Pretty historic.  Many people around here will shrug and wonder how this is still a debate in 2015.  Sadly, it is.  But the Supreme Court made the right decision.  What surprises me is how there are still highly intelligent public figures on the wrong side of history.

 

The vote was 5-4 down political lines (which disappoints me).

 

In a dissent, Justice Antonin Scalia blasted the Court's "threat to American democracy."

"The substance of today's decree is not of immense personal importance to me," he wrote. "But what really astounds is the hubris reflected in today's judicial Putsch."

 

"If you are among the many Americans—of whatever sexual orientation—who favor expanding same-sex marriage, by all means celebrate today's decision. Celebrate the achievement of a desired goal," he wrote. "Celebrate the opportunity for a new expression of commitment to a partner. Celebrate the availability of new benefits. But do not celebrate the Constitution. It had nothing to do with it.

 

 

I realise the job of the Supreme Court is not to make law but interpret law but how can they be so blatantly on the wrong side here.  Im a conservative and could never be so blinded by a political ideology as to vote against this.

 

With a US federal election looming, the candidates weighed in:

 

"In a country as diverse as ours, good people who have opposing views should be able to live side by side. It is now crucial that as a country we protect religious freedom and the right of conscience and also not discriminate," Bush said in his statement.

 

A very careful statement by Bush.  I like Jeb and I know its politics but have the courage to LEAD.  It gets far worse:

 

Conservative firebrands, including Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal and former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee, said that conservatives must stand and fight by seeking a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage.

 

"I will not acquiesce to an imperial court any more than our founders acquiesced to an imperial British monarch. We must resist and reject judicial tyranny, not retreat," Huckabee said in a statement.

 

On the flip side:

 

Former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton said she was "proud" of the ruling.

 

http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/26/politics/supreme-court-same-sex-marriage-ruling/index.html

 

 

A lot of stupid down in Kentucky.

 

How this woman wasnt simply fired is beyond me.

 

 

She can't be fired cause she's an elected official. I hope they put her in jail. I know the people complaining are only asking for monetary penalties to be applied but I don't see that working as there are likely like-minded people with deep pockets who will cover it.

 

 

 

People need to put their personal beliefs aside when acting in a professional capacity, a doctor can't refuse to discuss abortions because they don't agree with them, a public defender can't chose who they defend etc. If she can't do the job as outlined by law she should recuse herself

 

Surely there is recourse to fire her.  She must have a boss.  if she did a lousy job or didnt show up for work or called people names or slapped people, they wouldnt shrug.  Isnt her boss technically the Governor?

 

At worst, even if they have to keep paying her, suspend her and appoint an interim person to do the job.  Because if she is unimpeachable, what stops her from running again and again and again and doing this same song and dance every time?

 

The best part is, she will eventually comply.  Maybe she will have the balls to quit.  But I bet she wears down and complies proving that her "believes" arent as strong as she insists.  And I'll laugh at the goofiness of the whole thing.

A lot of stupid down in Kentucky.

How this woman wasnt simply fired is beyond me.

She can't be fired cause she's an elected official. I hope they put her in jail. I know the people complaining are only asking for monetary penalties to be applied but I don't see that working as there are likely like-minded people with deep pockets who will cover it.

People need to put their personal beliefs aside when acting in a professional capacity, a doctor can't refuse to discuss abortions because they don't agree with them, a public defender can't chose who they defend etc. If she can't do the job as outlined by law she should recuse herself

I'd be in support of a Dr. refusing to perform an abortion. Plenty of other Dr.'s who will perform it. Discussing it is fine, there's not nearly enough discussion allowed in this country on a number or topics.

 

Ridiculous. If your religion doesn't support gay marriage, then you don't have to participate in a gay marriage. It doesn't give you the write to impose that onto someone else.

Every person has the right to their own religion and beliefs (as long as they are legal and don't harm others) and you cannot trample on those rights.

'As long as they are legal and don't harm others' ? Problem is that some think disagreeing is doing harm. And that's wrong. I hear this all the time. People tolerate religion until religion disagrees with something. Freedom of religion is being eroded.

What about forcing a bakery to make a cake for a gay wedding? Seems like someone's beliefs are being imposed on others.

 

Thats a specific law though.  Im too busy to look up details but the side against the bakery cite the justification as a business not being able to refuse a customer on grounds like that.  If you walk into a bakery and ask them to make a cake that is 50 feet wide and 100 feet tall and they dont have the ability, they can refuse.  Ask them to make a cake that has the N word on it, they can refuse.  Ask them to make a cake they make every day and because the baker doesnt agree with your perfectly legal and widely acceptable lifestyle?  That's bigotry.

 

Personally, I'd just go somewhere else and then blast them on social media.  I wouldnt sue.

 

My gf's yoga instructor went to a book keeper for tax work.  he revealed he was gay.  She began praying for his soul.  People need to get a grip.

 

Religious freedom is great.  Lack of common sense sucks.  And religious freedom doesnt trump human rights.  You wouldnt agree that someone should enslave their wife because it's their religion, would you?  We have "honor killings" over religion.  Thats not freedom.

 

This dummy lives in the United States.  She is an elected official.  If she cant respect the constitution, she should quit.  And go live in Iraq or Saudi Arabia maybe.  She'd like it there Im sure.

 

 

A lot of stupid down in Kentucky.

How this woman wasnt simply fired is beyond me.

She can't be fired cause she's an elected official. I hope they put her in jail. I know the people complaining are only asking for monetary penalties to be applied but I don't see that working as there are likely like-minded people with deep pockets who will cover it.

People need to put their personal beliefs aside when acting in a professional capacity, a doctor can't refuse to discuss abortions because they don't agree with them, a public defender can't chose who they defend etc. If she can't do the job as outlined by law she should recuse herself

I'd be in support of a Dr. refusing to perform an abortion. Plenty of other Dr.'s who will perform it. Discussing it is fine, there's not nearly enough discussion allowed in this country on a number or topics.

 

Doctor's can refuse abortions. 

Yeah I said discuss it. I'm pretty sure they can't pretend it isnt an available option

 

Ridiculous. If your religion doesn't support gay marriage, then you don't have to participate in a gay marriage. It doesn't give you the write to impose that onto someone else.

Every person has the right to their own religion and beliefs (as long as they are legal and don't harm others) and you cannot trample on those rights.

'As long as they are legal and don't harm others' ? Problem is that some think disagreeing is doing harm. And that's wrong. I hear this all the time. People tolerate religion until religion disagrees with something. Freedom of religion is being eroded.

What about forcing a bakery to make a cake for a gay wedding? Seems like someone's beliefs are being imposed on others.

 

 

The person is acting in the offical capacity of the state, not baking cakes.  In that capacity, they need to adhere to the laws that are enacted by the elected offcials.  If doing that is offensive to them, find another job.  They can't arbitrarily make up the laws.  That isn't how democracy works.  

Religious rights do not trump human rights.  If this wingnut thinks her religious rights are more important than human rights then she should live somewhere with a lot less basic human rights and see if she still agrees.  Thats what irks me, the picking and choosing.  Picking and choosing which rights matter.  Picking and choosing which biblical versus to believe in.

 

Some would argue that the Bible passages used to support the idea that God is against gay couples dont actually say that at all.  And ofcourse, the things the Bible is against that people do all the time without protests or pastors waving bibles and condemning everyone to hell. 

 

This clerk is three times divorced.  She's going to hell anyway.  So whats her excuse?

 

Ridiculous. If your religion doesn't support gay marriage, then you don't have to participate in a gay marriage. It doesn't give you the write to impose that onto someone else.

Every person has the right to their own religion and beliefs (as long as they are legal and don't harm others) and you cannot trample on those rights.

'As long as they are legal and don't harm others' ? Problem is that some think disagreeing is doing harm. And that's wrong. I hear this all the time. People tolerate religion until religion disagrees with something. Freedom of religion is being eroded.

What about forcing a bakery to make a cake for a gay wedding? Seems like someone's beliefs are being imposed on others.

 

 

Freedom of religion isn't being eroded.

 

You have the right to worship freely without persecution

People disagreeing with your opinions is not persecution

People finding your views to be intolerant isn’t persecution

People wanting to exist and share the same rights as you is not persecution

 

The ability to discriminate isn't a religious right

 

A baker shouldn't be allowed to discriminate against others based on race, religion or sexual orientation or otherwise.

 

If a gay person wants a non-descript cake they should get it. If a gay person wants a cake that says "LBGT rights are important" someone who disagrees shouldn't have to make it.

 

If a Nazi wants a cake for his kid’s birthday, he shouldn't be denied it. If he wants a cake that says "death to Jews" on it, a baker should be able to refuse service

 

If someone from a different religion wants a cake they should get it. If someone wants a cake with a religious message, a baker shouldn’t be forced to make it.

Ridiculous. If your religion doesn't support gay marriage, then you don't have to participate in a gay marriage. It doesn't give you the write to impose that onto someone else.

Every person has the right to their own religion and beliefs (as long as they are legal and don't harm others) and you cannot trample on those rights.

'As long as they are legal and don't harm others' ? Problem is that some think disagreeing is doing harm. And that's wrong. I hear this all the time. People tolerate religion until religion disagrees with something. Freedom of religion is being eroded.

What about forcing a bakery to make a cake for a gay wedding? Seems like someone's beliefs are being imposed on others.

Thats a specific law though. Im too busy to look up details but the side against the bakery cite the justification as a business not being able to refuse a customer on grounds like that. If you walk into a bakery and ask them to make a cake that is 50 feet wide and 100 feet tall and they dont have the ability, they can refuse. Ask them to make a cake that has the N word on it, they can refuse. Ask them to make a cake they make every day and because the baker doesnt agree with your perfectly legal and widely acceptable lifestyle? That's bigotry.

Personally, I'd just go somewhere else and then blast them on social media. I wouldnt sue.

My gf's yoga instructor went to a book keeper for tax work. he revealed he was gay. She began praying for his soul. People need to get a grip.

Religious freedom is great. Lack of common sense sucks. And religious freedom doesnt trump human rights. You wouldnt agree that someone should enslave their wife because it's their religion, would you? We have "honor killings" over religion. Thats not freedom.

This dummy lives in the United States. She is an elected official. If she cant respect the constitution, she should quit. And go live in Iraq or Saudi Arabia maybe. She'd like it there Im sure.

I just try to not put myself in situations that are problematic with my religious beliefs. And this elected official has done just that.

I believe people should have the right to refuse service to whomever. (Not counting essential services like paramedics and such)

I pray for people's souls, what's wrong with that? Doesnt hurt anyone......and if there is a God (which I believe to be true) then it's doing good.

Yeah I said discuss it. I'm pretty sure they can't pretend it isnt an available option

Understable.

Ridiculous. If your religion doesn't support gay marriage, then you don't have to participate in a gay marriage. It doesn't give you the write to impose that onto someone else.

Every person has the right to their own religion and beliefs (as long as they are legal and don't harm others) and you cannot trample on those rights.

'As long as they are legal and don't harm others' ? Problem is that some think disagreeing is doing harm. And that's wrong. I hear this all the time. People tolerate religion until religion disagrees with something. Freedom of religion is being eroded.

What about forcing a bakery to make a cake for a gay wedding? Seems like someone's beliefs are being imposed on others.

Freedom of religion isn't being eroded.

You have the right to worship freely without persecution

People disagreeing with your opinions is not persecution

People finding your views to be intolerant isn’t persecution

People wanting to exist and share the same rights as you is not persecution

The ability to discriminate isn't a religious right

A baker shouldn't be allowed to discriminate against others based on race, religion or sexual orientation or otherwise.

If a gay person wants a non-descript cake they should get it. If a gay person wants a cake that says "LBGT rights are important" someone who disagrees shouldn't have to make it.

If a Nazi wants a cake for his kid’s birthday, he shouldn't be denied it. If he wants a cake that says "death to Jews" on it, a baker should be able to refuse service

If someone from a different religion wants a cake they should get it. If someone wants a cake with a religious message, a baker shouldn’t be forced to make it.

Plenty of bakeries would love the business I'm sure.

If someone wants to be intolerant and refuse sevice, be an adult and go somewhere else. Crying and whining are what children do. I'd refuse to serve a nazi or homicidal terrorist or murderer. Is that discrimination? Free country means we either have freedom or we don't. If the only thing that is hurt is feelings, then I don't call that persecution or discrimination. It's called being an dbag.

So while she is in jail, 5 of the 6 clerks have agreed to issue marriage licenses to same sex couples. The only one to refuse is the son of the woman.

So while she is in jail, 5 of the 6 clerks have agreed to issue marriage licenses to same sex couples. The only one to refuse is the son of the woman.

So they were scared to comply or they wre finally able to do what they knew was right? She was imposing her beliefs on her deputies?

What people do in their own homes is their business .Government has no business in the bedrooms of the nation.  I don't agree with same sex marriage or abortion but I don't believe my beliefs can be forced upon someone else. 

 

So while she is in jail, 5 of the 6 clerks have agreed to issue marriage licenses to same sex couples. The only one to refuse is the son of the woman.

So they were scared to comply or they wre finally able to do what they knew was right? She was imposing her beliefs on her deputies?

 

She broke the law so let her sit. Her underlings didn't want to join her.

What a **** show by these religious zealots in Kentucky & elsewhere. If the head clerk in that town can't give out marriage licenses to same sex couples  because of religious beliefs then quit & do something else. Where's HER boss in all of this? The Mayor of the town? Hiding in their offices cowering?

I believe people should have the right to refuse service to whomever. (Not counting essential services like paramedics and such)

I think issuing marriage licenses is a pretty essential service.

With the way health insurance runs down here, marriage can literally be a matter of life or death.

Also, this is pretty funny: https://twitter.com/nexttokimdavis?ref_src=twsrc^tfw

What a **** show by these religious zealots in Kentucky & elsewhere. If the head clerk in that town can't give out marriage licenses to same sex couples  because of religious beliefs then quit & do something else. Where's HER boss in all of this? The Mayor of the town? Hiding in their offices cowering?

 

She's an elected official. Other than a recall, the State Legislature would have to pass a bill to have her removed from office. Neither will happen because that's the way Kentucky is.

 

What a **** show by these religious zealots in Kentucky & elsewhere. If the head clerk in that town can't give out marriage licenses to same sex couples  because of religious beliefs then quit & do something else. Where's HER boss in all of this? The Mayor of the town? Hiding in their offices cowering?

 

She's an elected official. Other than a recall, the State Legislature would have to pass a bill to have her removed from office. Neither will happen because that's the way Kentucky is.

 

An elected official gives out marriage licenses? Something's wrong with that. 

 

 

What a **** show by these religious zealots in Kentucky & elsewhere. If the head clerk in that town can't give out marriage licenses to same sex couples  because of religious beliefs then quit & do something else. Where's HER boss in all of this? The Mayor of the town? Hiding in their offices cowering?

 

She's an elected official. Other than a recall, the State Legislature would have to pass a bill to have her removed from office. Neither will happen because that's the way Kentucky is.

 

An elected official gives out marriage licenses? Something's wrong with that. 

 

 

It's Kentucky.

 

Plus she was stopping paid staff from giving them out.

 

She's in jail for contempt of court and that is what she deserves. If she is against gay marriage, fine. But stopping her staff from performing their jobs as legally required is not fine, regardless of her convictions.

 

Those defending her don't understand either the laws or basic human rights.

So she was released with the caveat she must allow her deputies to continue issuing marriage licenses.  Her lawyer wants an amendment to the licenses to remove her name.  Why doesnt she just quit then?  Oh right, she will do anything for her beliefs...except quit her job.  lol

 

And here's a quote from Presidential Candidate Mike "Nutjob" Huckabee

 

Huckabee said he had a message for the judge who sent Davis to jail last week and ordered her release Tuesday.

"If you have to put someone in jail, I volunteer to go. Let me go. Lock me up if you think that's how freedom is best served," Huckabee said. "Because folks, I am willing to spend the next eight years in the White House leading in this country. But I want you to know I'm willing to spend the next eight years in jail, but I'm not willing to spend the next years in tyranny under people who think they can take our freedom and conscience away."

 

And this from Jefferey Toobin:

 

Davis' supporters have tried to compare her to Rosa Parks, the Alabama seamstress who refused to follow local segregation laws mandating that African-Americans had to give up their seats to whites on public buses. Right era, wrong person. The real analogy is to George Wallace, who stood in the doorway of the University of Alabama in defiance of federal court orders mandating an end to official segregation.

 

Like Wallace, Davis is a public official, and she has acted in defiance of modern interpretations of the Constitution. And like him, Davis, sooner rather than later, will be properly viewed as being on the wrong side of the law, of the public and of history.

Political posturing & grandstanding by Huckabee. He know he'll not go to jail so he talks big. I do not like politicians especially ones like him.

Hypocrites demanding the freedom to discriminate. And this guy wants to be President but ignore the constitution?

Kentucky clerk Kim Davis vows to defy court order, says no marriage licenses "will be authorized by me."

I bet politics wins out but isnt there a part of you that wants to see this clown tossed back in jail?