Old Bomber Fan

Not exactly sure we are 3rd in the West. I know many on this site do not like to recognize Sask but we should be aware of them nonetheless. I think the true picture will surface after both the labour day classic and Banjo bowl. Once that series is over, 3 games from now you will see where we are. Should we split with them and lose to Cal, which seems likely at our current performance level, then we should be looking at a crossover birth not second or third. I sure hope I am wrong but our performance against winning teams has been.....losing plain and simple.

Think bad defenses have followed Hall in recent years. He is unadaptable to various offenses and frankly in my opinion his theories are past history and not of the current CFL. With that said the defense cannot be on the filed for as long as they have been. The 2 and outs are far too frequent for our offense and that does not provide the defense an opportunity to regroup recharge and get after it when returning to the field. I think you can place the blame on both sides of the ball and that is not excusing the defense as I have always said the talent can change but the results will not as long as they play with Hall's schemes. We simply got outcoached by both coordinators and HC. Simple

Said this several years ago, LaPo is not a great coordinator. He cannot or at least doesn't seem to adjust as the game goes on and certainly not at half time. He has had the luxury of having Harris in the second half of most games and as was mentioned last night, they appear to be a front running team or at least one that can play when they are close at the half. If they are behind any amount his running game goes down the tubes and he doesn't have a QB who can throw like Harris and for that matte the QB doesn't have the game plan that Ottawa did. In a nutshell we got out coached in all phases of our game. Our defense was terrible and Fogg had probably the worst game of his career. Saylers (not sure how to spell it) did not play well either. The game plan was terrible. Our offense ditto the defense, not prepared and far to heavily weighted on Harris. Our HC, wrong personnel decision: Langford, get rid of him you have at least three others either on the PR or on the sideline that can play better than him. His kick off returns east west instead of north south. Flanders far superior to him in every regard regardless of position. Challenging a play in the first quarter just another dumb coaching move. Too early in the game. The reality is we are a talented team with mediocre stubborn coaching.

I agree with Tracker. I was looking back a Bowman when he was with the Bombers previously and he was let go because he couldn't catch consistently. I was wondering what happened to turn him into the great receiver he was with Edmonton. After some review it showed he was used a lot on crossing patterns and hooks etc. In Edmonton he was a vertical receiver seldom going across the middle. Then he comes back to Winnipeg and he is no longer a vertical player but a crossing receiver, similar to Dressler. He won't catch a lot of balls there simply because he does not want to be hit dead on so he is not concentrating as much on catching and is now worried more about who is coming and when he will be hit. I think a big difference. I also agree with his comment regarding LaPo offenses. He has always been this way and what was it 2 years ago he said he went south to learn from other coordinators and brought back a lot of that information to implement in his system. Not sure where it went because many D coordinators can game plan against him without worry of the deep ball....sort of makes their job a little easier. Yes Nichols had a bad game but the coaches had a worse one in my opinion. On the first goal line gamble I agreed at least if we didn't make it they would be deep in their zone. The other I thought were bad decisions. As for the 3rd and 4th quarters, well we did what we do time in and time out.....we take our foot off the pedal and coast, we go away from what was working to 2 and outs or INTs, our defense sits back and gives too big a cushion. It is hard to believe that it is the talent because the talent on defense especially in the back end has changed yet the results are the same. The soft pattern in the second half of the game is consistent with what has been going on with this team since MOS arrival. So like many here I agree and have stated before the coaching has to improve....use your players' strengths and minimize their weaknesses. Put your players in a position to succeed not fail. Coaching 101. The refereeing this game was very questionable in my mind. I guess I don't understand horse collar tackle anymore. I always thought is was when a player tackled another by the neck grabbing and using the shoulder pads to bring him down. Jeffcoat didn't grab the shoulder pads, he grabbed the back of the jersey up by the collar. I believe that happened a second time as well. As for the roughing the passer penalties, well I'm not sure how a player who is trying to get to the QB can hold up when the QB releases the ball a spit second before he arrives. Oh well let see what happens next game.

If you read then I would suggest you read again....I am not blaming Streveler for anything. What I said was I'm not sure he has the arm strength to throw the ball downfield. When he attempts it he is normally under throwing the receiver....review the games for proof. I like the guy and hope he can throw the long ball....he just hasn't shown it yet. On another note when someone posts something you oppose, which is their right to post and your right to oppose, perhaps it would be civil to respond in a less than demeaning manner? It only downgrades your character. Oh and by the way I do wear glasses and they are clean so I can see, but thanks for the tip.

I believe it has been said for over 3 years now that Hall's defense is outdated in the CFL. MOS said after last year that he was going to be more involved in the defense....is he and if he is what has changed? In my opinion nothing much. In two games against worthy opponents, we have been torched for over 480 yards in each. The other game, against Montreal, well I can't really count that one but will give credit that we stopped them to a respectable number. Point being made is we have been told we have a better group of DBs who have been brought in and those who remain have a year of experience under their belts. The results are the same; open receivers, too soft coverages, broken coverages, poor tackling, little pressure and the list goes on. Is it the talent or the system the talent is playing in? Seems to me if we have better talent and are still getting burned, it must be the system. So if it is the system why hasn't MOS changed it as he said he would? If it is the system why hasn't Hall recognized that after 3 years and corrected it. On another note, while the game was not great in the first half, we were nonetheless in the game. Hamilton made adjustments and I can only suggest we didn't because they clobbered us in the third quarter! This again is a very similar scenario from last year, no adjustments at half time and other teams making them that resulted then and now to disaster in the third quarter. Is it player ability, is it player mentality or is it coaching? I'll leave that answer up to you for judgement. On the offense, LaPo does not, will not or cannot stretch the field. His mentality is to throw short or at best medium routes and hope for YAC yards. This has not changed since he was here first as an OC many moons ago. He, as many have stated, overthinks things and that results to a stifling offense which is easily defended....see third and fourth quarter results. Most great coaches utilize the strengths of their individual players and minimize their weaknesses. I look at Adams and Bowman, two receivers who do not like going over the middle or crossing routes but are more adept at deep patterns. What are they being asked to do....run crossing patterns. They are not going to catch or for that matter make any great effort to catch a somewhat catchable ball....they do not want to get clocked! So utilizing the strengths of your players rates a failing grade for LaPo yet again. Then there is our rookie QB. While I like him and like him a lot, and after only 3 games, I think he has a fundamental flaw unless of course it is LaPo doing his thing again. I don't think he can throw a long ball. I don't think his mechanics will permit him to throw a 30 or 40 yard ball. Interestingly every time he has thrown long with success it has been the receiver either coming back to the ball or the defender falling down. What ever happened to throwing to a spot? Ever notice that our receivers are seldom in full stride catching a ball but rather are stationary? Just my observation. So I guess we now know where we stand with our rookie QB and new players. We frankly are no further ahead that where we were last year, not that the final standing from last year were anything to sneeze about. Expectations and the rhetoric was we were going to be so much better with the new talent etc and here we stand, 1-2 with a defense that continues to allow tons of yards and points and an offense that when needed fails to execute for whatever reason. Now I know there will be those who say it is only game 3 and you are right......but beware in the two games where we played quality teams we were beaten badly. And as someone else has said we won't win anything with a Hall defense. Hope I am wrong but it sure looks similar to last year.

I sure hope I am wrong but don’t believe he is the stud MLB that some believe he is. While he was just starting his career he was at the time anything but a run stopper. When he did make a tackle he jumped around like it was a miracle....says to me a showboat and more about him than the team. His or perhaps his agent has done. Othing to suggest that has changed. I just want a middle linebacker similar to Moe or Randy....make a tackle or a stop or an interception as if that is what you are paid to do....no big hoopla just doing the job. Don’t have this feeling with him but hope that if we do sign him he will prove me wrong....just saying

Not a big fan of this guy, he is more about himself than the team and what I saw of him in the bomber uniform I wasn't impressed, then again I'm not a player just a fan

First it isn't really a stupid comment....they have rebuilt is a short period of time, as has Edmonton with Mass and Ottawa in three years been to the cup twice, as has Hamilton after a dismal start finished strong, as has Toronto first in the east this year. While the eastern teams standings and records are below the Bombers it nonetheless shows you that teams can rebuild and must rebuild quickly in this league. Then again there are those who will continue to run into the dam hoping to bust it open and only get a sore head doing it. People on this forum have given MOS and the DC and the OC grace for the past 3 years saying they are getting better just look at their record. Are they really??? Record has improved, some good players are here, but the blunders in coaching remain. A defense that ranks near the bottom or at the bottom in most catagories except turnovers, and offense that for some reason abandons what is going well for them only to start a string of 2 and outs putting added pressure on the already beleaguered defense, and a HC that too often relies on gadget plays to make yards and hopefully a win. I personally believe you can go to the well only so often before it comes up dry...in this case he got away with what I would call a stupid gamble on our what 21 yard line and then tried a fake punt later on only to have that backfire and take the wind out of the sails of the entire team. It was very noticeable. The last second TD and 2 point convert, well what was that anyway......an attempt to make the score look better or what???? There remains significant issues with this team. While they have banded together well, let's see how well when free agency gets underway...how many will stay for another year if they feel they will be successful to win the grey cup...or will they bail for the money or a better chance at a cup. If they believe they have a great shot at the cup here in Winnipeg, then let them speak with their commitment. The team needs better back ups, better techniques, better coaching period. LaPo and I will give him credit made progress this year but continues this trend to abandon what is working for something else. He did scheme to throw the ball long as the season went on good for him. Still lots of room for improvement. Hall has to go period! MOS has got to grow up and make better game time decisions and stop being so stubbornly loyal to players who are not performing, plain and simple. And for Walters he has to reevaluate his personnel, there are major upgrades to backup players required. We will see next year but if I hear "oh we upgraded better than every other team this off season" without changing personnel a great deal, I will say what I said at the beginning of this year....look around other teams don't stand still as you might think....they too are looking to upgrade so ours had better be good. This year it wasn't!

So here we go 3 man rush and Calgary makes hay; no more Harris and lots of 2 and outs. Come on Hall and LaPo

Well here we are now, going downhill, what two wins in the last 5 games and everyone is in panic mode. Anyone on this site who believed the Bombers were a legit Grey Cup contender were not really looking at the team objectively. Yes we have lost some key players....so have many other teams. We are in rebuilding mode....for how many years now.....and so are other who have some magical touch to turn around a team in say 2 years or 1/2 a season or better yet like the expansion Redblacks who have been to 2 grey cups in the 3 years they have existed. So now the rose coloured glasses come off. Hopefully being objective all year doesn't bring out the comments about jumping off the bandwagon because that isn't necessary or true. I have been merely trying to point out from day one that this team is not as good as most here believed. The coaching isn't the best but I will say it appears they have a great locker room to hats off for that accomplishment. With that said there are bad decisions being made regarding personnel, schemes on both sides of the ball....and yes I know we have a high power offense when on can control the clock yet relies heavily on their kicker to gain points when they can't get in the end zone. The special teams I will say have done well most of the year and have in my opinion been the most consistent of the three phases. Other than that the writing was on the wall a long time ago and it is only becoming apparent now. I truly hope I am wrong and I'm sure many of you will certainly state I am but again the proof will be in the pudding. I hope we win and unless Calgary comes back tonight or rests their players next week we will not host a playoff game this year and will be out the first game we play....that is my prediction even though I hope I am wrong

I would suggest that the game plan was for Dressler and Harris to be the go to guys this game. I think Dressler was targeted at least 15 times whereas Denmark 3. I stand to be corrected on the exact number. What that says to me in my humble opinion is Denmark was a secondary or third receiver in this scheme. LaPo has done this in the past. If you recall the last time Dressler returned to service he was targeted the most yet again even with Adams in the receiving corps. Interesting that Denmark is tied for the lead for TDs on the team. I just get this feeling that Denmark and in this instance Givens were not the main focus of this game plan. It is somewhat sad because LaPo seems to loose sight of the fact that when all receivers are involved in the game the attack is much more balanced and effective. If you look at the past two games, the offense has struggled and in both it has been either Adams until he was hurt and then no one, or in this one Dressler. I have a great deal of difficulty believing that the other receivers are covered or not putting out. Maybe if they are not putting out as has been suggested it is because they are not involved in the game in a meaningful way. Yes I understand they have other duties to perform away from the ball but for an entire game??? I guess we will see what happens next game. Givens showed he could play, in my mind Denmark has shown he can play and Feilo G...., sorry can't spell his name, can catch as well. So why not use them???

Wasn’t suggesting dressier was washed up glad he was playing simply there were others on the field and it was all dressier no wonder the “secondary” players don’t or cannot step up

someone earlier said it is time for our secondary players to step up and I agree with that statement as long as they are given the chance to step up. Givens was thrown 3-4 balls tonight and did the best he could (I don't have the stats to verify but I believe it was around 3-4 balls) Denmark was thrown to 3 times, he caught 2. Perhaps it might be better said that when someone is returning from injury LaPo doesn't target that person what 15 times? Dressler was thrown to on 3 consecutive plays. I find that hard to believe he was the only one in the open. It is a LaPo tradition or tendency to do this whenever someone returns. I think the secondary players can and will step up if given the chance but at least give them the chance.

Well I think I rest my case on my point ref LaPo and playing to Dressler and Harris and for the most part forgetting about the others. I think I recall Denmark being targeted 3 times making two catches one for little if any gain. Givens late in the game got a few and one Canadian, sorry can't spell his name had a few also but the bulk of interest was Dressler and Harris. I certainly don't mind going to them but I think in order for the defense not to key on them you have to spread the ball around and that didn't seem to be the game plan. Medlock missed the last field goal, something he was a given about 3 games ago and I don't really think that lost the game. However if you consider 2 missed field goals and this team and OC dependent on him so much well then I think that is what sunk the ship along with Fogg not doing well all night. Just my thoughts

I started reading this thread about receivers and LaPo's tendency not to throw deep. That is something he has always done and has been written about in several previous threads. Interesting though is the fact that many here are looking for additional good receivers. While I agree we could certainly use some quality receivers , especially to replace Lankford, I noticed that Denmark's name has not been mentioned. I for one believe he is the one receiver that Nichols can rely on game in game out but is seldom thrown to. Last game I think he was thrown to on 3 occasions 2 of those were either behind him or in the ground. The one catchable ball he caught as he has always done. My point is while we need to replace Adams and there is some discussion about the 2 Canadians, Denmark remains probably the most reliable receiver we have yet he gets little or no respect and seldom sees the ball. With Dressler and Denmark in the receiving corps, Givens coming in with his credentials and one of the Canadians, not to mention Harris then I think we should be alright as long as LaPo designs plays to take advantage of ALL the receivers not just a returning Dressler which has been his perchance with players returning from injury. We will see. And not being a Sask fan, keep looking over the shoulder. While we have secured a playoff spot I would be very leery of them as they are building steam and confidence. I think you will see Edmonton cross over and we will be playing Sask. Wherever that game is played we had better come out of the gates roaring because if we don't we might be mightily disappointed. Just saying for future. .

guy who has been and will continue to be a bomber fan since 1953!!! Half of you I would suggest weren't even born then or a twinkle in your mom's eyes! I guess there is a new definition to a true fan, don't criticize, don't question, just shut up go with the flow and live the dream. Sorry haven't been that person all my life and never will. Still a Bomber fan much to your chagrin.

I guess in order to be a "true Bomber fan" on this forum one needs to have season tickets to the game. Not sure that is valid. Yes I lived 4km from IGF however when almost all of the games were played I was a 1 1/2 hour drive away. Couple that with having to take a shuttle from St Norbert and the product and management that was presented to the fans, why would I waste 3 hours of travel not to mention another 20 mins each way to and from the game even when it was a blow out, which was often, and not be able to leave at a respectful hour in order to get back to the lake! Did the money play a part, partially but it wasn't the driving force that led me to give up my season tickets. And for what is worth, you are right I will always be THAT

nah I'm not afraid of breaking a hip....never was off the bandwagon just much more objective than you are. In this instance pleasantly surprised at the outcome to date. Hopefully it will continue. And why is it that you have to continually throw insults every time someone disagrees with you or doesn't do things the way you think they should. Just wondering....makes me think of the spoiled kids in school who would take their ball home with them when they couldn't be the star. Too bad

congrats to the Big Blue, they truly put on a show in terrible conditions last night. To me what they showed was a determination that frankly I haven't seen in some time although with that said they seem to be a determine bunch this year. I thought the defense played well however I will caution that by saying Ottawa's QB was not stellar by any means....many missed receivers, poor passing etc but notwithstanding they did hold them to 266 yards, their best effort to date. I liked the special team coverages and the offense save for one sequence where we put in our run QB to get a first down and then tried a hurry up offense with him on the field and throwing a long pass. My question was why have him try that in light of the weather and the cold....he has to warm up in those conditions and it showed. Other than that I thought they did a good job. So here we are in second place and doing well. I will retract some statements from earlier in the season where I questioned MOS and LaPo.... I still do on occasion but not as much as before. This team has a legitimate chance to host a play off game however to advance they will need to shore up the defense. If they do this who know what will happen. I will simply say it is nice to watch entertaining football once again but keep asking myself why is it I am on pins and needles with 8 mins to go in the 4th quarter when we have such a lead as last night? Congrats again.

I am one who doesn't particularly like LaPo as an OC. With that said however I have seen an evolution of sorts this year. Particularly last game we did throw the ball downfield more than all year which suggests to me that he is trying to stretch the field so his 3 - 4 yard passes have a little more room for success. So I am not terribly unhappy with him to date. On another note he was the OC here after Rick Worman developed an offense that I believe was #1 in the league. I believe it was the first year of Charlie Roberts. Worman was fired the following year because Roberts didn't want to play in his system hence LaPo got his first crack at OC in Winnipeg. His offense, which was actually Worman's was awesome however in the next two years dropped off considerably and he was fired. He came back as HC some years later and has been suggested here had some issues with QBs but was not the OC...that was another person's responsibility. However he still called the shots and was tentative and as also been stated tried to win while trying not to lose. He to this day still shows some of those tendencies and when they get up by a TD or 2 they are on full display instead of putting the foot on the throat of the opposition. Is our offense good enough to win this year...I think they are close.....is our defense....no where close and that has been the case for the past 3 years or more and can be attributed to Hall's scheming.

Hopefully the Bombers don't take their next 3 opponents as lightly as what seems to be the case here. Ottawa has their game back....yes they lost their starting QB but the guy who replaced him was as starter for Calgary I believe before they decided to go with Mitchel. Their D is not as bad as ours so that suggests it could be much closer than what everyone is saying. As for Edmonton well that will be tough. They are beatable but again our D will be the issue. As for Hamilton, well that might be the one that is more of a given than any other. BUT they too have won 2 in a row. Confidence is a big thing is sports so let's not take anything for granted. The offense is playing well, the best I've seen them play on a consistent basis for years....the special teams are playing well....but the defense well if there is a silver lining one could say out of the 476 yards against last game, some 167 of them were on two plays. That is the scary part as well as they had 3 big plays I can think of off the top of my head and that continues to be a big concern. So let's give them a chance to regroup and refocus and see what happens. Hopefully as some have said here three would be nice but take two and run.

So what you are saying is let him lie in the middle of the play and have players trample over him? Not sure that is protecting the player and I'm sure the CFLPA would have something to say about that. In fact maybe they are the ones who should be spearheading an initiative to stop this stuff. In any event it does have to stop I agree how and by whom, well that is another story at this point.

I couldn't agree more with your comments. I simply said in this game we were done after the first quarter. It is hard enough to come back from a 1 score deficit... it is another to come back from a 3 score deficit. I am fully aware of the quality of their players and how they are being prepared for a game scheme wise and emotionally. As I have said before we tend on this site to look at the Bombers as invincible and the only team in the league that makes improvements in the off season whereas all teams are striving for the same thing. Only difference in my humble opinion is other teams seem to be able to climb the mountain much quicker than we do. There have been many rationalizations as to why this is but in my opinion, again humble and to some ignorant, our head office and coaching staff don't seem to recognize quality players when they are presented with them. They are getting better but I think I only have to refer to Denmark to make that point. Thank goodness they brought him back. As for Langford and Adams well I'll take a pass on them both and would rather have had Carter or Muamba or Woods to name a few instead of who we have now. But I will give them credit whomever we talk about...they all play for 60 mins....only problem is they don't seem prepared to play to start the game and that has been going on for over a year now. So who is to blame for bad starts????? anyone's guess I guess...only know when I was coaching I tried to make sure everyone was focused on one objective prior to the whistle....performance and your responsibilities the rest will look after itself

Actually say what you want but it was not ILLEGAL...morally and ethically wrong yes but not illegal. So he used a "loophole" and exploited it. Again like it or not he was trying to find an edge and he obviously found one which we could not counter in any way. But really did it play a real outcome in the game....I think not. We were done after the first quarter. We garnered a lot of yards and managed to get back to what I TD down but in reality and hopefully this can be accepted by the fans on this site, the game was lost....oh yeah I get it ain't over til the fat lady signs but come on, really? Hopefully we will learn for this Saturday...Hopefully the CFL will learn and institute some harsher penalties like has been mentioned already....say out for 6 plays if injured on the field or perhaps a flag for diving similar to the NHL that can be applied once it is determined that the player was in fact faking. Hopefully Jones will learn that it is a detriment to the CFL for that kind of tactic. Bottom line though is we got beat....in the first quarter and in fact we only won 1 quarter the third where we scored 3 points to their 0 so I think it is sour grapes to focus in on this as the reason we lost. Hopefully we will be prepared to play 60 mins of football in all three phases of the game from start to finish and let's hope the coaches will develop a game plan that suggests they know what they are doing and know how to prepare their team to play.