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On ‎4‎/‎10‎/‎2017 at 8:07 AM, JCon said:

Yeah, United is pretty crappy company and Air Canada can be too.

 

In December, my wife and oldest son (7), were flying Ottawa - Toronto - Winnipeg. The flight out of Ottawa was delayed but still in time to make the Toronto connection. Air Canada gave away their seats to standby customers over an hour before the second flight was scheduled to depart. AC explained that the itineraries were not connected (Ottawa to Toronto and Toronto to Winnipeg were separate), even though they were booked as a continuous flight.

The kicker, was that they were using the same plane, so there was no way that the flight from Toronto to Winnipeg could leave without the first flight arriving.

Then, AC said they would have to wait on standby themselves to see if anything would open. When two seats did open, they were going to seat them at separate ends of the airplane. My seven year-old son was understandably upset.

These airline companies don't care about their customers. Hope that passenger nails United with a multi million dollar lawsuit & wins. Teach these airlines a message.

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The City of Winnipeg has lost the legal battle against the Manitoba Homebuilder's Association regarding Growth Fees. City now required to refund over $30m in fees to homebuilders in emerging areas col

We're finally moving in that direction too.  https://atlantic.ctvnews.ca/nova-scotia-organ-donation-presumed-consent-law-takes-effect-1.5271098?cache=ngyhfzxv%3FcontactForm%3Dtrue%3FclipId%3D1040

13 minutes ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

These airline companies don't care about their customers. Hope that passenger nails United with a multi million dollar lawsuit & wins. Teach these airlines a message.

This was even worse than "over booking".  With over booking United would have a bit of a case but the visual would still be bad.  In this case they were removing a passenger who had paid and was in his assigned seat for four employees without seats.  This doctor is going to get a very  nice retirement package.

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11 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said:

This was even worse than "over booking".  With over booking United would have a bit of a case but the visual would still be bad.  In this case they were removing a passenger who had paid and was in his assigned seat for four employees without seats.  This doctor is going to get a very  nice retirement package.

It'll cost the CEO his job as he was so busy backtracking like a guy slipping on ice not going anywhere.

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27 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said:

Yup. His internal memo calling the passenger belligerent is going to haunt him.  When your stock loses over $1billion how do you keep your job?

I read it gained about 2/3 back & is actually higher than it was than a year ago. The thing is, if people are upset with United but can get a deal on tickets will they still remain angry or will money talk & they fly that airline again? I think United is counting on the fact that savings will usurp anger.

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15 minutes ago, Throw Long Bannatyne said:

Isn't it more likely that the security officers were employees of the airport rather than the airline?  I've never heard of an airline having their own security personnel other than the undercover flight monitors.

They were with the Chicago Department of Aviation police.

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6 minutes ago, Jacquie said:

They were with the Chicago Department of Aviation police.

So how is the airline liable for the action of these individuals?  Sure, they called for security but did not dictate the methods used to remove the passenger from the plane.  What is missing from this footage is the time the airline spent negotiating with Mr. Dao to leave the airplane in a reasonable manner.  How did they select Dao as the passenger that needed to be removed?

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12 minutes ago, Jacquie said:

They claim it was a random draw. 

That would be a poor way to determine who needed to be removed.  If the plane was over-booked they should have gone back to a time-line to determine which passengers were the last to book.  I assumed that Mr. Dao was on stand-by and was allowed on the plane before the booked seat holder had arrived.  Details of the scenario seem to be lacking, which makes his removal look like a random act.

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1 hour ago, Throw Long Bannatyne said:

That would be a poor way to determine who needed to be removed.  If the plane was over-booked they should have gone back to a time-line to determine which passengers were the last to book.  I assumed that Mr. Dao was on stand-by and was allowed on the plane before the booked seat holder had arrived.  Details of the scenario seem to be lacking, which makes his removal look like a random act.

People had to be bumped to allow for a flight crew to get to the destination city.  

If the flight crew wasn't on that plane then rather then inconvenience the few people, a whole plane of people would be delayed. 

It seems normal protocol in these situations is to offer money in increasing intervals until someone agrees to take it and wait for the next flight. 

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On 4/14/2017 at 1:54 PM, Throw Long Bannatyne said:

So how is the airline liable for the action of these individuals?  Sure, they called for security but did not dictate the methods used to remove the passenger from the plane.  What is missing from this footage is the time the airline spent negotiating with Mr. Dao to leave the airplane in a reasonable manner.  How did they select Dao as the passenger that needed to be removed?

That's the one thing that I've been wondering and haven't got an answer for.... I've read articles blaming United and articles blaming Dr Dao, both side of the argument have their merit... but no one has explained why it had to be THIS seat... If he is absolutely refusing to leave why can't they just say "is anyone on the plane willing to give up their seat for the voucher".... I find it hard to believe they wouldn't have found ONE volunteer... 

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It's not random even though that's what they claimed. They have a list of things they consider first. Like how inconvenienced someone would be. Whether they are in a group travelling etc. Unaccompanied minors. 

So after eliminating all their other considerations they chose four people. Three left. This guy didn't. 

Also as far as inconveniencing an entire flight if this crew weren't able to board, I don't buy it. If there was a flight in another city leaving soon why was their flight crew in Chicago?  Plus because of this the flight was delayed as long as it would have taken for that crew to rent a car and drive. 

I think it was arrogance that the employees should get dibs.  

Keep in mind United also broke federal policy in that they did not provide the passengers with a written explanation of their rights and how much compensation they were entitled too. 

They stopped the money offer at $800. But by federal law those passengers affected were entitled to up to $1300.  Other passengers had offered to leave for $1600 and were allegedly laughed at. Knowing you are legally committed to paying up to $1300 why would you laugh off $1600?  Because United was trying to pay less than they were legally obligated to. 

United completely to blame. 

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On 4/14/2017 at 1:54 PM, Throw Long Bannatyne said:

So how is the airline liable for the action of these individuals?  Sure, they called for security but did not dictate the methods used to remove the passenger from the plane.  What is missing from this footage is the time the airline spent negotiating with Mr. Dao to leave the airplane in a reasonable manner.  How did they select Dao as the passenger that needed to be removed?

http://globalnews.ca/news/3373761/video-captures-the-argument-moments-before-david-dao-dragged-off-united-airlines-flight/?utm_source=GlobalWinnipeg&utm_medium=Facebook

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On 4/14/2017 at 1:54 PM, Throw Long Bannatyne said:

So how is the airline liable for the action of these individuals?  Sure, they called for security but did not dictate the methods used to remove the passenger from the plane.  What is missing from this footage is the time the airline spent negotiating with Mr. Dao to leave the airplane in a reasonable manner.  How did they select Dao as the passenger that needed to be removed?

They were acting under the direction of the airline.  Certainly the police are likely to be sued as well.  But United is the bigger fish.  The police really acted inappropriately as well and that is shown by the fact two of them were suspended.

I asked that question early on...why does a gate agent have the authority to direct the actions of the police?  Really they don't but its a matter of usual protocol probably.  Agent says they have exercised their right to remove an "unruly" passenger and at that point, the police see him as breaking the law.

One can make the argument that the passenger was wrong as soon as he refused the order to leave.  But thats a "wrong" stemming from several wrongs committed by the airline.  

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this is interesting for those who can't get past the paywall between 2008 and 2016 there were 92 cases of preferential treatment. Of those 59 were jets or Bombers. 

Obviously a pro sports team isn't waiting a year for an MRI. Health minister is asking other jurisdictions how they handle athletes. 

I don't know what an MRI machine costs but how about the Jets and bombers buy a machine and gift it to the province in exchange for access as needed. 

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