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Rich

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Trump and Bolton playing now Abbott and Costello.   "Who's in Syria?"
Pence trying to walk back Trump's claim about former Presidents telling him the need for the Wall  ("The President got the impression, that previous Presidents, wanted to build the Wall")

Serving in the Trump administration, requires that one must follow Trump around 24/7.....with a plastic bag and a scooper.

 

Edited by do or die

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Just now, do or die said:

Trump and Bolton playing now Abbott and Costello.   "Who's in Syria?"
Pence trying to walk back Trump's claim about former Presidents telling him the need for the Wall  ("The President got the impression, that previous Presidents, wanted to build the Wall")

Serving in the Trump administration, requires that one must follow Trump around 24/7.....with a plastic bag and scooper.

 

Pence was better when he was in the witness relocation program. Hiding. 

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Just now, bustamente said:

I hope Cheetolini goes off script tonight, if your going to burn down the place do it real good.

No way he does. He's got 9 minutes and no one on his team wanted him to do it. He only goes off script when he'll get a reaction from the crowd. No crowd tonight. 

It's probably going to sound quite "presidential" and normal and, although dubious, he'll lay out his rationale for calling it a crisis.

Then he'll meltdown on Twitter in the morning and undo everything... 

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4 hours to go until Trump's speech and it's being reported that he still isn't sure if he's going to declare a national emergency to get around the Congressional stalemate. If his intention was to make a strong move to kneecap the Democrats, this is not it. Seems that he (more likely his advisors) recognize the legal pitfalls of such a move. So right now, expect  a more "persuasive" argument to sway public opinion in his favour that the wall is necessary to put the heat back on the Dems, rather than the nuclear option of using his absolute power to bypass them.

For the viewing public tuning in to see what crazy things the Don will say, the downside is that this is an Oval Office speech and not a town rally. It is hard to imagine him going off script when the only audience is a camera and no living people in his sightlines to feed his ego, and I'm sure Steven Miller has got tight reins on that script and its message. Not that I don't expect there to be majorly inflammatory rhetoric in it - Miller is by all accounts a reprehensible human being (never met the man, to be as fair as possible) and not so secretly racist, but he is savvy in ways Donald is not, so he can craft a devious message and let his puppet parrot the lines.

The Democrats have already booked time for a rebuttal from Schumer and Pelosi right after. Won't be much time to script a response cribbing from Trump's comments, but I don't think that should be their focus. They have so many targets to hit here, the question is: will they do it right? History suggests Democrats don't, because they want to appeal to the humanity in Americans, rather than get dirty and call out the liars and hypocrites for fear of retaliation. IMO, their talking points need to be the following, repeated ad nauseum to frame the counter-attack properly:

1. Trump has lied from the beginning. "Mexico will pay for the wall!" Now, knowing that it was a phony and impossible promise from the beginning, he wants the American taxpayer to pay for his lies, and is willing to hold them hostage (Gov't shutdown putting 800,000 out of work and pay) to get his way, and for months or years, just to get his way. This President will destroy the average American he swore an oath on the Constitution to protect, by putting his own needs ahead of yours as Americans.

2. "I own the shutdown". We all saw these words from his mouth. He has repeated them. Not only does he own it, he is PROUD of it. Proud of putting hundreds of thousands of Americans out of work for his own vanity project, and he will do so for as long as he wants - months to years. This is the man who would protect the average Joe from big Government?

3. Crisis at the border: another LIE. Only 4 terror suspect at the southern border, not 6,000. Vast majority of influx of drugs, terror watch list suspects, and crime comes through legal ports of entry like sea, or moreso, air. And what has the President done to protect our airports. Shutdown the Government, leading to zero pay for TSA agents who have now stopped showing up. Our airports are now less secure, all because of the president. HE has caused the greatest threat to our safety now. [it may be gilding the lily to say "Remember the last time our airspace was compromised by those 19 Saudi hijackers - a country our President still upholds as a vital and important economic trade partner (so we can see whose economic interest he DOES care about, if not 800,000 Americans) despite knowing of the implication of that country's Crown prince in the coldblooded murder of an American citizen and journalist" - that statement could generate a lot of heat, but if you are going to get in a street fight, you have to fight to hurt, I say].

4. Democrats WANT to fix this problem. Border security is important, which is why we voted to pass 1.6 billion in funding in our last bill, to spend on NECESSARY improvements. The Republicans (McConnell) now refuse to bring that bill to the Senate for a vote. Funny though, they passed the exact same bill two weeks ago 100-0 before the President vetoed it. Now they have fallen in line with the President's position to hold the country hostage until he gets his way.

 

Any soft sell that makes this about being a good country and HELPING in a Humanitarian crisis just washes over Trump's misdeeds and plays into his hands ("see, the Dems agree that this is a crisis"). Experience makes me worry that the Democrats will choose this touchy feely route and lose the message battle.

Edited by TrueBlue4ever

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If he's not going to declare a state of emergency, what was the point of that address? That was a whole lot of nothing that is easily debunked. His supporters are already foaming at the mouth for "illegals" (AKA brown people), so what did it accomplish? 

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27 minutes ago, JCon said:

If he's not going to declare a state of emergency, what was the point of that address? That was a whole lot of nothing that is easily debunked. His supporters are already foaming at the mouth for "illegals" (AKA brown people), so what did it accomplish? 

fomenting fear. it's like the (insert ominous music) CARAVAAAAAAAN! just a more presidential way of fomenting fear.... 

 

 

what an ass...

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JFK telling the country about life-threatening Cuban missiles. 
George W Bush trying to calm the country after 9/11.

Now the Oval Office is simply used for a recycle/rehash of fake partisan talking points, in aid of a faux crisis.  Networks cut Trump some slack, here.....although this morning they probably wonder why.

Blabbed on about the drugs, even though 90% (according to his own officials) comes in though legal points of entry.
Blabbed on about the murdering/rapist hordes flowing over the border, even though the vast majority of illegals are overstays
Blabbed on about Democrats asking him for a steel barrier (yet another lie)

He did drop the line, that 4,000 terrorists have crossed into the country from the porous southern border. Probably because Sarah Sanders, got demolished on Fox News by Chris Wallace, on it.

Then this business of Trump breathing heavily, gulping and rambling on about how he looked into peoples eyes, held their hands, felt their pain - while squinting right at the teleprompter.  Having the king narcissist  portraying himself as some agent of compassion and empathy, was as phony as a two dollar bill or for that matter, this entire cooked up "crisis" 

True to form, the only time Trump actually seemed a bit animated, was when he went into fear factor mode, and rolled out a litany of murders and rapes, hammer beatings and knife stabbings, beheadings and dismemberments of Americans by “illegal aliens”.

The real current crisis, these days..... is having this immoral and mendacious idiot as US President.

Edited by do or die

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I think the goal was for Trump to sound sincere and Presidential.  It might have been his best address.  He still sounded half asleep and not remotely sincere.  Everyone reads off teleprompters but rarely do Presidents sound like their reading words they have never seen before or believe in.  Trump always sounds that way when he's reading.

If Trump really felt like the US needed protection from immigrants who commit violent crimes to the extent he wants a wall, why does he care so little when American's commit crimes with guns?

How many generations back to the vast majority of us have to go to be immigrants?  Trump?  ONE.  Him as his followers are NOT anti-immigrant. Their anti-brown people.  They dont care how many white people come in.  

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1 minute ago, do or die said:

The US used to have all the unbelievable vehicles......until the bad hombres came over and stole them all.  

Do you know how big their caravans are? 

Dodge only makes an 8-seater Caravan. The Caravan them illegals had carried thousands of them!

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As Steve Schmidt said "Where Are The Pesos" that Trump promised the people during the campaign and by the way are people that stupid that another country would pay something because a blowhard says they will, No pesos for the wall and Trump if he gets his way will make the stupid peons pay for the wall with American taxpayer money.

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So now that the televised plea and counter-argument have occurred, with the subsequent 2 minute candy meeting and walkout yesterday, what is the next step for each party, and what is the end-game for each?

For Trump, he has 2 acceptable options for him it seems. Compromising and backing off his wall is not one of them, and his history of lawsuits as a private businessman suggests that he will drag this out as long as he can and try to bury the other side with deep pockets. Unlike his business days, where he could afford expensive litigation to tire out the other side, the money this time is the lack of paychecks for Government workers, he can outlast them. So he can (a) just ride this out until the other side blinks (does he really care if it kills his chances of re-election, especially if we believe that he never wanted the gig n the first place and this was just a branding experiment gone horribly wrong?), or (b) declare a national emergency and get his funding without compromise. Although funny that it was pointed out (on CNN) that he says he will not declare an emergency as long as he thinks he can work out a deal, but will do so "if the other side proves to be unreasonable", and they raised the proper question "since by definition an emergency is an urgent situation, how can he delay action now and then say later it is an emergency when he has sat on his hands for so long with no change in conditions?"

For Democrats, do they have options other than (a) hold fast and watch the workers suffer, hoping they win the PR battle over whose fault it is, or (b) compromise and agree to wall funding to get government open again? Tough sell on option (a) if they keep touting that they are the party wanting to work out this problem. What concessions can they make to show that they are being reasonable without giving in fully? Or do they have a third nuclear option? That being, push hard for impeachment now? They have plenty of ammo to do it already, how would it play out if they now said "on top of everything else, we now have a leader who doesn't want to lead anymore, wants to shut down the government, keep it shut, and walks away from any meeting without any effort to fix the problems of his own making. So if he doesn't want to be a leader, maybe it's time to remove him from office and find someone who does?"

Does that ploy work, and could it be their ace in the hole, much like Trump's "emergency funding" ace in the hole?

What do Republicans do? It seems they are trying to concoct a new scenario where they offer DACA relief to the Dems like they so long wanted, in exchange for border wall money. This may be seen by the public as the best compromise. The Dems look weak if they give in, but look petty and vindictive with a purely political agenda if they don't take what they have advocated for which is now being offered. It makes them more about beating Trump than solving problems.

So thoughts on what the next moves are?

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