gbill2004

Dude, you're reading way too much into that. Since you're a big shot with the Bombers, do you have inside info confirming Morley will be in training camp this year? I'd love to be wrong because I think Morley still has value, but I think my assumption based on Walters response is reasonable.

lol is Max the one on the left? Joking right? Uh ya. Thanks dude.

lol is Max the one on the left?

I was at the Bombers Fan Forum last night and here’s a quick summary of the highlights: Biggest thing I took away was when O’Shea was asked what the biggest thing he learned last year he said that he needs to trust his gut more and that last year he took too long to make some decisions. This was my biggest problem with O’Shea last year and it looks like he has learned. I suspect he was referring to staying loyal to Grigsby and Kuale too long when they were hurting the team. I asked Walters about Morley and whether he will be in training camp this year. Walters said he’s not going to talk about a players future in a public forum. That tells me Morley is gone. I also asked Walters about the linebackers. He agreed with me that we’re a little thin on experience this year and that the free agent camps will be relied upon to produce some starting linebackers this season. O’Shea said there will be an open competition at every position this year, except for QB; Drew Willy is the starter. Walters and O’Shea said they are putting a lot more emphasis on the running game this year, and while he didn’t want to give up too many details to the Riders (first game of the year) he suggested we’d have a thunder and lightning combo at RB this year. Said fans will pleased with the run game this year. Walters and O’Shea said they talk a lot about bringing a Grey Cup to the fans in Winnipeg. I asked O'Shea about the new rules and he said they definitely favour the offense, but he understand why as fans want to see more offense. Agreed that he wouldn't be surprised to see 55-45 scores in CFL games this year.

No I was giving an extreme example trying to demonstrate I'd love to be proven very, very, very wrong. I'd love to see Pavelec become a huge success. Sort of over the top, while being a little humerous. Guess you didn't get it. It's comical how you interpret some statements.

How's Max Hall doing these days?

I'd love to be proven wrong and the Jets ride Pavelec to the next 3 Stanley Cups!!

Some of these suggestions here are ridiculous. In a previous post I suggested that TNSE buyout Pavelec, then sign or trade for a "league average" gosltender for the next couple years until Hellebuyck is ready. Price and Rinne are elite goaltenders. All I'm asking for is league average.Why would we buyout Pavelec?You do know the compliance buyouts from the lockout are over? And while you can technically still buy a player out, you don't get the benefits of no cap hit. Teams just never buy players out, and there is a reason for that. If the Jets decide they don't want Pavelec anymore, he will be sent to the minors in the hopes that A) Someone would pick him up off waivers or Want to trade for him down the road when injuries hit. He only has two years left so it would be the more prudent thing to do. As for signing or trading for a better then "average" goalie, you do realize that by definition half the goalies out there are below average. So who is going to trade us an "above average" goalie, and what are you prepared to give up to get him? Especially when you've said yourself you just want a stop gap for a couple of years. As for free agents, here are a few of the higher profile goalie free agents this year, which do you want that you would consider "better then average" Antti Niemi (whose stats this year are close to but a little worse then Pavelec), Viktor Fasth, Josh Harding, Karri Ramo, Devan Dubnyk (Be shocked if Minnesota doesn't sign him before UFA starts), Niemi is probably the most interesting of those names (Dubnyk aside), but the Jets aren't going to be looking to spend a whole lot of money after either buying Pavelec out or paying for his salary in the minors, and they would also be competing with other teams on salary out there. And I wouldn't say Niemi is a slam dunk of a goalie either, Goalies are such a strange bunch. Dubnyk was a journeyman goalie after being mired in Edmonton before going to Nashville and Arizona. He was so highly thought of (definitely would have been considered below "league average" ) that his current contract is for 800k with Arizona before being traded to Minnesota where he had his magical resurgence in front of that Minny D. It is so easy to sit there and say Pavelec is below average and we should trade or sign better. In practice it is much harder, with goalies more so then any other position. Proven consistent goalies just aren't traded (unless you are dysfunctional like Vancouver, but they traded away their goalies already). UFA goalies are going to be hit and miss, you are likely going to be taking a chance on a below average goalie hoping he becomes something better under your team. Minnesota lucked out with that scenario because of injuries and being forced to having to trade for Dubnyk. Pavelec isn't going anywhere until the Jets know for sure they have something better then him. Otherwise you are just the Bombers who traded away Kevin Glenn because everyone hated him and were stuck with Lefors at QB. In reality, where NHL GMs have to do their jobs, it isn't as easy as a snap of the fingers to trade for or sign a proven "better then average goalie" - there is only about 15 of those and most teams aren't trading them, especially when you've admitted yourself you just want one as a stop gap until the younger kids come up. We aren't going to be giving up a whole lot of assets in that scenario. I fully understand compliance buyouts are over, but there are regular buyouts that come with certain advantages, especially for non cap teams. Here's how they work: http://m.thn.com/blog/five-things-you-need-to-know-about-nhl-buyouts/And like I said earlier, I'd buyout Pavelec, as the impact on a non-cap team is minimal. But I get it that TNSE won't do it. Guys I would have gone after in past free agency are guys like Hiller or Halak. Several other guys who have been available through FA or trade I would have gone after and would be an upgrade over Pavelec. I'm sure there are others available through trade. Anyways, I gotta stop visiting this thread as its taking up too much of my time! lol I think I've made my point, and whether you agree or disagree, that's cool as in the end, I think we all want what's best for our Jets! Pavs has a no move contract, you may want to factor that into your hatred for him.He does not have a no movement clause in his contract.

Agreed. Or at least slowly phase them in slowly over a few seasons. They change 3-4 rules every season, so if their plan is to completely change the game, then you can make the arguement they've been doing it slowly over a few seasons. I think the changes they make each year are reactionary and not part of an overall strategic plan.

Agreed. Or at least slowly phase them in slowly over a few seasons.

With inflation like ticket prices always going up, and TV deals likely to increase, having a fixed mortgage cost is a good thing. Paying down the stadium debt will become easier every year. A $4 million mortgage payment in 10 years will be the equivalent of $3 million. Bombers are in very good financial shape going forward.

So by your definition of benched, Price was benched against us and Elliott is benched tonight because not playing means benched.So Price hasn't played 10 games in a row?There's a difference between benched and giving your number one goalie a rest. Jacquie that's a really childish point you made there comparing Price's situation to Hutch. That wasn't my definition at all. C'mon man! I'm not the one being childish. And don't "c'mon man" me. Maurice didn't rotate goalies because they were both playing badly. And when he did go with Hutch it was because he was hot. A player not playing doesn't necessarily mean that the player is playing badly or that he was benched. You made the comparison between Price and Hutch's situation and it was terrible. C'mon man.

Good article on who's stock went up who's went down at the combine: http://m.cfl.ca/article/stock-assessment-dunk-analyzes-the-ol-and-dl

So by your definition of benched, Price was benched against us and Elliott is benched tonight because not playing means benched.So Price hasn't played 10 games in a row?There's a difference between benched and giving your number one goalie a rest. Jacquie that's a really childish point you made there comparing Price's situation to Hutch. That wasn't my definition at all. C'mon man!

Yeah they have been better, Halak played for Montreal and the Blues, while Hiller spent his career with the Ducks. You don't think that makes a difference?Talking save percentage. Not goals against average.So? Quality of shots against makes a difference... a goalie playing for Edmonton will naturally have a lower save percentage than one playing for Anaheim. Just common sense.That's not correct. Worse teams typically give up more shots on goal but the quality of shots is an incorrect assumption.lol based on what? Some online article from 2 years ago by a 19 year old stats student? You need to consider your sources. Shot quality makes a huge difference and there are several people doing research into it right now. It is ignored to some degree by the advanced stats crowd because they can't quantify it easily, but make no mistake, the difference is there.GAA is widely accepted as a team stat and save percentage is considered an individual goalie stat.And if you want to consider the eye test, well I can tell you over the past few years Pavelec typically lets in one soft goal per game and his technique and positioning is considered terrible. Eye test is irrelevant because you have no idea what you're talking about. "Widely accepted" doesn't fly with me. "Widely accepted" just means the majority believe what someone told them and repeat it like parrots. Read the downloadable PDF found here: http://hockeyanalytics.com/2012/02/defense-independent-goaltender-ratings/ You might learn something. That is interesting, but those stats are from 5-6 years ago, Pavelec only played 42 games that year.

Yeah they have been better, Halak played for Montreal and the Blues, while Hiller spent his career with the Ducks. You don't think that makes a difference?Talking save percentage. Not goals against average.So? Quality of shots against makes a difference... a goalie playing for Edmonton will naturally have a lower save percentage than one playing for Anaheim. Just common sense.That's not correct. Worse teams typically give up more shots on goal but the quality of shots is an incorrect assumption. lol based on what? Some online article from 2 years ago by a 19 year old stats student? You need to consider your sources. Shot quality makes a huge difference and there are several people doing research into it right now. It is ignored to some degree by the advanced stats crowd because they can't quantify it easily, but make no mistake, the difference is there.GAA is widely accepted as a team stat and save percentage is considered an individual goalie stat.And if you want to consider the eye test, well I can tell you over the past few years Pavelec typically lets in one soft goal per game and his technique and positioning is considered terrible.

Rotating goalies or the other goalie going on a hot streak doesn't mean a player was benched.Pavelec was benched for a good portion of the season. He even publicly admitted he was frustrated for not playing in like a month after that St Louis game where he let in that game winning goal softie from centre ice with a minute left in the game. He'd only had a few starts in the last couple months. Pavs has played 700 minutes more than Hutchinson this season. Maurice was rotating goalies regularly for a lot of the season. Hutchinson going on a hot streak doesn't mean Pavs was benched anymore than it means Hutchinson is now benched. I don't disagree at all with your last sentence. Hutch has clearly been benched recently. Just like Pavelec was earlier in the season.

Yeah they have been better, Halak played for Montreal and the Blues, while Hiller spent his career with the Ducks. You don't think that makes a difference?Talking save percentage. Not goals against average. So? Quality of shots against makes a difference... a goalie playing for Edmonton will naturally have a lower save percentage than one playing for Anaheim. Just common sense. That's not correct. Worse teams typically give up more shots on goal but the quality of shots is an incorrect assumption.

Yeah they have been better, Halak played for Montreal and the Blues, while Hiller spent his career with the Ducks. You don't think that makes a difference? Talking save percentage. Not goals against average.

Rotating goalies or the other goalie going on a hot streak doesn't mean a player was benched. Pavelec was benched for a good portion of the season. He even publicly admitted he was frustrated for not playing in like a month after that St Louis game where he let in that game winning goal softie from centre ice with a minute left in the game. He'd only had a few starts in the last couple months.

It surprises me how very few on here get it. A .915 vs .907 save % is an extra goal given up every 3rd game.So Paul Maurice is wrong and all you guys are right...alrighty then. We will leave it at that. You're probably right. I should have given up on this argument a long time ago. The guys in here just don't get it. And no logic or statistics will change that. I am no mathematician but wouldn't that depend on shots per game?Yes, I'm basing that extra goal Pavs gives up every 3rd game on an average of ~35 shots against per game. Could be plus or minus a bit. If you say 30 shots per game then it's roughly an extra goal every 3 games plus one period. I used those numbers to simplify my point, and they're based on my experience in watching hockey over the years.Edit: I just checked and for this year the highest team was the Blackhawks at 34.1 shots on goal per game. Buffalo was lowest at 24.1 shots per game.

Bombers just announced they'll be live streaming it tomorrow.

All I have to say is Pavelec's career = .907. League average is .915. That is all.

It surprises me how very few on here get it. A .915 vs .907 save % is an extra goal given up every 3rd game. So Paul Maurice is wrong and all you guys are right...alrighty then. We will leave it at that. You're probably right. I should have given up on this argument a long time ago. The guys in here just don't get it. And no logic or statistics will change that.

Huge upgrades LOL!!I'm fully aware of those numbers. Pavelec is a career .907 save %. His recent ~10 game hot streak has brought him up to league average for this season. It's much more accurate to look at a guys career vs an extremely small sample size. If Pavs can put together a .915 or better save % over 3 seasons, then I'm sold. But there's a reason Maurice benched Pavelec for half the season; he's not very good. But any coach would be stupid not to ride out a goalies hot streak.