wbbfan Posted March 15, 2017 Report Share Posted March 15, 2017 1 hour ago, bearpants said: exactly... also he compares Vandervoort to Bauman and Boateng to Mrabure... so he's predicting Vandervoort and Boateng will both be busts?? more likely similar skill set / size coming out. Its safe comparisons as opposed to comparing guys to milt, blink etc. Like people who compared deshawn stevenson going into the nba to michael jordan. A range is usually better like at worst a jon oosterhuise but has the up side to be a doug brown etc. comparisons suck. Floyd 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floyd Posted March 15, 2017 Report Share Posted March 15, 2017 54 minutes ago, bearpants said: Sure we get that... but usually when you compare future draft picks to current/past players it's generally done with all-stars or very good players... to give an idea of their potential... if you want to get fans psyched up about the draft you say Vandervoort is Fantuz, Mason Woods is Matt O'Donnell, Boateng is Brent Johnson, Eli Ankou is Doug Brown, etc... PS - I'm not saying any of these comps are accurate... just making a point... He knows more about Hamilton and Toronto... makes a lot of sense to compare these guys to players in their systems. I'd like to see Ed Tait write something like this from a Bomber perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floyd Posted March 15, 2017 Report Share Posted March 15, 2017 32 minutes ago, sweep the leg said: It's probably time to move on from this. It was time to move on two replies after my first comment about him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbrg Posted March 15, 2017 Report Share Posted March 15, 2017 1 hour ago, Floyd said: And I'm actually not sure why you're blown away by the Cam Walker comparison...? Blown away would not describe my reaction. As I haven't ever seen a single play involving Cam Walker, or at least one where something significant involving Cam Walker happened, comparing players to him doesn't offer me any insight. 1 hour ago, Floyd said: Pretty sure he's not predicting 'hits or misses' just body types and technique, etc... I would have said that and probably comparing where they are in their development at the time of their drafting. If not, comparing McGough to Walker becomes an even more useless exercise. bearpants 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floyd Posted March 15, 2017 Report Share Posted March 15, 2017 1 hour ago, mbrg said: Blown away would not describe my reaction. As I haven't ever seen a single play involving Cam Walker, or at least one where something significant involving Cam Walker happened, comparing players to him doesn't offer me any insight. Yeah, I'm not too familiar eastern prospects... would be great to see what Tait or someone would use as a comparison. Like is McGough better or worse than Corney...? Who's the next Loffler... etc etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearpants Posted March 16, 2017 Report Share Posted March 16, 2017 17 hours ago, wbbfan said: more likely similar skill set / size coming out. Its safe comparisons as opposed to comparing guys to milt, blink etc. Like people who compared deshawn stevenson going into the nba to michael jordan. A range is usually better like at worst a jon oosterhuise but has the up side to be a doug brown etc. comparisons suck. I agree with you completely... but I guess my assumption is hey let's write an article to get people pumped about the draft and throw in some player comps... If you're trying to generate readers and interest you compare the draft picks to their ceiling... It's not like GMs are reading this article to make their draft board... it's for the fans, so no one will care or remember this article if Boateng and Vandervoort actually end up being busts... if Hamilton drafts Vandervoort will the fans be more excited to see the next Fantuz or the next Bauman... Even if his comps are perfect....basically, I think the article doesn't make any sense from a marketing perspective... Bigblue204, wbbfan and bigg jay 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wbbfan Posted March 16, 2017 Report Share Posted March 16, 2017 3 hours ago, bearpants said: I agree with you completely... but I guess my assumption is hey let's write an article to get people pumped about the draft and throw in some player comps... If you're trying to generate readers and interest you compare the draft picks to their ceiling... It's not like GMs are reading this article to make their draft board... it's for the fans, so no one will care or remember this article if Boateng and Vandervoort actually end up being busts... if Hamilton drafts Vandervoort will the fans be more excited to see the next Fantuz or the next Bauman... Even if his comps are perfect....basically, I think the article doesn't make any sense from a marketing perspective... That probably is the idea behind it. Though with those ends i would over hype every one. Casual cfl/hammy fan sees that and sees the cats drafting the next fantuz at 4 they go oh man i better follow this! Same fan sees bauman and goes .... The level of quality in cfl media under the elite tier is pretty low. The drop off from good guys around the league is massive. Thats really what results in an article like this imop. Not sure if he wants to do a hype piece or a serious piece, doesnt know how to get the desired effect either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floyd Posted March 16, 2017 Report Share Posted March 16, 2017 First time I've seen so much concern for the marketing angle of a draft analysis... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jpan85 Posted March 16, 2017 Report Share Posted March 16, 2017 It's funny Marshall Ferguson is only two or three years out of school and is already the TiCats play by play guy and afternoon host on TSN in Hamilton. Has a pretty bright future. It's funny also because on some of Vandervoorts highlites he is the QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noeller Posted March 16, 2017 Report Share Posted March 16, 2017 http://www.bluebombers.com/2017/03/16/qa-gm-kyle-walters/ Nothing earth-shattering, but there's some good pre-draft talk here with Walters and Tait.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wbbfan Posted March 16, 2017 Report Share Posted March 16, 2017 1 hour ago, Noeller said: http://www.bluebombers.com/2017/03/16/qa-gm-kyle-walters/ Nothing earth-shattering, but there's some good pre-draft talk here with Walters and Tait.... yeah is a great read. Ed tait is the best pick up the bombers have made in years haha. He was still great in the paper before, but having him dedicated to the blue is fantastic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpeedFlex27 Posted March 16, 2017 Report Share Posted March 16, 2017 On 3/1/2017 at 7:00 AM, bb1 said: No still need the ratio just referring to starting cdns....why not just have a certain number of cdns on the roster instead... Why have any Canadians then? Bigblue204 and wbbfan 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigg jay Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 Justin Dunk has put out his prospect rankings (by position rather than overall). He's got Vandervoort as the 3rd best receiver which I found interesting. http://3downnation.com/2017/03/20/2017-cfl-draft-prospect-rankings/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCon Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 2 minutes ago, bigg jay said: Justin Dunk has put out his prospect rankings (by position rather than overall). He's got Vandervoort as the 3rd best receiver which I found interesting. http://3downnation.com/2017/03/20/2017-cfl-draft-prospect-rankings/ I'm not sure what his ability to scout is, although he does get the great scoops. Not much analysis or rationale provided in the rankings. wbbfan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IC Khari Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 4 minutes ago, JCon said: I'm not sure what his ability to scout is, although he does get the great scoops. Not much analysis or rationale provided in the rankings. JCon 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigg jay Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 16 minutes ago, JCon said: I'm not sure what his ability to scout is, although he does get the great scoops. Not much analysis or rationale provided in the rankings. Doesn't sound like he was the one scouting, just giving his take based on what actual scouts have said. Quote With that in mind, let’s unveil top five rankings for prospects position-by-position in advance of the annual talent assessment event as compiled from pro evaluators coast to coast. But I do agree that there's not much else there... I'd love to hear why he has Vandervoort ranked that low or why Antony Auclair is not ranked at all. JCon 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCon Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 1 minute ago, bigg jay said: Doesn't sound like he was the one scouting, just giving his take based on what actual scouts have said. Right, but he was aggregating their input into his rankings. I'm curious about what the process is for these rankings bigg jay 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bb1 Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 (edited) On 16/03/2017 at 2:37 PM, SpeedFlex27 said: Why have any Canadians then? Cause it's the CFL??? Doesn't mean they have to start no matter what though does it? Read what our own Bombers Gm has to say about the draft. It's very tough on CFL teams to do this balancing act... Edited March 20, 2017 by bb1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wbbfan Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 17 minutes ago, JCon said: Right, but he was aggregating their input into his rankings. I'm curious about what the process is for these rankings They kind of look like the best guys at the college level via position. Not predicting how they will translate to pro. So you have the college/pro-football version of the AAAA prospect in baseball. A guy who crushes tripple A competition but cant contribute at the level of bench/fringe starter in the major league, ranks above a guy who is an up side prospect and could still have his best football ahead of him. Every year we see sleepers who are polished football players then athletic freaks picked low and out perform their draft rankings. The scouts could also be shying away from the potential guys in favor of guys who are likely to produce in some form at the next level. JCon 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wbbfan Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 2 minutes ago, bb1 said: Cause it's the CFL??? Doesn't mean they have to start no matter what though does it? Kinda does, its a pretty old rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbrg Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 2 hours ago, bigg jay said: Justin Dunk has put out his prospect rankings (by position rather than overall). He's got Vandervoort as the 3rd best receiver which I found interesting. http://3downnation.com/2017/03/20/2017-cfl-draft-prospect-rankings/ I don't mind reading it - honestly at this point I probably only know half those names - but that really had no useful content. Telling me that some DB is Anthony Woodson's brother? Okay. That will definitely help me on CFL trivia night, but otherwise, not too much. Could be that list is a completely accurate ranking, but nothing he writes after the names gives me any reason to believe that it is. (not much point in ranking these guys a few days before the combine anyways) JCon 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpeedFlex27 Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 4 hours ago, bb1 said: Cause it's the CFL??? Doesn't mean they have to start no matter what though does it? Read what our own Bombers Gm has to say about the draft. It's very tough on CFL teams to do this balancing act... That makes no sense. Think about it. There'd be no Canadians at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearpants Posted March 21, 2017 Report Share Posted March 21, 2017 19 hours ago, bigg jay said: But I do agree that there's not much else there... I'd love to hear why he has Vandervoort ranked that low or why Antony Auclair is not ranked at all. I guess he figured there's no point in ranking an NFL player... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bb1 Posted March 21, 2017 Report Share Posted March 21, 2017 (edited) 16 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said: That makes no sense. Think about it. There'd be no Canadians at all. Hmmm when your required to have a minimum number of Cdns on your team I think your still have to play them no? Just opens up where they have to play to give teams more flexibility. Any way somethings gonna have to give because the CFL draft is killing teams chances for a fair rebuild when there is so much uncertainty over whether a top Cdn will ever play in the CFL. It's become a total crapshoot. And even if he ends up here in 2 or 3 years you lose the really good ones to free agency.... Edited March 21, 2017 by bb1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBlue Posted March 21, 2017 Report Share Posted March 21, 2017 7 minutes ago, bb1 said: Hmmm when your required to have a minimum number of Cdns on your team I think your still have to play them no? Just opens up where they have to play to give teams more flexibility. Any way somethings gonna have to give because the CFL draft is killing teams chances for a fair rebuild when there is so much uncertainty over whether a top Cdn will ever play in the CFL. It's become a total crapshoot. And even if he ends up here in 2 or 3 years you lose the really good ones to free agency.... We can reduce the crapshoot by moving our draft even further back of the NFL camp .... to say 2 weeks before training camp/ rookie camp opens .... whoever signs by then has signed .... AND THEN ... hold an additional draft of players who have been drafted or signed to a tryout, thus fairly distributing those rights ... a lot of the agonizing decisions will disappear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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