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Ladd and Buff


Ducky
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What should we do with them?

Is signing them to a bad contract worse than not signing either and losing them for nothing?

What term and how much should they be paid?

If we sign only one, which should it be?

If we trade one, what should we be looking to get back?? A LHD??

 

Buff  AAV - 5.2m   Actual salary - 6m

Ladd AAV - 4.4m  Actual salary - 4.5m

 

I'd like to see them both signed but I think Ladd is easier to replace; however, what does trading do or say to your team?

Neither should get more than a 6 year term in my opinion.

I wouldn't go higher than 6.25 for Ladd or 7 for Buff.

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  • 1 month later...

If Buff and Ladd walk after this year is it really such a bad thing?

Let's say they saved 13m for 6 years by not signing them.

Can they be replaced for 13 million?

 

What if Chevy went out and signed Okposo for 6 years at 5.5-6m per year? How much will Eric Staal cost?

 

Then, he signed an offer sheet to Lindholm or Maatta or Vatanen or Murray for 5-5.4 per year? Their teams will all be close to the cap and will struggle to match a long term offer. This would probably cost a 1st and and a 3rd. I'd give up a 1st and a 3rd for any one of them.

 

Or Chevy could sign Yandle or Campbell or Hamhuis or someone of that ilk for about 3-4 years for 5-5.5 per year.

 

Is this a better team with the RFA signed and Okposo? I think it is.

Is it a better team with the UFA and Okposo signed? Not quite.

 

What about trading them both for picks and prospects and going the RFA and/or UFA and THEN, keep an ear to what Ladd and Buff are being offered as UFAs.

 

I would trade them both, make offer sheets to some RFAs and go after somebody on the UFA market to replace Ladd.

If we are only trading one, let it be Ladd.

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Trade them if they don't sign by January. That simple.

Is Ladd worth 6 million a year? Should he be paid more than wheeler? ? No.

Is buff worth 7 million a year? He's a good player but he definitely take a lots of nights off too. Is he elite? Probably not.

Trade them for assets and picks and hand the team over to wheeler scheif ehlers trouba helle. Little

I'd move Toby too. He's not worth what he's being paid.

If they suck for a couple years but are very good for more than a couple years... that's fine. I'd rather have a young team with potential over a bubble playoff team that's for sure.

If Ladd and Buff were younger... give them the money but they really don't fit with the younger new future core

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To me, if they walk, it would depend how that money was spent.

That makes no sense. You can't lose assets for nothing and pat yourself on the back for having extra money to spend. You can trade them for picks and cost yourself no money and still get assets in return.

 

I agree that the best would be to get NHL ready prospects but if they do walk and are replaced with an equal or better talent for less or the same caphit, did you lose?

I agree with goalie though, if they aren't signed by mid-January and we're out of the playoffs, you start shopping them to see what you can get around the trade deadline or even before.

Buff will get you more than Ladd but they will both bring a good return. Buff should return a 1st, a good prospect and a 3rd liner. Ladd would be almost the same.

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To answer Ducky's original ask. Yes (IMO) it's worse to lose them for nothing than to sign for a "bad" contract.

 

The thing with "bad" contracts is you can move them for assets down the road. Sure, not easy & I'm sure those are tougher to pull off. But to me the flip side is a far worse scenario.

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Here's another thought to play with. Had we gotten an extension done for Ladd and/or Buff this past summer - would we actually be "worse off" or hamstrung by the cap, like the popular notion seems to suggest?

 

I think if either of them had a 5 or 6 year deal signed they'd be easier to move, and actually make us more flexible right now.  

 

It's pretty widely confirmed Chevy offered Buff for Hamonic. You think Snow turns that down if he knows for sure he's got Buff long term? 

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Sometimes people look at todays cap and then add the full salary of new deals.  In other words, adding $12 million.  But ofcourse you must include their current pay in that.  So it's more like $4 million.  I dont think we'd be hamstrung.  And even if we were, you can make trades.

 

But we know the Jets have projections going out for years on the budget in general and players specifically (Chipman confirmed this in an interview a few weeks back).  So the Jets know what they want to do and considering there has been little to no discussion with Buff's people and the speculation that he was offered for Hamonic, I'd say they've decided to move away from Buff.

 

If the speculation on the Ladd deal is true (6X6 on the table), it would indicate they want to keep Ladd but wont break the bank.  I had read that Ladd asked for $6.5.  So if thats true, they arent that far apart.  And if anything, Ladd hasnt done himself any favours with his play this season.  Ofcourse, that doesnt preclude a team in Free Agency over-paying but the trend seems to be going the opposite direction.

 

No one cane make Ladd & Buff sign with the Jets and no one can make the Jets sign a bad deal.  The one thing the Jets control is where those two players are at the deadline, either here or somewhere else.  They *must* exercise their control and either force them into deals the team can live with or trade them.  That's the only outcome that makes sense.

 

If Chevy lets them go to Free Agency, its a blunder of epic proportions.  If the idea was to let them go for nothing and consider the salary savings to be a win, then trade them for no salary (picks, prospects) and you've still saved all the salary while bringing in useful assets.

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Sometimes people look at todays cap and then add the full salary of new deals.  In other words, adding $12 million.  But ofcourse you must include their current pay in that.  So it's more like $4 million.  I dont think we'd be hamstrung.  And even if we were, you can make trades.

 

But we know the Jets have projections going out for years on the budget in general and players specifically (Chipman confirmed this in an interview a few weeks back).  So the Jets know what they want to do and considering there has been little to no discussion with Buff's people and the speculation that he was offered for Hamonic, I'd say they've decided to move away from Buff.

 

If the speculation on the Ladd deal is true (6X6 on the table), it would indicate they want to keep Ladd but wont break the bank.  I had read that Ladd asked for $6.5.  So if thats true, they arent that far apart.  And if anything, Ladd hasnt done himself any favours with his play this season.  Ofcourse, that doesnt preclude a team in Free Agency over-paying but the trend seems to be going the opposite direction.

 

No one cane make Ladd & Buff sign with the Jets and no one can make the Jets sign a bad deal.  The one thing the Jets control is where those two players are at the deadline, either here or somewhere else.  They *must* exercise their control and either force them into deals the team can live with or trade them.  That's the only outcome that makes sense.

 

If Chevy lets them go to Free Agency, its a blunder of epic proportions.  If the idea was to let them go for nothing and consider the salary savings to be a win, then trade them for no salary (picks, prospects) and you've still saved all the salary while bringing in useful assets.

 

Nice post. We're both on the same page, I think.

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How bout staggered deals for both?

 

ex. 6,6,5,5,4,4,3,3

In a perfect world.  Because then it makes the cash diminish as their skills do and makes them more tradeable if need be in the future.  But then you're outlaying more now because Ladd wants $6.5 per year.  So it you're giving him $3.25 later (I think lowest year cant be less than 50% of highest year), Im too lazy to do math but I bet thats a lot of money over the first three years. 

 

And no way does anyone give them 7 (or 8) years.  I think most GM's would shy away from that now, for 30 year old players.

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I think they will hold onto Buff if they are in a playoff run (doubtful) but trade him if they are not. How is Trouba going to develop properly playing behind Myers and Buff? Myers and Buff get ice time with Little's and Scheifele's lines and Trouba sees more ti me with the 3rd and 4th lines and next to no PP ti me. Also, he sees most of this time paired with Stuart, a 7th or 8th D man.

I really wonder if Buff could adapt later in his career to being a physical shutdown D man?

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