LeBird

and do you understand why that was? You know how undesirable a place you are for coaches when the average head coach gets 2 or 3 seasons before being fired and coordinators are lucky to get 1? Which proven coordinators do you suppose would want to come here if we fired the ones we have this year? You guys know that the lack of stability in the coacing and GM ranks is the reason guys like Stubler decided not to come here? This happens in other cities and yet they have no problem hiring quality coordinators and coaches afterwards. Ie Toronto, Hamilton, Montreal, Edmonton, Saskatchewan...pretty much the whole league actually. Does it? BC has been pretty stable with Wally as GM and his guys taking over after him, Hufnagel has been in Calgary for a long time running things, Popp has been in Montreal forever, Barker in Toronto for a long time... Saskatchewan had some turmoil for a while and it got them into a tricky spot but now it's stable again. The Bombers though? 4 different Gms in the past 7 seasons and 5 head coaches in that same time frame. You wonder why we can't get anyone with a proven track record to come here? It's basically been a guarantee to have your reputation trashed. Are we to assume the people we fired have done well in other cities after being fired here?

It's OK, not all fans are created equal, some people just aren't as much of a fan as others and can only support a winner. No shame in being less of a fan than the rest of us. All the fans who have purchased tickets for the last 24 years but still want a team that will be at least 9-9 would strongly disagree with your comment. Being willing to accept poor performances and failure every year would never work in any other business and definitively does not make one a better fan. What's the incentive for the club to get better if all were to accept its failure. A company would not wait one and a half year to decide whether you're good or not. Let's face it, we hired HC's that had no experience and have paid them handsomely while they were learning and perhaps becoming good at their job. Seems we never learn so we get stuck having to wait into the next year to see if the training has pay off. If it hasn't we start again with a new rookie and promises things will be better this time. No, those who while not accepting what is happening but still showing up are the real fans, not those who drank the kool-aid because Jimmy Jones told them to. All I am saying is if you aren't buying season tickets because the team isn't winning you aren't that much of a fan. If I lived in Winnipeg I'd be buying season tickets every year and it wouldn't even be a question. So who said the fans were not buying tickets because the team was not winning. After having been screwed for all these years I think the Winnipeg/Manitoba fan is exemplary. Remember, a fan does not have a seat on the BOD table so he just can't walk up and say:"You guys's system stinks." The only way he can express his displeasure is by using his cash to do something else on game day. The Bomber Club does not have an inherent right to expect fans to show up, it's a privilege it must earn but for years it's a privilege it has enjoyed on credit. Good for you for wanting to be at the game, that would make you another of the 28,000 or so who were there this year. Discount the last two games when many fans decided to speak to the Board.

It's OK, not all fans are created equal, some people just aren't as much of a fan as others and can only support a winner. No shame in being less of a fan than the rest of us. All the fans who have purchased tickets for the last 24 years but still want a team that will be at least 9-9 would strongly disagree with your comment. Being willing to accept poor performances and failure every year would never work in any other business and definitively does not make one a better fan. What's the incentive for the club to get better if all were to accept its failure. A company would not wait one and a half year to decide whether you're good or not. Let's face it, we hired HC's that had no experience and have paid them handsomely while they were learning and perhaps becoming good at their job. Seems we never learn so we get stuck having to wait into the next year to see if the training has pay off. If it hasn't we start again with a new rookie and promises things will be better this time. No, those who while not accepting what is happening but still showing up are the real fans, not those who drank the kool-aid because Jimmy Jones told them to.

It's short sighted and doesn't take into account the starting point, and it's part of the reason why we've had this 25 year drought. Too many people have been fired because the instant results weren't there, or the team took a slight step back. All these knee jerk reactions because people only looked at wins and losses has done more damage to this team than anything.This.. Omg so much this.. If previous regimes hadn't mortgaged the future so often to try and appease the filthy unwashed masses,.maybe the drought would have ended years ago... But because they got so caught up on wins and losses, draft picks a plenty were traded or burned... QBs crushed without getting ample time to acclimate...A rebuild will never take a season or two... Especially after the destruction of our core like we have seen over and over again. It HAS happened before, yes... But that's the exception, not the norm.. That excuse is getting almost as old as the original sin and this draft thing is also getting well worn. How many of the Oline guys do we have left from our first choices? The fans had nothing to do with the choice of Etienne. But I guess it much easier to blame the fans instead of the very poor choice of managers we hired. We didn't trade or burn our choices, we wasted them because we picked the wrong guys. Further we did not pick up vets that could have helped us but choose to go with raw US rookies in previous years or in this year for that matter. How are the fans to blame for that? We let an all star guard go because we wanted to make him a center and he said no. (His words).However, after the results of this year it will be very hard to blame the fans again. Going into next year with this team will get MOS in a very bad position comes LDC. One thing you must agree with, the fans will not wait another 2 or 3 years to get results and they shouldn't. Hamilton were 6-12 in 2012 and Grey Cup participants the next. By the way MOS keeps saying he has a very good team, so much for the destruction of the core. The previous regimes panicked over and over again when the losses piled up and the fanbase got up in arms.. Deny it all you want but why else would they throw away first rounders on bum QBs or go for boom or bust draft picks who were expected to wow from the start? Frankly, i dont care if you agree with me or not.. Im confident that miller wont sway from his path, nor walters or O'shea.. i believe they understand what needs to be done to finish this process and know just how brutal this teams non imp and imp depth was.. Oh and for the record... That core we have.. Its pretty small. How much of it was carried over from 2-3 seasons ago? Thats not destruction, thats rebuilding.. Because we just did not know what we were going. Rookies all around.will get you that.

It's short sighted and doesn't take into account the starting point, and it's part of the reason why we've had this 25 year drought. Too many people have been fired because the instant results weren't there, or the team took a slight step back. All these knee jerk reactions because people only looked at wins and losses has done more damage to this team than anything. This.. Omg so much this.. If previous regimes hadn't mortgaged the future so often to try and appease the filthy unwashed masses,.maybe the drought would have ended years ago... But because they got so caught up on wins and losses, draft picks a plenty were traded or burned... QBs crushed without getting ample time to acclimate... A rebuild will never take a season or two... Especially after the destruction of our core like we have seen over and over again. It HAS happened before, yes... But that's the exception, not the norm.. That excuse is getting almost as old as the original sin and this draft thing is also getting well worn. How many of the Oline guys do we have left from our first choices? The fans had nothing to do with the choice of Etienne. But I guess it much easier to blame the fans instead of the very poor choice of managers we hired. We didn't trade or burn our choices, we wasted them because we picked the wrong guys. Further we did not pick up vets that could have helped us but choose to go with raw US rookies in previous years or in this year for that matter. How are the fans to blame for that? We let an all star guard go because we wanted to make him a center and he said no. (His words). However, after the results of this year it will be very hard to blame the fans again. Going into next year with this team will get MOS in a very bad position comes LDC. One thing you must agree with, the fans will not wait another 2 or 3 years to get results and they shouldn't. Hamilton were 6-12 in 2012 and Grey Cup participants the next. By the way MOS keeps saying he has a very good team, so much for the destruction of the core.

Especially since it's only 24. 25 seasons. So are you including 1990 when we won, or next year? Because including a season that has yet to be played, well you might as well just say it's been infinity since we won. I really don't want to do this. 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 00 01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 Now if you want to get out some kind of soft tipped device (easy jokes to make if you want) so you don't leave scratches on your screen and count those, it will add up to 24. The title of the thread is 25th year and talks about next year.

It's short sighted and doesn't take into account the starting point, and it's part of the reason why we've had this 25 year drought. Too many people have been fired because the instant results weren't there, or the team took a slight step back. All these knee jerk reactions because people only looked at wins and losses has done more damage to this team than anything. No, this is a sports team who's business is to acquire players that will play well enough to win cups. Further, in sports the clock starts the day after you have won the cup and to say we should disregard all the prior years because this one looks better does not hold water. This is one of many such years that looked very good. We can dig up all kind of posts that supported coaches because they was on the right path. And to say MOS brought in a lot of talent begs one to ask how good was that talent that resulted in the team losing the last eight games after a 5-1 start. I'm not calling for his firing but if he and his buds do not make significant improvements during the off season things might get undone.

Making sure he finishes the year in one piece would also be be a very positive note. Adding another loss to an 8 game losing streak really does not make much difference. I don't think Willy has anything to prove as to his toughness or ability. If Mike feels he has to show he can win well the time has passed for this round.

Hummm Where did we just hear of things that only worked in space? Grizzly comes to mind. Talking of Grigsby I have to admit I was wrong about Cotton not being better so the crow is being served but at least it's with Scotland's Finest.

Just wondering if the club will hand out a little 25th Anniversary watch with the picture of the Grey Cup on it when you buy the 2015 season tickets just to let us know they still have it around. And it doesn't have to work all that well. Did you know it's will be longer since our last Grey cup than the creation of the first Web Server as in WWW. .westillsuck.org (no .com then)

Playing Grigsby might have cost us a playoff birth but he played because he was told to play. How about Johnny Sears? Not playing was a very bad decision too. The blame should be on those who made it happen.

How true that is. Keeping him in the game was a terrible decision.

What does that say about the guy who watched those 49 sacks happen and did not tell the OC his scheme sucked and would have to change? Or was the OC assuming the duties of the HC?

Yeah but how many are on the practice roster?

"Not paying attention to what the stats reveal will give you a 6-12 team." Norman Einstein.

That shows is that teams playing us were having a better game rushing so were doing more of it. The original stats posted show two things: 1 - The teams with better rushing yards do so with a better offensive line. 2 - If you have a better offensive line the passing game will also be better Therefore: you win more games.

Just like he never did grasp the need for a good vet to rookie ratio.

Grigsby should have signed with the Riders if he wanted that.I thought chlorine made your colon white and shiny?But if you have some of it surgically removed, it becomes a semi-colon. Either way...I hope Grigsby (and Kent Austin) develop a bad case of the runs. How about this equation: Grigsby started off playing very well then things changed and his production went south. Our Head coach also started doing great things. Then other teams changed things and he like Grigsby has done very little. Should we also wish him a bad case of the runs? It almost seems as if some are going out of their way to deflect the blame. O'Shea said the Oline had played very well in the last game. He had not been saying that before but that players were taking turns missing assignments. In his previous carries before Saturday Cotton had 19 for a total of 51 yards. Isn't it strange that Willy's production, sacks and knock downs seem to increase at about the time the running game decreased? How Grigsby left the team has nothing to do with his ability to play but he surely deserves flack for not wishing to sit. Further, I don't want to start a discussion on the qualities of O'Shea. Listening to him on his show made me think he was being asked to load sixteen tons with only a spoon. Let's just hope the coming year brings him decent talent.

Hamilton Scratching Post, Drew Edwards Oct 19 "Why then would general manager and head coach Kent Austin, who speaks constantly about the need for a positive locker room culture, take a chance on Grigsby? The short answer is: he wouldn't. Austin has decided to bring Grigsby to town because he and his staff have spent nearly a week doing what now commonly referred to as “due diligence.” They've talked extensively with Grigsby's ex-coaches and others in the business they know and trust to a get a sense of both the player and the man. If history is any guide, Austin has spoken with Grigsby to form his own opinions and lay the groundwork on what the expectations will be coming in."

Dollarama next Monday.

Well I don't know. The feeling here is that Cotton has gotten his groove after after one game so had he been put in say in late August there were three games where Grigsby got a total of 73 yards. With Cotton fine tuned we could have won at least three games. As one reminded me yesterday he ran against the best well rested defense and look what he did. The main reason he did very well was the oline played better and the QB's were not known from films like things were at the start of the year. Let's get this straight. My beef has never been about the running back but with our Oline. They showed up to play last night after two months of snoozing. It's not about Grigsby vs Cotton. Cotton might be a better back and if that's the case that's great. It would also appear we will be able to see what Grigsby will do with another team.

Cotton played behind an oline like we had the first games of the year where Grigsby ran for 120 yards. In last week's game where Cotton played behind the same line Grigsby had been he did just as little. Cotton did have a very good game but surely you will admit the line was totally different than it had been since the beginning of September. Actually, no, I don't have to admit that. The pressure the D had on our QB was just as bad as usual, we just had Brohm who was getting rid of the football faster, and Marve who was running away from the pressure, which tells me our Oline was not doing much better then usual. I think Cotton is just getting his groove back finally now that he's getting reps and starting to read the defense better. You're right, it is just one game, but I think if they keep giving Cotton the ball, he'll really show when he can do. Also, the first game we played was against Toronto when they were at their worst. That's when Grigsby ran all over them. This was against one of the best teams in the league, who just came off fresh from a buy week. Well I guess we should be all happy now that we have a good running back. Puzzling how O'Shea did not figure that out 10 weeks ago. We would surely be in the playoffs instead of being out looking in. It was not very nice of him to tell us everything about the team was cool when a guy was doing bugger all was not replaced sooner by another able to rip up the yards. How can you explain that. By your inattention to that issue you might want to take some credit for the fans who did not show up at the game.

I don't know about that, while I like Marve and would love to see him be the starter within a couple of years, throwing a raw rookie out there as the starter from day 1, is not something I'd be the most comfortable with. I'm still not sold on Willy and Brohm looks decent, but not much else IMO, however both have some time in this league and/or in the NFL. At this point they should be given the edge over Marve if nothing else, but to protect him. I don't think you are being fair to Willy. We put this guy behind a suspect line and watch him get beat up all year but still playing even when he's hurting. His play was exceptional until the pounding started to show its effect. How many times have we seen guys come into the game light it up then just flame out.

Cotton played behind an oline like we had the first games of the year where Grigsby ran for 120 yards. In last week's game where Cotton played behind the same line Grigsby had been he did just as little. Cotton did have a very good game but surely you will admit the line was totally different than it had been since the beginning of September.