Ducky Posted July 10, 2016 Report Share Posted July 10, 2016 Thought I would start this so we could keep it under one topic. Trouba I'd like to see 8 x 5.75m but likely to see 6 x 5.5m. I don't think he re-signs until just before TC of even into TC. Armia I'd like to see 3 x 2m but likely to see 2 x 1.25m. Lowry I'd like to see him traded but likely to see 2 x 1.75. Lowry, Staf and Petan and a first for RNH. Tanev I'd like to see him play more but likely to see 2 x 1.1m or a bit less? No idea actually... Lipon I'd like to see him traded to a team that would start him but likely to see 2 x 850k. Did I miss anyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goalie Posted July 11, 2016 Report Share Posted July 11, 2016 10 points in an nhl career and you want to give armia 2 million? Not gonna be close to that. Might be closer to what he's paid now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCon Posted July 11, 2016 Report Share Posted July 11, 2016 15 hours ago, Ducky said: Thought I would start this so we could keep it under one topic. Trouba I'd like to see 8 x 5.75m but likely to see 6 x 5.5m. I don't think he re-signs until just before TC of even into TC. Armia I'd like to see 3 x 2m but likely to see 2 x 1.25m. Lowry I'd like to see him traded but likely to see 2 x 1.75. Lowry, Staf and Petan and a first for RNH. Tanev I'd like to see him play more but likely to see 2 x 1.1m or a bit less? No idea actually... Lipon I'd like to see him traded to a team that would start him but likely to see 2 x 850k. Did I miss anyone? If Trouba only signs for 6 years, I don't see why you would give him $5.5. If you're getting 8 years, I could see an AAV of $5.75. 6 years, under $5.0. $4.0, $4.25, $4.25, $4.5, $5.5, $6.0 = $4.75M AAV, and realistically, you're trading him by the 2nd or 3rd year rather than losing him for nothing after 6 years. Why on earth would you give Armia $2.0 AAV? What has he done to earn that much? 2x $1.25 seems reasonable for a bridge. I don't know why you would be eager to see a young centre who can play on the wing traded, but okay..... I'm not sure why EDM would trade a bunch of bottom 6 players, that they won't be able to protect, that don't help with their current problems for one of their assets. Tanev will likely get a 2-year $0.9 to $1.0 deal. Lipon will start with the Moose. He's a high energy guy. Not sure why you want him traded. Goalie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducky Posted July 12, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 10 hours ago, JCon said: If Trouba only signs for 6 years, I don't see why you would give him $5.5. If you're getting 8 years, I could see an AAV of $5.75. 6 years, under $5.0. I mainly said 6 because I think his agent pushes for 6 and not 8. $4.0, $4.25, $4.25, $4.5, $5.5, $6.0 = $4.75M AAV, and realistically, you're trading him by the 2nd or 3rd year rather than losing him for nothing after 6 years. Not going to sign Trouba for 4.75m for 6 years. Why on earth would you give Armia $2.0 AAV? What has he done to earn that much? 2x $1.25 seems reasonable for a bridge. It is a reasonable bridge but I am betting he shines in the next two seasons and the contract proves to be a good one. I don't know why you would be eager to see a young centre who can play on the wing traded, but okay..... ? It isn't that I want Lowry gone but some of our forwards should be moved for LHD and there are a lot of teams out there (Ducks) that covet Lowry. I'm not sure why EDM would trade a bunch of bottom 6 players, that they won't be able to protect, that don't help with their current problems for one of their assets. Do you see Petan as a bottom six? Staf? A 1st rounder? Lowry is but rumor has it that the Oilers really like Lowry. Add if it isn't enough. RNH would lock up the 2nd C and immediately become our best D center which is saying quite a bit seeing as Little and Scheif are pretty responsible defensively speaking. Give them a 2nd in 2018 or something. RNH is very underrated on this site. Tanev will likely get a 2-year $0.9 to $1.0 deal. Lipon will start with the Moose. He's a high energy guy. Not sure why you want him traded. As stated, to give him a chance to start. He isn't starting on the Jets in the foreseeable future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floyd Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 Olli Maata = six years at $4.1 million, Reilly = six years at $5 million Trouba at $4.5 for six years makes a lot of sense but that makes him the lowest paid of our top 4 I can see Trouba going to arbitration for a two-year bridge... I wouldn't negotiate a long-term deal based on last season Looking around the league, its really apparent that Enstrom and Myers do not have 'great contracts' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atomic Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 I have a tough time seeing Trouba taking any less than 5M. Goalie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducky Posted July 12, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 Trouba doesn't have arbitration rights. Goalie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goalie Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 7 years 5.5 AAV for Trouba. 6? Then it should be 5 AAV like Reilly JCon 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floyd Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 1 hour ago, Ducky said: Trouba doesn't have arbitration rights. So he just takes what Chevy gives him or sits out the season? I thought the team could file for arbitration...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 You get arbitration rights after 4 years in the NHL (term reduced if you sign your first contract after 20) Trouble only has 3. Also, it is the player who requests arbitration, not the team. The team must give them a qualifying offer (based on current salary). When they do that, they are bound, at the minimum, to sign at that salary (unless both parties agree to less). If they don't qualify, they lose the rights to the player. Once qualified, a player may request arbitration (if eligible). This is usually done to push the negotiations along. Floyd 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goalie Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 Nope. Trouba has no arbitration rights. None of the jets rfas do. Not one. Trouba? He can sign which I'm sure he will soon enough. He can sit. It won't get that far. Or he's traded. 3 options. Signed soon is most likely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCon Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 I don't think you sign Trouba for more than $5 AAV for 6 years. He has not earned more than that. Betting that Armia is going to be good is one thing, over paying him by more than 50% does not make any sense. Bridge now and let him earn a contract. But how are you going to protect the LHD in the expansion draft? I still see Lowry as our 3rd line centre of the future. Petan - bottom six. Yes, I doubt he'll do much more and I don't see him passing anyone to take a top six spot. Maybe he's more but I doubt the Oilers want more skilled guys that don't have grit. They have too much of that already. Stafford - bottom six. On the Oilers? Yes. He's not getting in front of Eberle or Poolparty (and they still have Yak - for now). Nice depth third line scorer with the ability to play up if needed. And again, how would the Oilers protect all these guys? I don't see the need to add another centre to push Little down to the third line. Lipon does not deserve to start in the NHL. Not yet. He needs to develop and that's what the A is for. He has a chance to battle Lemieux for that energy depth guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Unknown Poster Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 Myers contract is pretty good. $5.5 per for three more seasons but actual salary is $4, $3.5, $3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noeller Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 11 hours ago, Rich said: You get arbitration rights after 4 years in the NHL (term reduced if you sign your first contract after 20) Trouble only has 3. Also, it is the player who requests arbitration, not the team. The team must give them a qualifying offer (based on current salary). When they do that, they are bound, at the minimum, to sign at that salary (unless both parties agree to less). If they don't qualify, they lose the rights to the player. Once qualified, a player may request arbitration (if eligible). This is usually done to push the negotiations along. Appropriate auto-corrects..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCon Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 6 hours ago, The Unknown Poster said: Myers contract is pretty good. $5.5 per for three more seasons but actual salary is $4, $3.5, $3. It's a great contract for a budget (not cap) team like the Jets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Unknown Poster Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 If its a great contract for a budget team then its a great contract for all teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 33 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said: If its a great contract for a budget team then its a great contract for all teams. I don’t think I agree with this. If you are a team who can or has the budget to spend to the cap +, then one of the most important things to you is AAV and if that player is worth the AAV, because your constraint is the cap. Myers AAV is 5.5M, so a cap team would have to ask themselves does Myers give value chewing up $5.5M of the NHL cap. They don’t care so much what actual salary is because their constraint is the cap, not actual dollars. If you are a budget team, you don’t care so much what the AAV is because the actual dollars is your constraint. So if the Jets internal budget is $65M, they have $7M of cap space they will never use. So there is $7M in there that Myers AAV can eat into with no effect to them at all. Myers $3-4M salary is what matters most to them because that is what will go to their internal cap. And the Jets would have to ask themselves, is $3-4M good value for what Myers brings. JCon, Jimmy Pop and Floyd 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floyd Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 These contracts might have looked good a few years ago... but 'good' Dman contracts are trending down while great ones are going up... Now its hard to tell Trouba's agent that he's worth less than Enstrom and Myers... but then you're stuck with $23 million in capspace for your top four Myers and Enstrom's cap hits are comparable to Duncan Keith... Roman Josi and Hjalmarsson are locked in at $4m a year... those are great contracts... Atomic 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducky Posted July 12, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 Could always bridge Trouba but I don't see it happening.... 2 x 3m per year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goalie Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 Trouba will sign 6 or 7 years. Or they will trade him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floyd Posted July 13, 2016 Report Share Posted July 13, 2016 1 hour ago, Goalie said: Trouba will sign 6 or 7 years. Or they will trade him. http://www.tsn.ca/video/nhl/the-trouble-with-trouba~909743 Button disagrees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducky Posted July 13, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2016 After all, Craig did get three out of the first 10 picks right. Although, not many saw CBJ taking PLD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Unknown Poster Posted July 13, 2016 Report Share Posted July 13, 2016 5 hours ago, Rich said: I don’t think I agree with this. If you are a team who can or has the budget to spend to the cap +, then one of the most important things to you is AAV and if that player is worth the AAV, because your constraint is the cap. Myers AAV is 5.5M, so a cap team would have to ask themselves does Myers give value chewing up $5.5M of the NHL cap. They don’t care so much what actual salary is because their constraint is the cap, not actual dollars. If you are a budget team, you don’t care so much what the AAV is because the actual dollars is your constraint. So if the Jets internal budget is $65M, they have $7M of cap space they will never use. So there is $7M in there that Myers AAV can eat into with no effect to them at all. Myers $3-4M salary is what matters most to them because that is what will go to their internal cap. And the Jets would have to ask themselves, is $3-4M good value for what Myers brings. Nah it's simple logic. If a team that isn't as budget consciousness as the jets values the contract then wealthier cap teams will too. They might not care as much but they still value it on its face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goalie Posted July 13, 2016 Report Share Posted July 13, 2016 1 hour ago, Floyd said: http://www.tsn.ca/video/nhl/the-trouble-with-trouba~909743 Button disagrees. Button knows as much as you and I know. But no mention of Lindholm Monahan Goudreau. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted July 13, 2016 Report Share Posted July 13, 2016 8 hours ago, JCon said: It's a great contract for a budget (not cap) team like the Jets. 7 hours ago, The Unknown Poster said: If its a great contract for a budget team then its a great contract for all teams. 1 hour ago, The Unknown Poster said: Nah it's simple logic. If a team that isn't as budget consciousness as the jets values the contract then wealthier cap teams will too. They might not care as much but they still value it on its face. They don't care as much, so it isn't a "great" contract for a cap team, which was the discussion. All things equal, if two players have the same AAV, are equal in talent, then sure the cap team would prefer to pay less for that player. But the Chicago's of the world don't give a rats ass about the actual salary of the contract, they care about the AAV and which players they won't be able to sign or have to trade away to stay under the cap. Teams like Arizona, Carolina, or any team who isn't projecting to be close to the cap, won't care about the AAV, only what the $$$ will mean to the bottom line. It is pretty simple logic, actually. Case in point, Ducan Keith made $7.6M with a $5.5M cap hit in 2014-15. Myers made $5M with a $5.5M cap hit in 2014-15. They both have the same AAV. By your logic Myers is the contract teams would value because the salary is less than the AAV. Keith is the better value for Chicago because they are a cap team so AAV matters most to them. Keith gives them better value for that $5.5M cap hit in their Stanley Cup year (and his Conn Smythe win) than Myers would have. That Keith contract is a great contract for Chicago. Its higher salary than AAV allows the Hawks to fit and keep more of their stars and players under the cap, while giving Keith fair value in actual salary. It would't be as good a contract for the Jets. Floyd and JCon 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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