I’m surprised the mayor gave in.  Bad decision. 

 

21 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said:

Sounds expensive.  I find the complaining about wait times sort of amusing.  Have we not all waited in traffic at various time all over the city?  Im not sure what makes P&M so special in that people just can't possibly wait a few more minutes during the very short window where there is very large traffic volumes.

The test wouldn't be expensive,  Bowman has spent millions on studies (without him wanting to publish the results because they were all pro No). 

Monday it took me 5 minutes to clear downtown and then yesterday 30 minutes both days with no accidents, street work or stalls...   if I have to now wait 45 minutes to get home it puts a lot stress when you are a family man needing to pick up kids from day care and then going home and getting dinner ready and then taking the kids out to their activities. 

My free time is extremely limited and valuable and it's a real piss off waiting in traffic for absolutely no good reason when if the city was smart they could have a proper traffic flow to get people in and out in 5 minutes.   

You may one day understand if you ever decide to have children and a family because back in the day when it was just me I wouldn't of cared because I had all the time in the world to do whatever I needed to do.   I don't think it's just me because the other people in the office with younger children are all constantly on the go trying to keep up with life.    

 

 

 

 

Team Open will have you believe that tearing down the barriers will suddenly have the downtown full of people living and working.  As if the barriers at Portage and Main have a single thing to do with that.  They'll also call you a bigot if you're against it... I think that's been my favourite one so far.

1 hour ago, Brandon said:

54 seconds in light traffic...  no numbers or real estimates for rush hour naturally.   

The numbers in the traffic study looked specifically at rush hour. I know it's convenient for your argument to ignore facts and make up your own estimates, but it doesn't make them true.

https://www.numberten.com/blog/26-urban-design/brent-bellamy/338-shedding-light-on-portage-and-main

7 minutes ago, nate007 said:

The numbers in the traffic study looked specifically at rush hour. I know it's convenient for your argument to ignore facts and make up your own estimates, but it doesn't make them true.

https://www.numberten.com/blog/26-urban-design/brent-bellamy/338-shedding-light-on-portage-and-main

54 is just an average. Some were seeing delays of several minutes and one direction was proposed to be shut down completely, so people would need to find a completely different route.

Opening P&M is as much about the future as it is about the present. Whether people want to admit or not. Keeping it closed = typical winnipeg lack of vision/planning for the future.

This is one step of many many steps that is needed to improve our downtown atmosphere. Opening it isn't the answer to creating a better DT. but it's an important start.

33 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

Opening P&M is as much about the future as it is about the present. Whether people want to admit or not. Keeping it closed = typical winnipeg lack of vision/planning for the future.

This is one step of many many steps that is needed to improve our downtown atmosphere. Opening it isn't the answer to creating a better DT. but it's an important start.

A step away from 'that's the way we always did it.'

3 hours ago, Bigblue204 said:

Opening P&M is as much about the future as it is about the present. Whether people want to admit or not. Keeping it closed = typical winnipeg lack of vision/planning for the future.

This is one step of many many steps that is needed to improve our downtown atmosphere. Opening it isn't the answer to creating a better DT. but it's an important start.

Start?  Downtown has been improving since they built the MTS Centre.  Where have you been??  It's still not perfect but opening Portage and Main would be inconsequential and barely worth mentioning compared to other improvements over the last decade and a half.

Two thirds of the city is voting to keep it closed.  Keep it closed.

welp it's settled then #CLOSED yeah I know the barriers are going to come down anyway because they're deteriorating.

I'll wager Bowman opens it anyway during his next term. Don't think he really cares what people think. All about Bowman with Bowman and his "legacy".

13 hours ago, Brandon said:

The test wouldn't be expensive,  Bowman has spent millions on studies (without him wanting to publish the results because they were all pro No). 

Monday it took me 5 minutes to clear downtown and then yesterday 30 minutes both days with no accidents, street work or stalls...   if I have to now wait 45 minutes to get home it puts a lot stress when you are a family man needing to pick up kids from day care and then going home and getting dinner ready and then taking the kids out to their activities. 

My free time is extremely limited and valuable and it's a real piss off waiting in traffic for absolutely no good reason when if the city was smart they could have a proper traffic flow to get people in and out in 5 minutes.   

You may one day understand if you ever decide to have children and a family because back in the day when it was just me I wouldn't of cared because I had all the time in the world to do whatever I needed to do.   I don't think it's just me because the other people in the office with younger children are all constantly on the go trying to keep up with life.    

 

 

 

 

There is no story that indicates it would add 40 minutes to your commute. 

9 hours ago, rebusrankin said:

I'll wager Bowman opens it anyway during his next term. Don't think he really cares what people think. All about Bowman with Bowman and his "legacy".

Hopefully he does.  It’s orobably not that hard to manipulate most voters. Once they start tearing down for repair and they actually expose the real costs most Winnipeggers will be opposed to spending money to rebuild barriers. 

The low voter turnout shows people just didn’t really care over all. 

9 hours ago, Atomic said:

Start?  Downtown has been improving since they built the MTS Centre.  Where have you been??  It's still not perfect but opening Portage and Main would be inconsequential and barely worth mentioning compared to other improvements over the last decade and a half.

Two thirds of the city is voting to keep it closed.  Keep it closed.

That’s not really true. The arena had very little impact, if any.    No one project did.  You could argue the return of the Jets had an impact but moreso because the Chipman family continued to develop properties.  

Its all about getting people downtown   And making the area accessible is part of it.  Look at east portage  the empty lot at P&M.  Forks development  

the stupid part was that we even voted on this really  

 

11 hours ago, rebusrankin said:

I'll wager Bowman opens it anyway during his next term.

I think so too. He'll just wait a year or two until people stop talking about it as much.

11 hours ago, rebusrankin said:

I'll wager Bowman opens it anyway during his next term. Don't think he really cares what people think. All about Bowman with Bowman and his "legacy".

I can't believe he got a second term. Four more years of BS and broken promises.

I also think he doesn't give a rip about public opinion and will do all he can to open P&M. Yesterday's vote on that was non-binding and therefore meaningless.

30 minutes ago, blue_gold_84 said:

I can't believe he got a second term. Four more years of BS and broken promises.

I also think he doesn't give a rip about public opinion and will do all he can to open P&M. Yesterday's vote on that was non-binding and therefore meaningless.

I don’t believe an incumbent has ever lost.  Not much alternative to choose from. 

And yes hopefully he ignores the “vote” and marches ahead with much needed repairs and renovations of P&M. 

Interesting vote map 

 

Just now, The Unknown Poster said:

I don’t believe an incumbent has ever lost.  Not much alternative to choose from. 

And yes hopefully he ignores the “vote” and marches ahead with much needed repairs and renovations of P&M. 

The repairs will happen. They are completely necessary. A engineering report will be complete next year, and I'm sure the repairs above and below ground will start afterwards. 

 

The barriers are coming down but there will not be a crosswalk. 

2 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said:

I don’t believe an incumbent has ever lost.  Not much alternative to choose from. 

And yes hopefully he ignores the “vote” and marches ahead with much needed repairs and renovations of P&M. 

The last time an incumbent lost was 1956 (Juba defeated Sharpe). Says a lot about how this city votes, eh.

As for P&M, the repairs will be made regardless of the open vs. close debate. They have to be made.

Just now, The Unknown Poster said:

Interesting vote map 

 

My inlaws voted "No". I asked them why. They said that they were worried about traffic. They don't drive downtown.

Then they said it was a waste of money. Money that the city is going to need to spend anyhow. They didn't know about that because they didn't read anything about the issue. 

Have been retired for 25 years. 

Congratulations Winnipeg. 

I blame Bowman for bowing to that coward Bowarty. He could have done this without the plebiscite but can't now. 

46 minutes ago, blue_gold_84 said:

I can't believe he got a second term.

I can't believe you can't believe it. It wasn't exactly Winnipeg's best and brightest opposing him in this election. This year might have been the least inspiring group of mayoral candidates to challenge an incumbent ever.

Edit: Motkaluk did get more votes that I thought she would though.

8 minutes ago, blue_gold_84 said:

The last time an incumbent lost was 1956 (Juba defeated Sharpe). Says a lot about how this city votes, eh.

This city is staunchly against almost anything that's not status quo.

Edited October 25, 20187 yr by sweep the leg

45 minutes ago, blue_gold_84 said:

I can't believe he got a second term. Four more years of BS and broken promises.

I also think he doesn't give a rip about public opinion and will do all he can to open P&M. Yesterday's vote on that was non-binding and therefore meaningless.

You act like there was competition for him.

The people have spoken  ,  may this cornball idea rest ..... in....piece  (Undertaker voice)

Also JCon your comment above is major sour grapes,   Browaty would steamroll Bowman if he had ran.  The guy is genuine and unlike Bowman he actually gives a crap about the city instead of putting his own image first.    Souuuuuuuuuuuuuuur grapes.   

7 minutes ago, JCon said:

My inlaws voted "No". I asked them why. They said that they were worried about traffic. They don't drive downtown.

Then they said it was a waste of money. Money that the city is going to need to spend anyhow. They didn't know about that because they didn't read anything about the issue. 

Have been retired for 25 years. 

Congratulations Winnipeg. 

I blame Bowman for bowing to that coward Bowarty. He could have done this without the plebiscite but can't now. 

If I recall, there was enough Council support for the plebiscite to go forward without Bowman's support but he saw the opportunity to cut Jenny off at the knees.  Her plan was to make the election about P&M and she'd have likely done even better without the pleb on the ballot.

What's next, are we going to vote on which streets get potholes repairs?  Or which roads get bike lanes?  It was remarkably embarrassing this was even asked on the ballot and I'd feel that way even if "yes" had won.  

Just now, sweep the leg said:

I can't believe you can't believe it. It wasn't exactly Winnipeg's best and brightest opposing him in this election. This year might have been the least inspiring group of mayoral candidates to challenge an incumbent ever.

 

This city is staunchly against almost anything that's not status quo.

Completely agree,  I was listening to 680 after the polls and they made a great point about how in future elections they need some kind of way to weed out the crap candidates.   Having weirdos like Ackerman and Woodstock running in the election is almost a mockery of the election itself.    

If Jenny was more likeable  (according to reddit she has a punchable face)  she probably would of won.   Most of the people I spoke with who were voting for Bowman were voting based on the least crappiest of a crap bunch of candidates.    

I had wished that Oulette-Falcon would of ran for this election because a fresh face who is genuine and with an open mind would be fantastic for our mayor.

3 minutes ago, Brandon said:

The people have spoken  ,  may this cornball idea rest ..... in....piece  (Undertaker voice)

Also JCon your comment above is major sour grapes,   Browaty would steamroll Bowman if he had ran.  The guy is genuine and unlike Bowman he actually gives a crap about the city instead of putting his own image first.    Souuuuuuuuuuuuuuur grapes.   

Its not sour grapes.  Its discussing an issue.  You mentioned reasons you were against it that were personal to you and not supported by facts.  Its quite reasonable to point out how absurd this whole thing was.  And its certainly not put to rest given the fact the infrastructure is crumbling.