I can't believe I am even making this Thread... 

 

But, it seems to have taken over the politics Thread so I figured we can hash this out here (though the way the conversation was heading about AGW, maybe it should have stayed in the Politics thread...

 

 

So here we go, let's have at it!

 

 

I believe there is overwhelming evidence in AGW and it is a vocal, self-serving minority of the scientific community that derail and muddy up the issue so we can not act in a constructive manner to curtail this global thread.

Edited January 2, 20233 yr by Wanna-B-Fanboy

3 minutes ago, rebusrankin said:

Couldn't resist. Sorry for being confrontational. All of that is commendable and you're clearly matching your actions with your beliefs. I'll be honest, I have a problem with those who preach enviromentalism and then still drive frequently, travel extensively etc.

Thanks. No worries. I was just wondering.

I wish I could do more- but it's tough raising a family, that takes up a **** load of my time. I honestly think that the best way to tackle climate change and the other host of issues (Micro-plastics, POPs {huge issue}, marginalized people, and so on) is through government intervention with laws and initiatives. 

2 hours ago, Mark F said:

Good choice. The future for kids being born now is grim.

 

what possible basis do you have to say this?  Humans on earth right now have the best quality of life ever enjoyed in our entire history as a species.  Every year more and more millions of people around the world have been lifted out of poverty, and are now being educated, while being given access to clean water and healthy food.  The future of this planet is extremely bright, as technology continues to advance and quality of life continues to get better.  Only 40 years ago, if you had bad kidneys or a bad heart, you were given a death sentence.  Now you can just get a new heart, and keep on living.  How cool is that!

The biggest disservice we can do for the next generation is tell them that their future is "grim".  This is just silly.  All the trends say otherwise.

1 hour ago, wanna-b-fanboy said:

I have chosen to have children. I am raising them to be little tree-huggers with purpose. My oldest is graduating this year and is making the transition from a mergers and acquisition lawyer to managing ethical hedge funds that focus on post fossil fuels.

what makes these funds "ethical" exactly?  Who makes this determination?

1 hour ago, wanna-b-fanboy said:

We have reduced our family's intake of beef and pork. 

What's wrong with beef and pork?  Both are excellent sources of protein.  I recommend eating more beef and pork.

25 minutes ago, kelownabomberfan said:

what makes these funds "ethical" exactly?  Who makes this determination?

What's wrong with beef and pork?  Both are excellent sources of protein.  I recommend eating more beef and pork.

If you honestly are looking for an answer to these questions, Google would be your best bet.

6 minutes ago, wanna-b-fanboy said:

If you honestly are looking for an answer to these questions, Google would be your best bet.

I grew up on a farm, and we grew our own pork, chicken, and some beef too.  Protein is very important to peoples' diets, and so I would not recommend cutting back, if you are interested in eating healthy.  

https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/foods/pork#nutrition

 

4 minutes ago, kelownabomberfan said:

I grew up on a farm, and we grew our own pork, chicken, and some beef too.  Protein is very important to peoples' diets, and so I would not recommend cutting back, if you are interested in eating healthy.  

https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/foods/pork#nutrition

 

Cool- thanks for the info. 

A little off topic- maybe you should start a thread on that- I am sure there are many posters who would like to chime in as well as become more informed. 

one half million march in Montreal

 

https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=1791534

5 minutes ago, Mark F said:

one half million march in Montreal

 

https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=1791534

That is awesome to see. 

 

Thanks for sharing!

25 minutes ago, kelownabomberfan said:

what makes these funds "ethical" exactly?  Who makes this determination?

What's wrong with beef and pork?  Both are excellent sources of protein.  I recommend eating more beef and pork.

If you honestly are looking for an answer to these questions, Google would be your best bet.

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2019/09/can-world-make-chemicals-it-needs-without-oil

renewable is already cheaper than four cents a kilowatt hour, the price mentioned in the article.

interesting article.

So Canada, which is basically carbon neutral if you factor in our sinks, needs to make all these sacrifices and changes why again? Even if we hit net zero, that's a 1% change in global emissions at best, but really end up being nothing as emissions continue to rise from the big polluters and emerging markets.

So the whole purpose is to show the world that we can do it? Like China, USA, Russia, India give a flying **** what we do?

Even someone with a learning disability can see how futile this is.  

Cool article- this goes back to what @pigseye was talking about ways to take care of the waste. I totally agree that a way to dispose or transform the wastes is a huge step in mitigating Climate Crisis- but we also need to eventually curb our use of fossil fuels.

https://scitechdaily.com/using-nanoparticles-to-convert-co2-into-valuable-resources/

Edited September 30, 20196 yr by wanna-b-fanboy

13 hours ago, wanna-b-fanboy said:

Cool article- this goes back to what @pigseye was talking about ways to take care of the waste. I totally agree that a way to dispose or transform the wastes is a huge step in mitigating Climate Crisis- but we also need to eventually curb our use of fossil fuels.

https://scitechdaily.com/using-nanoparticles-to-convert-co2-into-valuable-resources/

Yup, one step at a time, solve the emissions problem first then we have all the time in the world to transition in a safe and prosperous way for everyone. 

That won't make the anti-capitalist/social justice warrior crowd to happy but nothing ever does. 

A new reconstruction of Arctic (NW Greenland) sea ice cover (Caron et al., 2019) reveals modern day sea ice is present multiple months longer than almost any time in the last 8000 years…and today’s summer sea surface temperatures are among the coldest of the Holocene. Yet another new study shows today’s Arctic sea ice cover is still quite extensive when compared to the last several thousand years, when CO2 concentrations ranged between 260 and 270 ppm. Regional (northwest Greenland) sea surface temperatures were about 2°C warmer than at present for most of the last 6000 to 8000 years.

Other new Arctic sea ice reconstructions from the north of Iceland (Harning et al., 2019) and Barents Sea (Berben et al., 2019) regions indicate a) modern sea ice extent has changed very little in the last several hundred years, or since the Little Ice Age, and b) the Early Holocene had millennial-scale periods of sea-ice-free and open water conditions, which is in stark contrast to “modern conditions” – the “highest value” or furthest extent of the sea ice record.

I love science.

 

315 billion-tonne iceberg breaks off Antarctica

Clean energy shares streak ahead of fossil fuel stocks

Sharp fall in wind and solar costs has made renewables cheaper than coal and gas

"Investors who bet on a shift from fossil fuels to clean energy are being richly rewarded as solar and wind stocks outperform oil and gas shares by a widening margin this year. The iShares Clean Energy exchange-traded fund has risen by 32 per cent so far this year, streaking far ahead of the oil-dominated Vanguard Energy ETF, which has risen by only 1 per cent.

In August, the renewables fund bettered the fossil fuel ETF by the biggest margin in five years. Renewable energy developers have been benefiting from a sharp reduction in the cost of wind and solar in recent years, which has made them cheaper than coal and natural gas at certain times in many markets.

The cost of solar has fallen 85 per cent since 2010, while wind power has dropped about 50 per cent, according to Bloomberg New Energy Finance.

Renewable stocks also outperformed oil and gas shares in 2017 and 2018, although both sectors ended last year down."

https://www.ft.com/content/2586fa10-e122-11e9-b112-9624ec9edc59?segmentid=acee4131-99c2-09d3-a635-873e61754ec6

8 hours ago, Wideleft said:

Clean energy shares streak ahead of fossil fuel stocks

Sharp fall in wind and solar costs has made renewables cheaper than coal and gas

"Investors who bet on a shift from fossil fuels to clean energy are being richly rewarded as solar and wind stocks outperform oil and gas shares by a widening margin this year. The iShares Clean Energy exchange-traded fund has risen by 32 per cent so far this year, streaking far ahead of the oil-dominated Vanguard Energy ETF, which has risen by only 1 per cent.

In August, the renewables fund bettered the fossil fuel ETF by the biggest margin in five years. Renewable energy developers have been benefiting from a sharp reduction in the cost of wind and solar in recent years, which has made them cheaper than coal and natural gas at certain times in many markets.

The cost of solar has fallen 85 per cent since 2010, while wind power has dropped about 50 per cent, according to Bloomberg New Energy Finance.

Renewable stocks also outperformed oil and gas shares in 2017 and 2018, although both sectors ended last year down."

https://www.ft.com/content/2586fa10-e122-11e9-b112-9624ec9edc59?segmentid=acee4131-99c2-09d3-a635-873e61754ec6

gap will continue to widen.

Thanks for the info.

This is what happens when you want to sell apocalyptic fairy tales.  You end up with crazy baby eaters coming to your press conferences.  Never go for the crazy people vote.  You end up in this kind of hellish nightmare.

14 hours ago, kelownabomberfan said:

This is what happens when you want to sell apocalyptic fairy tales.  You end up with crazy baby eaters coming to your press conferences.  Never go for the crazy people vote.  You end up in this kind of hellish nightmare.

As you probably know by now (but didn't delete your misleading post), the person was a plant for the LaRouche PAC, a far-right Trump supporting group.

Conservatives attacked Ocasio-Cortez over a bizarre town hall speaker. Now, a pro-Trump fringe group says it planned the stunt.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2019/10/04/conservatives-attacked-ocasio-cortez-over-bizarre-town-hall-speaker-now-pro-trump-fringe-group-says-they-planned-stunt/

You may want to reevaluate who the "crazy" people actually are.  And buy a mirror if you don't already own one.

Edited October 4, 20196 yr by Wideleft

Indeed, pro-Trumpers are crazy baby eaters. 

4 minutes ago, JCon said:

Indeed, pro-Trumpers are crazy baby eaters. 

LOL - that video was indeed hilarious.  We have to eat the babies!!  Oh man the look on that whack-job AOC's face was just priceless.

AOC sees lots of nut jobs daily having to deal with pro-Trumpers. 

16 minutes ago, Wideleft said:

As you probably know by now (but didn't delete your misleading post), the person was a plant for the LaRouche PAC, a far-right Trump supporting group.

Conservatives attacked Ocasio-Cortez over a bizarre town hall speaker. Now, a pro-Trump fringe group says it planned the stunt.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2019/10/04/conservatives-attacked-ocasio-cortez-over-bizarre-town-hall-speaker-now-pro-trump-fringe-group-says-they-planned-stunt/

You may want to reevaluate who the "crazy" people actually are.  And buy a mirror if you don't already own one.

I thought AOC handled that really well. SHe didn't shout her down, she let her rant, realized that something was odd about her behaviour and acted with compassion. 

I suspect she knew what was going on- especially after the eating babies comment, yet she still handled it with an amount of grace and compassion. 

AOC is awesome. She has a very bright future. 

 

I can only imagine if that was a trump rally or a conservative rally- no compassion, just straight to shouting down, threats of violence and mockery.

 

There is hope for the future with people like AOC. 

Somehow, some people can't be convinced that climate change isn't real because they won't believe it until their mother bursts into flame in the middle of a dried up Lake Winnipeg.  The thing is, it's happening and the evidence is everywhere.  Forget the 10 year warning, it's already happening.  Just because you don't believe you have seen or felt it, doesn't mean others haven't.

Also, if you think you're out of ideas on what to ask for for Christmas - ask for a digital subsciption to the Washington Post - it is an amazing newspaper. 

Radical warming in Siberia leaves millions on unstable ground

ON THE ZYRYANKA RIVER, Russia — Andrey Danilov eased his motorboat onto the gravel riverbank, where the bones of a woolly mammoth lay scattered on the beach. A putrid odor filled the air — the stench of ancient plants and animals decomposing after millennia entombed in a frozen purgatory.

“It smells like dead bodies,” Danilov said.

The skeletal remains were left behind by mammoth hunters hoping to strike it rich by pulling prehistoric ivory tusks from a vast underground layer of ice and frozen dirt called permafrost. It has been rapidly thawing as Siberia has warmed up faster than almost anywhere else on Earth. Scientists say the planet's warming must not exceed 1.5 degrees Celsius — but Siberia's temperatures have already spiked far beyond that.

A Washington Post analysis found that the region near the town of Zyryanka, in an enormous wedge of eastern Siberia called Yakutia, has warmed by more than 3 degrees Celsius since preindustrial times — roughly triple the global average.

The permafrost that once sustained farming — and upon which villages and cities are built — is in the midst of a great thaw, blanketing the region with swamps, lakes and odd bubbles of earth that render the land virtually useless.

“The warming got in the way of our good life,” said Alexander Fedorov, deputy director of the Melnikov Permafrost Institute in the regional capital of Yakutsk. “With every year, things are getting worse and worse.”

For the 5.4 million people who live in Russia’s permafrost zone, the new climate has disrupted their homes and their livelihoods. Rivers are rising and running faster, and entire neighborhoods are falling into them. Arable land for farming has plummeted by more than half, to just 120,000 acres in 2017.

In Yakutia, an area one-third the size of the United States, cattle and reindeer herding have plunged 20 percent as the animals increasingly battle to survive the warming climate’s destruction of pastureland.

Siberians who grew up learning to read nature’s subtlest signals are being driven to migrate by a climate they no longer understand.

This migration from the countryside to cities and towns — also driven by factors such as low investment and spotty Internet — represents one of the most significant and little-noticed movements to date of climate refugees. The city of Yakutsk has seen its population surge 20 percent to more than 300,000 in the past decade.

And then there’s that rotting smell.

As the permafrost thaws, animals and plants frozen for thousands of years begin to decompose and send a steady flow of carbon dioxide and other gases into the atmosphere — accelerating climate change.

“The permafrost is thawing so fast,” said Anna Liljedahl, an associate professor at the University of Alaska in Fairbanks. “We scientists can’t keep up anymore.”

Against this backdrop, a booming cottage industry in mammoth hunting has taken hold. The long-frozen mammoth tusks — combined with Chinese demand for ivory — have imbued teetering local economies with a strike-it-rich ethos. Some people bask in instant money. But others watch in dismay as Siberia’s way of life is washed away.

‘Nature is in control’

The first sign of change was the birds.

Over the past several decades, never-before-seen species started to show up in the Upper Kolyma District, an area on the Arctic Circle in northeastern Siberia 1,000 miles west of Nome, Alaska.

The new arrivals included the mallard duck and barn swallow, whose normal range was previously well to the south. A study published last year by Yakutsk scientist Roman Desyatkin said ornithologists in the region have identified 48 new bird species in the past half century, an increase of almost 20 percent in the known diversity of bird life.

Then the land started to change.

Winters, though still brutal, turned milder — and shorter. Fed by the more rapidly thawing permafrost, rivers started flooding more, leaving some communities inaccessible for months and washing others away, along with the ground beneath them.

The village of Nelemnoye was cut off for three months in late 2017 when the lakes and rivers didn’t fully freeze, stranding residents who use the frozen waters for transport. With the village in crisis, the government dispatched a helicopter to take residents grocery shopping.

(much much more if you can follow the link)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2019/national/climate-environment/climate-change-siberia/

Edited October 4, 20196 yr by Wideleft