Lets see if we can keep this thread a little more civil.

I found this interview very interesting.  A lot of soft balls thrown at Trump, he explained his back pedalling on his more extreme issues as a lot of his claims as opening bids for negotiation purposes.  Which .. whatever .. I still think that those are insincere claims he used to get elected.

He does now come across way more presidential then he did prior to the election.  A lot of his noise, yelling, and rhetoric has been scaled back.

Do respect this one though:

Quote

 

Lesley Stahl: Are you gonna take the salary, the president’s salary?

Donald Trump: Well, I’ve never commented on this, but the answer is no. I think I have to by law take $1, so I’ll take $1 a year. But it’s a -- I don’t even know what it is.

Donald Trump: Do you know what the salary is?

Lesley Stahl: $400,000 you’re giving up.

Donald Trump: No, I’m not gonna take the salary. I’m not taking it.

 

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/60-minutes-donald-trump-family-melania-ivanka-lesley-stahl/

Interesting because Manafort had been cooperating. Seems the argument was that investigators didn't trust him. 

 

17 hours ago, johnzo said:

I would never say never but I would be extremely surprised if Trump does time.

With the way the Judicial process goes at times, he'll be at the pearly gates of heaven trying to get a deal done before any of that potentially happening.

Edited August 9, 20178 yr by HardCoreBlue
Adding a part.

Manafort had previously said he'd testify in return for immunity.  FBI turned that down cold.

 

Edited August 10, 20178 yr by Jacquie

7 hours ago, HardCoreBlue said:

With the way the Judicial process goes at times, he'll be at the pearly gates of heaven trying to get a deal done before any of that potentially happening.

I just checked, no American President has gone to jail.

Most nations seem to have a sort of de facto immunity for former leaders. Not many instances of former leaders being jailed, anywhere. Idi Amin walked. to Saudi Arabia.

 

Edited August 9, 20178 yr by Mark F
too much

The interesting legal battle will be when Trump pardons himself. 

1 hour ago, The Unknown Poster said:

The interesting legal battle will be when Trump pardons himself. 

I believe they passed a bill or were passing a bill to avoid this from happening..  or I could have mis-read that..  so much chaff getting tossed into the media these days.

18 minutes ago, SPuDS said:

I believe they passed a bill or were passing a bill to avoid this from happening..  or I could have mis-read that..  so much chaff getting tossed into the media these days.

I think there was talk of it but hasnt happened.  The backlash would be huge but I dont think Trump cares.  As President he can pardon anyone he wants and I would expect him to do so for his friends, family & associates.  Pardoning himself...that would be an interesting constitutional debate.  He could avoid it by making a deal with Pence to advance him to president but that didnt work out very well in the past.

Also, supposedly there are investigations going on in New York as well.  The President can only pardon federal crimes, not state ones.

On 8/9/2017 at 10:15 AM, The Unknown Poster said:

Interesting because Manafort had been cooperating. Seems the argument was that investigators didn't trust him. 

 

The fact that they presented a judge with some form of  evidence, and obtained a search warrant to knock on Manafort's  home - one day after his testimony, speaks volumes.....

Interesting comments from the lawyer for TRUMP not Manafort. 

 

So Trump has finally read a prepared statement denouncing white supremacists. Now he needs to fire the ones working for him in the White House.

16 hours ago, Jacquie said:

So Trump has finally read a prepared statement denouncing white supremacists. Now he needs to fire the ones working for him in the White House.

I've hesitated even bothering on this because serious discussions here have a way of going off the rails.  But is there a greater or more timely example of Trump's ineptitude (or worse) than his reaction to what happened this past weekend?  And of course, it highlights his own hypocrisy when he attacked Obama for not mentioning specific terror groups and he does the same thing solely to avoid angering his base.

Incredibly irresponsible at best and a disgusting example of a racist piece of crap sitting in the oval office at worst.

Even when he made "stronger" statements, he then tweets about how its was basically to respond to the "fake news".  Even Fox was perplexed by his lack of denouncement.

And to the losers who justify their bigotry as "we're not racists, we just believe in our own white culture", ummm, yeah, you're racists.  And every one of those Confederate "hero" statues and flags should be pulled down.  if the politicians wont do it, the people should rise up and do it (as they did yesterday).  History is important and if I go to a museum I want to see and hear stories of the Civil War and learn about General Lee and others.  But to hold them up as heroes of the south....ugh

The CEO of Merck quits a Presidential council over this and is then attacked by Trump.  If Merck was so bad, why was that perfectly fine UNTIL he quit?  Two more CEO's follow suit and Trump doesnt say a word.

What a disgrace.  I sat in disbelief watching the news on Saturday.  So shameful. 

Bannon was advising Trump, earlier this week not to upset the "Base".    Think Bannon really meant his own Alt-Right base.  
The Cheeto in Chief spent a good portion of the election campaign, playing up to the "disenfranchised" white folk, and giving the bigots and racists some fodder, in the form of the Birther Theory, the Wall, Travel Ban, etc. 

These moral, upstanding Republicans that go tisk tisk.... every time that Trump says or does something inappropriate, which is pretty well every day, really make me laugh.   They knew that by hitching the wagon to Trump, you were also getting Bannon,  Gorka, Miller and giving the Alt-Right credibility and a say in the agenda.   But hey votes are votes.

 

Edited August 16, 20178 yr by do or die

After the presser today, how long can Trump last?  Wow.  

22 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said:

After the presser today, how long can Trump last?  Wow.  

ImpeachTrump has been trending world-wide on twitter the last 8 hours lol 

Trump is a real tough hombre when talking about women, Muslims, Mexicans, former Presidents, Black Lives Matter, Gold Star families, Liberals, the people that work around him in his (supposed) political party and foreign leaders .      Almost everybody.    Well, except David Duke, Richard Spencer.......and  Vladimir Putin.

The mask slipped off tonight......in a angry, petulant and non-factual way.......in short, the way The Fugly American usually goes about things.  

My Dad served in the Royal Canadian Navy.....my uncle, served in the Royal Canadian Air Force - both fighting the Nazis, in WW2.   Yup, those folks, that Donald Trump feels the need, to deflect from, make excuses for and provide fake moral equivalency for them.   Disgraceful.

During the election, I posted here that Trump was not qualified to be a dog catcher.    In retrospect, probably should of been a bit harsher.  

 

When I saw the news today I honestly didn't know it would be a big deal. Oh, the President is pussyfooting with actual blood-and-soil Nazis. Just another day in the USA.  

The USA has been so upside down that I had no idea where the red line for Republicans was.

I wonder if the critical mass for a 25th Amendment removal is forming tonight. I don't think any move against Trump will come from Congress; the House GOP doesn't have the courage to defy the Trump voters.  Things are so evenly balanced right now that a defection of just a few percent of the GOP voters would be disastrous for them.

(Edit: A 25th Amendment removal of the President must be ratified by both houses, so Congress is involved in any case)

Edited August 16, 20178 yr by johnzo

My wife says a cynical thing: there's a dead white girl at the heart of this tragedy.  Dead white girls galvanize the USA like nothing else.

 

The GOP leadership is completely complicit in all this.......looking the other way, holding their noses, making rationalizations and flat out excuses for this guy.   And in the process, constantly eating his insults, like the moral cowards that they are.

Trump is simply a tool they consciously used..... to get what they wanted (not that they have accomplished anything with it)  

This is the natural extension of the Republican version of enlarging the tent, the last couple of decades......by opening their arms to the Alt-Right, and many other forms of extremists, both religious and cultural ......  

The spotlight is now squarely on the GOP - do they condone this, or not?   No amount of "what the President really meant", "out of context", "has his own style" or any of that other BS will cut it now.

 

I was at a dinner party on Saturday night and I am so reluctant, when discussing politics, to admit to being a conservative for fear of people immediately connecting that to Trump.  He is a disgusting, vile, shameful human being...and that's an insult to all other human beings.  Its beyond politics.  This isnt idealogy.  He's a bigoted, racist, clueless jerk.

I agree @do or die, the entire GOP is complicit because they put winning ahead of whats right.  They are so fearful of losing seats and power that they wont categorically condemn the "alt right" and everything it now stands for.  True Americans would stand at their podiums and condemn those movements, condemn Trump and say "if you wont vote me now, that is your choice but if you support this crap, I dont want your vote".  They desperately need to move, en mass, back towards the center.

@johnzo- I too looked into the 25th because I agree that this HAS to be something talked about.  You look at the body language of Chief of Staff Kelly, a friggen General, during Trump's rant.  You look at the fact his staff immediately leaked that Trump went rogue.  Where has his Jewish daughter and son in law been since this happened.  I dont expect Ivanka to turn on her father but where is the red line for people who sort of go along for the ride.

The problem is, the 25th is easy to invoke for the VP and cabinet, but the President can then send a letter to Congress disagreeing and then Congress must vote 2/3 of both houses to uphold the 25th.  So even if you get the VP and Cabinet to do it, you have to know Congress will support it or Im afraid the Cabinet will be far too fearful of losing their jobs if Congress doesnt back them.  But if they had any balls, they'd take that chance.

But instead, they will probably all go along with impeachment when Mueller finishes and it will be over financial ****.  Not the morally repugnant, divisive stuff that SHOULD be Trump's downfall.

More than ever, yesterday, Trump lost the moral right to govern.  He's finished.  There is a Nazi in the White House.  In 2017.  Good God...

Saw this in a CNN article and its a brilliant suggestion.  Made even better if its a joint presser with all of them there:

A tweet by presidential biographer David Maraniss went viral, perhaps because it tapped into wishful thinking by liberals. It said: "The living former presidents -- Bushes, Carter, Clinton & Obama -- should make a joint statement calling on the racist Trump to resign."

35 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said:

 Its beyond politics.  

 

 

My sentiments exactly.

Checking out Fox News just makes me feel more and more marginalized as a conservative.  They are becoming the unofficial communications wing of this White House, spinning the garbage to make it acceptable to the "right". 

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/08/16/tucker-carlson-if-want-to-erase-past-must-prepare-for-consequences.html

6 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said:

Checking out Fox News just makes me feel more and more marginalized as a conservative.  They are becoming the unofficial communications wing of this White House, spinning the garbage to make it acceptable to the "right". 

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/08/16/tucker-carlson-if-want-to-erase-past-must-prepare-for-consequences.html

Don't go to Brietbart, then......

Ps - this Alt-Left stuff was basically cooked up, some time ago.... by Hanninty, on Fox.

1 minute ago, do or die said:

Don't go to Brietbart, then......

Ps - this Alt-Left stuff was basically cooked up, some time ago.... by Hanninty, on Fox.

Im as negative on the far left as the next guy.  But I am so disgusted by this.  This defense of nazi's and KKK as "yeah, but what about the left..."  **** you.  I dont condone violence but I dont care one iota about the "left".  Its not left vs right.  its right vs wrong.  Its reason vs insanity.  Its peace vs hate.  History shows us violent opposition was needed to this very kind of thinking.  Im not condoning it.  But to focus on the "left" which really includes a whole lot of people who used to be considered right wing...they have moved the line so far right that everyone is now left. 

Trump's nonsense about a few bad apples among the rightful protestors.  Give me a break.  If I go to a protest and the guy beside me is a nazi, sorry, Im not shrugging.  Im leaving.  Or im crossing the street to the other side.  10 people standing beside one nazi makes 11 nazi's.  Stand and be counted.  This is disgusting.  History will judge the people that turned a blind eye to this.  We're all human ******* beings.  So gross.