Running Game

[Floyd]

MB likes running backs who can punch up the gut and be quick out options for the QB... Chevon Walker was pretty good at this, Grigsby is playing like a receiver not an RB now...  big mistake not going for Messam when we had the chance.

 

Have to give Cotton the start against Toronto but if I was Walters, I would be chatting with Taman about a trade for Anthony Allen - maybe for a 3rd rounder?  Yeah, he's fumbled a couple times but he is exactly the kind of back MB likes

 

After that, any ideas?  Once Sask eliminated the running game, they just started keying in on Willy.  He's not going to finish the season if this isn't fixed soon.

[Goalie]

Messam wouldn't have looked as good here as does with SASK. While i agree Grigsby aint getting it done on the ground, neither does cotton when he gets his chances, tells me it's not exactly the RB who is to blame all the time, Our oline isn't very good at run blocking and i think that is the reason we have really no run game. It's on the Oline i think, the holes aren't there for these guys to run through, Messam had holes the size of some of our potholes in this city to run through,  Grigsby/Cotton/Insert name here doesn't. That's the difference, Messam here would look just like Grigsby, Getting stuffed in the backfield for losses cuz he would have no holes to run through. 

[Mr. Perfect]

I'd ask Taman what he wants for Allen for sure. I doubt that will happen though. Not being critical of Walters with that comment but you rarely see backs traded, and O'Shea has given no indication he is unhappy with Grigsby.

[Floyd]

Messam wouldn't have looked as good here as does with SASK. While i agree Grigsby aint getting it done on the ground, neither does cotton when he gets his chances, tells me it's not exactly the RB who is to blame all the time, Our oline isn't very good at run blocking and i think that is the reason we have really no run game. It's on the Oline i think, the holes aren't there for these guys to run through, Messam had holes the size of some of our potholes in this city to run through,  Grigsby/Cotton/Insert name here doesn't. That's the difference, Messam here would look just like Grigsby, Getting stuffed in the backfield for losses cuz he would have no holes to run through. 

 

Messam is 6" taller and 50lbs heavier.

[Floyd]

I'd ask Taman what he wants for Allen for sure. I doubt that will happen though. Not being critical of Walters with that comment but you rarely see backs traded, and O'Shea has given no indication he is unhappy with Grigsby.

 

OShea gives no indication of anything, ha...   wouldn't want to play poker against him thats for sure.

[Goalie]

 

Messam wouldn't have looked as good here as does with SASK. While i agree Grigsby aint getting it done on the ground, neither does cotton when he gets his chances, tells me it's not exactly the RB who is to blame all the time, Our oline isn't very good at run blocking and i think that is the reason we have really no run game. It's on the Oline i think, the holes aren't there for these guys to run through, Messam had holes the size of some of our potholes in this city to run through,  Grigsby/Cotton/Insert name here doesn't. That's the difference, Messam here would look just like Grigsby, Getting stuffed in the backfield for losses cuz he would have no holes to run through. 

 

Messam is 6" taller and 50lbs heavier.

 

Who really cares, our oline sucks, Without an oline, messam is invisible, Seriously he has one good half against the bombers and all of a sudden he's some superstar running back? Please man, there was a reason he wasn't starting and still isn't starting... Dude had one good half, let's not get ridiculous and if you don't think the OLINE plays a role in what a running back does, you are crazy, sask leads the league in rushing, it's no coincidence they have the best oline in the league too. 

[Floyd]

 

 

Messam wouldn't have looked as good here as does with SASK. While i agree Grigsby aint getting it done on the ground, neither does cotton when he gets his chances, tells me it's not exactly the RB who is to blame all the time, Our oline isn't very good at run blocking and i think that is the reason we have really no run game. It's on the Oline i think, the holes aren't there for these guys to run through, Messam had holes the size of some of our potholes in this city to run through,  Grigsby/Cotton/Insert name here doesn't. That's the difference, Messam here would look just like Grigsby, Getting stuffed in the backfield for losses cuz he would have no holes to run through. 

 

Messam is 6" taller and 50lbs heavier.

 

Who really cares, our oline sucks, Without an oline, messam is invisible, Seriously he has one good half against the bombers and all of a sudden he's some superstar running back? Please man, there was a reason he wasn't starting and still isn't starting... Dude had one good half, let's not get ridiculous and if you don't think the OLINE plays a role in what a running back does, you are crazy, sask leads the league in rushing, it's no coincidence they have the best oline in the league too. 

 

 

I think our DL may have noticed a difference between Messam and Ford...

 

Call me crazy but I'm not throwing our OL under the bus.

 

Goossen was in over his head and Howard was very average but MB is calling the wrong game for Grigsby.  When the going gets tough, MB starts running up the gut - if you have Messam, you get 3-4 yards at worst... if you have Grigsby, you get minus two.

[Goalie]

Goossen IMO looked pretty decent most  game actually, Howard was fine too, It was morley and more so January being schooled out there tonight...

 

Lol, if you have messam playing against the bombers, he gets 3-4 yards at worst sure but outside of this game, what has messam done this season again? 

 

One half of football doesn't really mean much. The lack of run game for us is a direct result of us having an oline that can not RUN BLOCK... 

 

Messam ripping us in the second half, All taht shows really is the riders have a very good oline cuz once again, guess what...  Riders lead the league in rushing... by quite a bit actually.. and they have used several different running backs... Allen, Ford, Charles, Messam, who else? 

 

It doesn't matter which RB the riders put back there, that guy gains yards... That's because of their oline, not cuz of the running back. Put grigsby behind that sask oline and he looks better too, can believe it if you want but... Theres some pretty strong evidence not based on just one half of football that  backs that statement up. 

 

People can talk about Kory Sheets last year with SASK too, look what he did, BS he did it all on his own, he didn't... doesn't matter if its sheets, ford, allen, messam, grigsby, cotton,charles, some dude just signed off the street, he'd put up yards behind that oline. 

 

And anyone who doesn't want to believe that, well, theres a season and 1/3rd worth of evidence that says it don't matter who the riders use at RB, that guy puts up big numbers. 

[Floyd]

Goossen IMO looked pretty decent most  game actually, Howard was fine too, It was morley and more so January being schooled out there tonight...

 

Lol, if you have messam playing against the bombers, he gets 3-4 yards at worst sure but outside of this game, what has messam done this season again? 

 

One half of football doesn't really mean much. The lack of run game for us is a direct result of us having an oline that can not RUN BLOCK... 

 

Messam ripping us in the second half, All taht shows really is the riders have a very good oline cuz once again, guess what...  Riders lead the league in rushing... by quite a bit actually.. and they have used several different running backs... Allen, Ford, Charles, Messam, who else? 

 

It doesn't matter which RB the riders put back there, that guy gains yards... That's because of their oline, not cuz of the running back. Put grigsby behind that sask oline and he looks better too, can believe it if you want but... Theres some pretty strong evidence not based on just one half of football that  backs that statement up. 

 

People can talk about Kory Sheets last year with SASK too, look what he did, BS he did it all on his own, he didn't... doesn't matter if its sheets, ford, allen, messam, grigsby, cotton,charles, some dude just signed off the street, he'd put up yards behind that oline. 

 

And anyone who doesn't want to believe that, well, theres a season and 1/3rd worth of evidence that says it don't matter who the riders use at RB, that guy puts up big numbers. 

 

I always enjoy how you just start making stuff to argue about...  I think the Rider's line is the best in the league but its also possible to say that Messam would get more yards than Grigsby because he is bigger.

 

If you thought Goossen had a good game, you might want to rewatch it.  I like the guy and he had a rough night.  Howard got bullrushed and honestly sometimes it looked like he just avoided Chick if he was lined up against him.

 

Morley bailed us out on safety blitzes more than a few times - Morely and January were our best OL.

[iso_55]

I thought Morley did fairly well from what I saw. He was able to pull & stop the safety blitz to the outside of the tackles by Brackenridge. That's no easy feat for a center to get out there & make contact with a blitzing safety the speed of Brackenridge. Goosen had his moments... he'd like to forget & some where he shone. Our tackles couldn't handle Chick witness the guards helping out the blocking to double team him. 

[Goalie]

Yeah my bad there, Thought the interior of the line was actually pretty decent, the tackles and I'm gonna say this but more so January got absolutely schooled tonight.

 

They all had good moments though, Willy did have time to throw the ball several times actually... But i guess at the same time,  they all struggled too. Hell, look at sask, best OLINE in the league by far, doesn't matter who they put at RB, that guy produces...and even they looked a little lost at times tonight, Especially in the first half. 

 

I guess I can blame the oline for the lack of run game, i can blame the oline for almost getting Willy hurt out there... But i can't blame them for the interceptions that in the end cost us the game. 

[Mr. Perfect]

You can certainly blame them for the last one. Quite easily in fact. You can also blame them for the sack/fumble that resulted in the touchdown as well. Had the line done their job on that play there is no touchdown and there is no Washington fumble either on the return after. That's 10 points. We lost by 6. Simple concept.

[Goalie]

You can certainly blame them for the last one. Quite easily in fact. You can also blame them for the sack/fumble that resulted in the touchdown as well. Had the line done their job on that play there is no touchdown and there is no Washington fumble either on the return after. That's 10 points. We lost by 6. Simple concept.

hell, even with the washington fumble... thats just 7 points on that interception right there, instead of losing by 6, win by 1. Yeah the line sucked tonight, Wasn't at the game but they showed wylie a few times on tv and every time he was taking notes of some kind. Probably not too impressed tonight at all. Oline needs to step up. BIG TIME. But i guess, they are what they are and it's gonna take some time for them to actually get better. Are we the worst oline in the league? Nope, but... we certainly aren't even close to being one of the best.  I find it hard to blame them though for Willys decision to throw a 40 yard pass across the field like that... but still... Willy has to take some blame for that, he was the guy that threw the ball..

 

I want to call our oline Ondrej Pavelec, and by that what i mean is, If they are just average, don't have to be the best, just be average, i think we could do some good things. But they appear to be pretty below average right now and are really what is holding us back. No run game, Willy getting killed and hurried the last several games. Oline getting worse, sure they have some injuries to deal with but...

 

Guess when it comes to the oline, gotta be patient, no quick fixes out there, it's gonna take time, I mean, maybe we can look to upgrade our tackles, January included but... It's gonna take drafting to truly fix it.  I thought the interior though played pretty decent for the most part though but our tackles got owned several times tonight...

 

They all had issues but, the tackles didn't look good at all and they are Imports (internationals). 

[iso_55]

 

You can certainly blame them for the last one. Quite easily in fact. You can also blame them for the sack/fumble that resulted in the touchdown as well. Had the line done their job on that play there is no touchdown and there is no Washington fumble either on the return after. That's 10 points. We lost by 6. Simple concept.

hell, even with the washington fumble... thats just 7 points on that interception right there, instead of losing by 6, win by 1. Yeah the line sucked tonight, Wasn't at the game but they showed wylie a few times on tv and every time he was taking notes of some kind. Probably not too impressed tonight at all. Oline needs to step up. BIG TIME. But i guess, they are what they are and it's gonna take some time for them to actually get better. Are we the worst oline in the league? Nope, but... we certainly aren't even close to being one of the best.  I find it hard to blame them though for Willys decision to throw a 40 yard pass across the field like that... but still... Willy has to take some blame for that, he was the guy that threw the ball..

 

I want to call our oline Ondrej Pavelec, and by that what i mean is, If they are just average, don't have to be the best, just be average, i think we could do some good things. But they appear to be pretty below average right now and are really what is holding us back. No run game, Willy getting killed and hurried the last several games. Oline getting worse, sure they have some injuries to deal with but...

 

Guess when it comes to the oline, gotta be patient, no quick fixes out there, it's gonna take time, I mean, maybe we can look to upgrade our tackles, January included but... It's gonna take drafting to truly fix it.  I thought the interior though played pretty decent for the most part though but our tackles got owned several times tonight...

 

They all had issues but, the tackles didn't look good at all and they are Imports (internationals). 

 

Tackles couldn't handle Chick. He lined up a little  bit wider & they couldn't get out of their stance fast enough or have the foot speed to handle his jump off the snap of the ball. Chick & Charleston Hughes are the two best D ends in the CFL. 

[Goalie]

 

 

You can certainly blame them for the last one. Quite easily in fact. You can also blame them for the sack/fumble that resulted in the touchdown as well. Had the line done their job on that play there is no touchdown and there is no Washington fumble either on the return after. That's 10 points. We lost by 6. Simple concept.

hell, even with the washington fumble... thats just 7 points on that interception right there, instead of losing by 6, win by 1. Yeah the line sucked tonight, Wasn't at the game but they showed wylie a few times on tv and every time he was taking notes of some kind. Probably not too impressed tonight at all. Oline needs to step up. BIG TIME. But i guess, they are what they are and it's gonna take some time for them to actually get better. Are we the worst oline in the league? Nope, but... we certainly aren't even close to being one of the best.  I find it hard to blame them though for Willys decision to throw a 40 yard pass across the field like that... but still... Willy has to take some blame for that, he was the guy that threw the ball..

 

I want to call our oline Ondrej Pavelec, and by that what i mean is, If they are just average, don't have to be the best, just be average, i think we could do some good things. But they appear to be pretty below average right now and are really what is holding us back. No run game, Willy getting killed and hurried the last several games. Oline getting worse, sure they have some injuries to deal with but...

 

Guess when it comes to the oline, gotta be patient, no quick fixes out there, it's gonna take time, I mean, maybe we can look to upgrade our tackles, January included but... It's gonna take drafting to truly fix it.  I thought the interior though played pretty decent for the most part though but our tackles got owned several times tonight...

 

They all had issues but, the tackles didn't look good at all and they are Imports (internationals). 

 

Tackles couldn't handle Chick. He lined up a little  bit wider & they couldn't get out of their stance fast enough or have the foot speed to handle his jump off the snap of the ball. Chick & Charleston Hughes are the two best D ends in the CFL. 

 

Yup, the tackles had troubles stopping CHICK all night long... Not sure what game some were watching if they thought January was one of our best Oline tonight. I thought him and howard got absolutely owned and more so January actually. Some folks should watch the replay and just watch the tackles and more specifically January, He did not play well at all. Honestly, from my sober view on my couch at home, January looked the worst tonight... By far. Then howard but...January got owned pretty much every play.  Chick was in the NFL for a bit wasn't he or got a shot at least? Honestly after watching this game and several others this season involving the  Riders, i can see why.. The guy is probably too good of a player for the CFL, not a shot at the CFL at all, just i really think he's one of the best Defensive Ends in the league, Maybe the best actually. Wish we had a guy like that on our team.. I like our D actually, but man, we are really missing that pass rushing dominant defensive end, paging alex hall or justin hickman  

[iso_55]

Chick played for the Colts for 2 seasons...

[Bigblue204]

I don't care who we have in the back field. When they are met by two defenders as soon as they get the ball. They ain't going anywhere. If anything they should be trying some runs to the outside.

 

and a big fat no to Allen. The guy had one decent game against a hamilton team that looked like they didn't know they were playing that day.

[James]

 

 

Messam wouldn't have looked as good here as does with SASK. While i agree Grigsby aint getting it done on the ground, neither does cotton when he gets his chances, tells me it's not exactly the RB who is to blame all the time, Our oline isn't very good at run blocking and i think that is the reason we have really no run game. It's on the Oline i think, the holes aren't there for these guys to run through, Messam had holes the size of some of our potholes in this city to run through,  Grigsby/Cotton/Insert name here doesn't. That's the difference, Messam here would look just like Grigsby, Getting stuffed in the backfield for losses cuz he would have no holes to run through. 

 

Messam is 6" taller and 50lbs heavier.

 

Who really cares, our oline sucks, Without an oline, messam is invisible, Seriously he has one good half against the bombers and all of a sudden he's some superstar running back? Please man, there was a reason he wasn't starting and still isn't starting... Dude had one good half, let's not get ridiculous and if you don't think the OLINE plays a role in what a running back does, you are crazy, sask leads the league in rushing, it's no coincidence they have the best oline in the league too. 

 

 

Messam would be much better than Grigsby behind this O-line... It was a mistake not to sign him

[James]

 

 

 

You can certainly blame them for the last one. Quite easily in fact. You can also blame them for the sack/fumble that resulted in the touchdown as well. Had the line done their job on that play there is no touchdown and there is no Washington fumble either on the return after. That's 10 points. We lost by 6. Simple concept.

hell, even with the washington fumble... thats just 7 points on that interception right there, instead of losing by 6, win by 1. Yeah the line sucked tonight, Wasn't at the game but they showed wylie a few times on tv and every time he was taking notes of some kind. Probably not too impressed tonight at all. Oline needs to step up. BIG TIME. But i guess, they are what they are and it's gonna take some time for them to actually get better. Are we the worst oline in the league? Nope, but... we certainly aren't even close to being one of the best.  I find it hard to blame them though for Willys decision to throw a 40 yard pass across the field like that... but still... Willy has to take some blame for that, he was the guy that threw the ball..

 

I want to call our oline Ondrej Pavelec, and by that what i mean is, If they are just average, don't have to be the best, just be average, i think we could do some good things. But they appear to be pretty below average right now and are really what is holding us back. No run game, Willy getting killed and hurried the last several games. Oline getting worse, sure they have some injuries to deal with but...

 

Guess when it comes to the oline, gotta be patient, no quick fixes out there, it's gonna take time, I mean, maybe we can look to upgrade our tackles, January included but... It's gonna take drafting to truly fix it.  I thought the interior though played pretty decent for the most part though but our tackles got owned several times tonight...

 

They all had issues but, the tackles didn't look good at all and they are Imports (internationals). 

 

Tackles couldn't handle Chick. He lined up a little  bit wider & they couldn't get out of their stance fast enough or have the foot speed to handle his jump off the snap of the ball. Chick & Charleston Hughes are the two best D ends in the CFL. 

 

Yup, the tackles had troubles stopping CHICK all night long... Not sure what game some were watching if they thought January was one of our best Oline tonight. I thought him and howard got absolutely owned and more so January actually. Some folks should watch the replay and just watch the tackles and more specifically January, He did not play well at all. Honestly, from my sober view on my couch at home, January looked the worst tonight... By far. Then howard but...January got owned pretty much every play.  Chick was in the NFL for a bit wasn't he or got a shot at least? Honestly after watching this game and several others this season involving the  Riders, i can see why.. The guy is probably too good of a player for the CFL, not a shot at the CFL at all, just i really think he's one of the best Defensive Ends in the league, Maybe the best actually. Wish we had a guy like that on our team.. I like our D actually, but man, we are really missing that pass rushing dominant defensive end, paging alex hall or justin hickman

 

 

I saw you mention irrational bias towards a player from a poster on here.... well you have one against January... Howard was much worse... weather you like to admit it or not, January is one of our top 2 lineman.

 

I agree though that we need a stud pass rusher off the edge. Hunt and Hickman are both upgrades over what we have and Hunt is a FA, not sure on the status of Hickman, but if he's available I want him on the team

[Fraser]

Poor running back and poor run blocking aren't mutually exclusive. Sure there isn't much he can do wheb too guys are on him in the backfield, but he's shown he can't break a tackle or make a guy miss in the open field.

[gbill2004]

I wonder if Bellefeuille moved the pocket around more and Willy scrambled more whether that would open up some running lanes up the middle?

[GCn20]

You can certainly blame them for the last one. Quite easily in fact. You can also blame them for the sack/fumble that resulted in the touchdown as well. Had the line done their job on that play there is no touchdown and there is no Washington fumble either on the return after. That's 10 points. We lost by 6. Simple concept.

hell, even with the washington fumble... thats just 7 points on that interception right there, instead of losing by 6, win by 1. Yeah the line sucked tonight, Wasn't at the game but they showed wylie a few times on tv and every time he was taking notes of some kind. Probably not too impressed tonight at all. Oline needs to step up. BIG TIME. But i guess, they are what they are and it's gonna take some time for them to actually get better. Are we the worst oline in the league? Nope, but... we certainly aren't even close to being one of the best.  I find it hard to blame them though for Willys decision to throw a 40 yard pass across the field like that... but still... Willy has to take some blame for that, he was the guy that threw the ball..

 

I want to call our oline Ondrej Pavelec, and by that what i mean is, If they are just average, don't have to be the best, just be average, i think we could do some good things. But they appear to be pretty below average right now and are really what is holding us back. No run game, Willy getting killed and hurried the last several games. Oline getting worse, sure they have some injuries to deal with but...

 

Guess when it comes to the oline, gotta be patient, no quick fixes out there, it's gonna take time, I mean, maybe we can look to upgrade our tackles, January included but... It's gonna take drafting to truly fix it.  I thought the interior though played pretty decent for the most part though but our tackles got owned several times tonight...

 

They all had issues but, the tackles didn't look good at all and they are Imports (internationals).

Tackles couldn't handle Chick. He lined up a little  bit wider & they couldn't get out of their stance fast enough or have the foot speed to handle his jump off the snap of the ball. Chick & Charleston Hughes are the two best D ends in the CFL.

Yup, the tackles had troubles stopping CHICK all night long... Not sure what game some were watching if they thought January was one of our best Oline tonight. I thought him and howard got absolutely owned and more so January actually. Some folks should watch the replay and just watch the tackles and more specifically January, He did not play well at all. Honestly, from my sober view on my couch at home, January looked the worst tonight... By far. Then howard but...January got owned pretty much every play.  Chick was in the NFL for a bit wasn't he or got a shot at least? Honestly after watching this game and several others this season involving the  Riders, i can see why.. The guy is probably too good of a player for the CFL, not a shot at the CFL at all, just i really think he's one of the best Defensive Ends in the league, Maybe the best actually. Wish we had a guy like that on our team.. I like our D actually, but man, we are really missing that pass rushing dominant defensive end, paging alex hall or justin hickman

 

I saw you mention irrational bias towards a player from a poster on here.... well you have one against January... Howard was much worse... weather you like to admit it or not, January is one of our top 2 lineman.

 

I agree though that we need a stud pass rusher off the edge. Hunt and Hickman are both upgrades over what we have and Hunt is a FA, not sure on the status of Hickman, but if he's available I want him on the team

Hunt was signed by the Colts a couple days ago and Hickman is still not fully recovered.

[LeBird]

Gribsby did not have a good game no doubt but I would wait and see what he does on Tuesday and see what happens there. It seems to me every time he got the ball he was looking at a brick wall. How many times did it happen by the time he got the ball their Dline had broken through our line? 

 

I think (making this a personal observation) we need to fix our Oline before asking our guys to run through people. Replaying the game and pausing at the times he got the ball I can see why he would dance around wondering "where the heck do I go". If we don't take care of that problem we will continue to have Edmonton/Regina type games on a regular basis.

[17to85]

neither does cotton when he gets his chances, 

all 6 rushes he's had tell you that? Come on, give a runningback a chance to actually carry the mail not one carry here, or one carry there. He showed he was much better than Grigsby in preseason at getting something from nothing, give him an actual chance to do it in regular season.

[Dirty30]

Sheets would be a good option if he wasn't able to crack the Raiders. It would be nice to have Alex Hall back too. I think he would help tremendously against the run.