...Lawless says Riders looking at Ottawa Asst GM and John Murphy as potential new GM. Have asked for permission to speak to both. Fwiw.

2 minutes ago, holoman said:

Some of these posts have 'SMH' and 'facepalm' all over it

Are you in the camp of... (1) Mike O'Shea walks on water or (2) Only when it's frozen? Just asking.

21 minutes ago, Taynted_Fayth said:

We've had quality guys opt for other places due to what was left from previous regimes.  We tried doing what Sask recently did giving full autonomy to a guy like Jones as being both GM and HC with Kelly but that blew up in our face, since then we've been basically relegated to noobs coming in and dealing with the fall out

** we've tried to go after guys like Milanovich and stubler and been politely turned down

Stubler left Calgary to go back to Toronto. Stubler can't stay in one place more than a few years so using him as an example may not be the best.

5 minutes ago, iso_55 said:

So, if you're right... that decision rests with the BOD's. As I've been saying all along. Maybe we'll finally have a bounce back season but if we don't we're back to Square One all over again.

... what I'm implying is there may be no decision to be made. I don't know what restraints they have or regulations they're forced to abide by,

2 minutes ago, iso_55 said:

Stubler left Calgary to go back to Toronto. Stubler can't stay in one place more than a few years so using him as an example may not be the best.

more just a reference that we've tried to bring in quality people, but it hasn't always been working out for us and we were forced to go with what was available, and thats been trending towards inexperienced HCs

5 minutes ago, iso_55 said:

Are you in the camp of... (1) Mike O'Shea walks on water or (2) Only when it's frozen? Just asking.

Honestly, i'll be flamed for this, but I'll refrain from judgement until I see  him coach with 2 competent coordinators. 

At this point in time, I feel more a lot more comfortable in Osh/Lapo/Hall then i ever was with Osh/MB/Etch. I think we've gradually increased the talent and I expect a big turn around this season

Edited March 30, 20169 yr by Taynted_Fayth

Just now, Mike said:

... what I'm implying is there may be no decision to be made. I don't know what restraints they have or regulations they're forced to abide by,

Well, the only way to look at it is this regime & previous regimes & the people who ran the Bombers during  those times where you are free to draw your own conclusions. We hired Mack over Barker. According to Miller, when he was looking for a GM he never looked outside the organization to hire Walters & just promoted him from interim to permanent GM. The last decade every head coach was inexperienced. Some did better than others but didn't last (Berry) while others were abysmal failures (Burke).

I think the larger issues was the supporting cast of coaches rather then the head coach...   

Forget not the list of unproven or mediocre hirings at OC has been depressing and the bizarre signing of Etch just really shows that the team either is clueless or had to scrape at the bottom of the barrel in the past.  

It seemed that we hired absolutely no proven guys for a real long time.

I am very *unsure* of Lapo since his offense sucked last time he was around and I only hope and pray that his O sucked because he was to overwhelmed being the head coach.  

If one was to do a historical review of the combination of longevity and ineptness I would hazard a guess that this current stretch of " the need for patience" would clearly win. In a produce driven business it clearly must be time regardless of who or where you want to point the finger of blame.

Just now, Brandon said:

I think the larger issues was the supporting cast of coaches rather then the head coach...   

Forget not the list of unproven or mediocre hirings at OC has been depressing and the bizarre signing of Etch just really shows that the team either is clueless or had to scrape at the bottom of the barrel in the past.  

It seemed that we hired absolutely no proven guys for a real long time.

I am very *unsure* of Lapo since his offense sucked last time he was around and I only hope and pray that his O sucked because he was to overwhelmed being the head coach.  

Brandon, great point so we'll see how it goes with LaPo. You may be pleasantly surprised.

I don't understand where this "The Bombers are cheap!!11!" thing comes from now, when Wade has shown that he's more than willing to spend money on EVERYTHING. This isn't the Cal Murphy days anymore where guys sometimes had to buy their own equipment. That said, we're still a taxpayer-funded organization, unlike the exceedingly wealthy Calgary Stampeders, who can do whatever they want.

1 minute ago, Brandon said:

I think the larger issues was the supporting cast of coaches rather then the head coach...   

Forget not the list of unproven or mediocre hirings at OC has been depressing and the bizarre signing of Etch just really shows that the team either is clueless or had to scrape at the bottom of the barrel in the past.  

It seemed that we hired absolutely no proven guys for a real long time.

I am very *unsure* of Lapo since his offense sucked last time he was around and I only hope and pray that his O sucked because he was to overwhelmed being the head coach.  

I'd be willing to give benefit of the doubt that this was a major factor. His offenses strictly as an OC werent that bad, and maybe some time away from the sidelines (but not totally away from the game) has allowed him a refresh and refocus 

5 minutes ago, Noeller said:

I don't understand where this "The Bombers are cheap!!11!" thing comes from now, when Wade has shown that he's more than willing to spend money on EVERYTHING. This isn't the Cal Murphy days anymore where guys sometimes had to buy their own equipment. That said, we're still a taxpayer-funded organization, unlike the exceedingly wealthy Calgary Stampeders, who can do whatever they want.

This isn't a discussion about football ops per se. It's the Bombers willingness to spend the money to hire the right people at the President, GeneralManager & Head Coaching positions. Mike says that maybe the Bombers have restrictions on money spent while you maintain a team like Calgary has a bottomless pit of money so they can hire & keep quality people & we can't. My take is that the BOD's here could but won't spend the money needed to bring in experienced CFL people with successful tack records.  So, they bring in unproven people as that way the team doesn't have to spend as much. The hiring record (especially) of the last 10 years seems to bear that out in my opinion.

Edited March 30, 20169 yr by iso_55

Well he will have really no excuses... good QB,  great RB,  two great receivers,  and the o-line is seemingly decent....    no excuses for the O to not produce...

1 minute ago, Brandon said:

Well he will have really no excuses... good QB,  great RB,  two great receivers,  and the o-line is seemingly decent....    no excuses for the O to not produce...

Actually TWO qbs that can play...

21 minutes ago, holoman said:

Honestly, i'll be flamed for this, but I'll refrain from judgement until I see  him coach with 2 competent coordinators. 

Why would you be flamed? It is a reasonable response.

11 minutes ago, iso_55 said:

This isn't a discussion about football ops per se. It's the Bombers willingness to spend the money to hire the right people at the President, GeneralManager & Head Coaching positions. Mike says that maybe the Bombers have restrictions on money spent while you maintain a team like Calgary has a bottomless pit of money so they can hire & keep quality people & we can't. My take is that the BOD's here could but won't spend the money needed to bring in experienced CFL people with successful tack records.  So, they bring in unproven people as that way the team doesn't have to spend as much. The hiring record (especially) of the last 10 years seems to bear that out in my opinion.

It might be your take, and you're certainly welcome to it, but there's nothing to back that up...

7 minutes ago, iso_55 said:

This isn't a discussion about football ops per se. It's the Bombers willingness to spend the money to hire the right people at the President, GeneralManager & Head Coaching positions. Mike says that maybe the Bombers have restrictions on money spent while you maintain a team like Calgary has a bottomless pit of money so they can hire & keep quality people & we can't. My take is that the BOD's here could but won't spend the money needed to bring in experienced CFL people with successful tack records.  So, they bring in unproven people as that way the team doesn't have to spend as much. The hiring record (especially) of the last 10 years seems to bear that out in my opinion.

If the BOD could spend the money but won't, what would the rationale for that be?  

If an owner doesn't do it, it is usually because he wants to save the money to either pocket or not go further into a deficit.  It is his own personal money, it comes out of his pocket.

For the BOD, if the club cheaps out to keep more money for the bottom line, they certainly don't benefit.  So why would they purposefully spend less money if they could spend more?

7 minutes ago, Noeller said:

It might be your take, and you're certainly welcome to it, but there's nothing to back that up...

Same with your take on the Stamps. You've been living in AB for awhile now. You know that the Stamps never steal other coaches from other teams, never sign high profile FA's for big bucks & even release key veteran players like Keon Raymond who can still play over contract issues. They don't strike me as a team that has a bottomless pit of money. They do pay Huff a lot of money but the guy has earned it. If anything, Huff runs a very tight ship financially & makes some pretty cold decisions when he thinks he has to.

Edited March 30, 20169 yr by iso_55

Wealthy private owners.....big bottomless pit of money.

6 minutes ago, iso_55 said:

Same with your take on the Stamps. You've been living in AB for awhile now. You know that the Stamps never steal other coaches rom other teams, sign high profile FA's for big bucks & even release key veteran players like Keon Raymond who can still play. They don't strike me as a team that has a bottomless pit of money. They do pay Huff a lot of money but the guy has earned it. If anything, Huff runs a very tight ship financially & makes some pretty cold decisions when he thinks he has to.

Not a bottomless pit of money, per se and I'm sure that's not what he meant beyond the figure of speech. The difference is their ownership is basing decisions on how much money they FEEL like spending, our directors are basing decisions, quite probably, on how much they're able to spend. There's a very big difference.

4 minutes ago, Rich said:

If the BOD could spend the money but won't, what would the rationale for that be?  

If an owner doesn't do it, it is usually because he wants to save the money to either pocket or not go further into a deficit.  It is his own personal money, it comes out of his pocket.

For the BOD, if the club cheaps out to keep more money for the bottom line, they certainly don't benefit.  So why would they purposefully spend less money if they could spend more?

The experience level of the people they hire on this team now & in the recent past can't be ignored. To me, they just didn't want to spend the cash when they had a cheaper alternative. In the case of Joe Mack, my understanding from everything I heard is that Paul Robson & Joe Pop were on the BOD's at that time. They were buddy-buddy with Mack from their days with the team going back to the mid 80's. Those 2 pushed hard to hire Mack over Barker.

3 minutes ago, Mike said:

Not a bottomless pit of money, per se and I'm sure that's not what he meant beyond the figure of speech. The difference is their ownership is basing decisions on how much money they FEEL like spending, our directors are basing decisions, quite probably, on how much they're able to spend. There's a very big difference.

I won't deny you may be right. Somehow, I feel that isn't the case. But I won't dispute your POV.

11 minutes ago, Noeller said:

Wealthy private owners.....big bottomless pit of money.

The wheels on the bus go round & round....

Last time we hired a HC with good experience (IE Winning) was Richie back in '99 worked out pretty well IIRC.

I can't remember the last time we hired an experienced GM, but Walters, Mack, Bauer and Reinbold certainly weren't so it's been a long time.