on your reasoning for not wanting Brohm back.  Wouldn't it make sense to have your QBs play a similar style in terms of developing plays / game plans / and prep for how you are going to attack an opponent?  So that when the backup has to come in, they can essentially execute the same game plan that was planned for?
 
Or do you look at having the different style as a change of pace QB.  A 1a/b type situation where you can throw a guy in for a different look and have a few designed plays for him to execute.
 
And this isn't meant as a shot against Marve or anything like that.  I really like what I've seen from the guy and do want to see more.  Just curious about your reasoning for dumping Brohm.

3-15 to 7-11 is progress
 
Miller O'Shea and Walters over Garth Mack and Burke is progress'
 
Drew Willy Brian Brohm Robert Marve over Max Hall Justin Goltz Jason Boltus is progress
 
LH over Palardy/Sandro is progress
 
2014 secondary over 2013 secondary is progress
 
2014 draft over 2013 draft is progress
 
There is still progress left to do o-line front seven and coordinators. The key is there is less work to do this offseason than there was last year.

Frankly, you build consistent winners with sound schemes and players who can properly execute them - not with shell games, juggling acts, voodoo, hocus-pocus, and constant gimmickry   Which is why, moving forward - I want Etch out of here, so we can actually recruit guys who will fit in.

Win or lose there was no reason not to be in high spirits. This team has significantly more pieces than it did last year. One win or one loss doesn't change that. It's about being realistic. We're precisely where we should be coming off of a three win year last season. No one is saying it's all sunshine and rainbows. We know there is still lots of work to be done, but ending the season with a win is a nice touch. As for quarterback, Drew Willy is still QB1 here, and he holds the position easily heading into next season as well.

I was cold, I was wet, but I got a high five from Watson, Teague, and Johnny Sears and got some game worn gloves (I think Willys). And saw one of the worst streaks ever mercifully end. Absolutely one of the best days of my life....

sure I understand about Forzani being a good person, and don't mind them covering it in detail, so take the full half time show for it would be fine with me, but they seem to like doing that during the
 
game, 
 
which I don't like.

There is still a large difference between what organizations do internally and say externally to the media.
 
Words are cheap, and in this day and age organizations keep things closer to their vest.
 
I'd be willing to bet that O'Shea, Walters, and Miller aren't at all happy with the way this season has turned out, and are already planning on how to start addressing these things going forward.
 
There are multiple reasons not to to divulge these things in the media, some of them including tipping your hate to the 8 other teams in the league as well as leaving your options open as your plan changes and evolves as you evaluate going forward.
 
Actions will always speak louder then words.  And we really won't know what the leaders of this organization think or where they see problems until training camp next year when we see who they kept, who they released, and where they brought in talent.
 
Whatever is said now is really just lip service, whatever is said.

There is still a large difference between what organizations do internally and say externally to the media.
 
Words are cheap, and in this day and age organizations keep things closer to their vest.
 
I'd be willing to bet that O'Shea, Walters, and Miller aren't at all happy with the way this season has turned out, and are already planning on how to start addressing these things going forward.
 
There are multiple reasons not to to divulge these things in the media, some of them including tipping your hate to the 8 other teams in the league as well as leaving your options open as your plan changes and evolves as you evaluate going forward.
 
Actions will always speak louder then words.  And we really won't know what the leaders of this organization think or where they see problems until training camp next year when we see who they kept, who they released, and where they brought in talent.
 
Whatever is said now is really just lip service, whatever is said.

There is still a large difference between what organizations do internally and say externally to the media.
 
Words are cheap, and in this day and age organizations keep things closer to their vest.
 
I'd be willing to bet that O'Shea, Walters, and Miller aren't at all happy with the way this season has turned out, and are already planning on how to start addressing these things going forward.
 
There are multiple reasons not to to divulge these things in the media, some of them including tipping your hate to the 8 other teams in the league as well as leaving your options open as your plan changes and evolves as you evaluate going forward.
 
Actions will always speak louder then words.  And we really won't know what the leaders of this organization think or where they see problems until training camp next year when we see who they kept, who they released, and where they brought in talent.
 
Whatever is said now is really just lip service, whatever is said.

I certainly agree that calling out other posters, calling them names, and labels, etc is one of the things I hate the most.  Why?  Because there is a large contingent of people / lurkers who see and feel that if they post their opinion and are going to get personally attacked for it, they won’t do it. 
And when that happens we get the same people posting the same things and things start to become stale.  New people, points of view, opinions, and personalities are very much welcomed and wanted.
 
Now having said that, to respond to your post, it is human nature to “group up” with the people who think the same way as you, and “not like” people who post opposing opinions.  Why?  Because we all like to feel validated in the way that we feel and think, and we get that validation when people post or agree and the opposite when they don’t.
 
You are correct, that we should have a greater appreciation for opposing viewpoints, and keep the discussion on topic, not insults on each other.
Personally, I would probably label myself as falling more into the homer category, though  try to keep an open and objective point of view.   Why am I like that?  Because I am an eternal optimistic fan.  If I didn’t feel that way, if I felt the way some of the “negatron” and “gloomers” appear to feel, I would cease investing my time and money in this board and following the team.
 
Not saying everyone has to be that way to be a fan of the team, just the reason I am the way I am.  Heck, I actually “liked” one of TBURGESS’ posts today, maybe I’m going to the other side…

And if you don't like the discussion, don't partake in it, walk away, don't post, don't reply.  You only shed light on, amplify, and acknowledge what you deem as thoughtless opinions.
 
Hate to break it to you, but you aren't the "intelligent police".

And if you don't like the discussion, don't partake in it, walk away, don't post, don't reply.  You only shed light on, amplify, and acknowledge what you deem as thoughtless opinions.
 
Hate to break it to you, but you aren't the "intelligent police".

And if you don't like the discussion, don't partake in it, walk away, don't post, don't reply.  You only shed light on, amplify, and acknowledge what you deem as thoughtless opinions.
 
Hate to break it to you, but you aren't the "intelligent police".

And if you don't like the discussion, don't partake in it, walk away, don't post, don't reply.  You only shed light on, amplify, and acknowledge what you deem as thoughtless opinions.
 
Hate to break it to you, but you aren't the "intelligent police".