The Environment Thread

[blue_gold_84]

2 hours ago, Tracker said:

Superbowl weekend. Bread and circuses. Enough said.

The derailment itself occurred on the 3rd and the controlled explosion on the 6th. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Ohio_train_derailment)

I agree with the bread and circuses part but this was nearly a week prior to the Super Bowl.

I'd argue this has more to do with a shady, corrupt rail company having too much influence while only caring about its profits. NS is notorious for having outdated safety practices as it relates to movement of hazardous materials on its rail network.

Edited February 13 by blue_gold_84
link with timeline added

[Mark F]

25 minutes ago, blue_gold_84 said:

I'd argue this has more to do with a shady, corrupt rail company having too much influence while only caring about its profits.

"The vast majority of the nation’s trains continue to rely on a braking system first developed in 1868. Trains equipped with these traditional air brakes make emergency stops more slowly and with higher rates of damage than trains equipped with ECP brakes, according to both safety advocates and the Federal Railroad Administration.

While air brakes stop train cars individually, as air pressure moves sequentially from one car to the next, ECP brakes operate using an electronic signal and can stop an entire train much faster."

successfully lobbied against requiring this.

https://www.levernews.com/rail-companies-blocked-safety-rules-before-ohio-derailment/

destruction of a town? who cares.

most of today's company executives would rather go have the company  of business, than be a good corporate citizen, and take smaller bonuses.

 wait till the oil corps can't service their debts, other obligations. holy cow.

 

Edited February 13 by Mark F

[FrostyWinnipeg]

A suburb in Arizona lost its source of water. Residents warn: We're only the beginning.

[Fatty Liver]

8 hours ago, FrostyWinnipeg said:

A suburb in Arizona lost its source of water. Residents warn: We're only the beginning.

The implications described in this article should be frightening for all, they've been ignoring science and common-sense for well over 50 years, allowing the population in a desert region to swell to unsustainable levels and encouraging a city like Las-Vegas to grow without limitations.  All for the sake of making as much money as possible from irresponsible water and land management, governments have done next to nothing to prevent this predictable catastrophe from happening. 

 

[Tracker]

9 hours ago, Fatty Liver said:

The implications described in this article should be frightening for all, they've been ignoring science and common-sense for well over 50 years, allowing the population in a desert region to swell to unsustainable levels and encouraging a city like Las-Vegas to grow without limitations.  All for the sake of making as much money as possible from irresponsible water and land management, governments have done next to nothing to prevent this predictable catastrophe from happening. 

 

But that would cost money and mean higher (gasp) taxes. 

[JCon]

Just now, Tracker said:

But that would cost money and mean higher (gasp) taxes. 

We know taxes are evil because they take money from the rich to provide services to the poor and other untouchable classes. 

[Wideleft]

2 minutes ago, Tracker said:

But that would cost money and mean higher (gasp) taxes. 

I'm not sure this is a problem that can be solved either by taxation or spending.  This is an issue of people building where they shouldn't because there is no access to vital resources (water).

Civilizations have been leaving desertified environments for centuries.  These people need to take the "L" and move on.  Libertarians are going to need to learn that they just can't do whatever they want, where they want.

[Tracker]

19 minutes ago, Wideleft said:

I'm not sure this is a problem that can be solved either by taxation or spending.  This is an issue of people building where they shouldn't because there is no access to vital resources (water).

Civilizations have been leaving desertified environments for centuries.  These people need to take the "L" and move on.  Libertarians are going to need to learn that they just can't do whatever they want, where they want.

The arid areas of Australia, due to the prolonged droughts they have suffered, embarked on a somewhat expensive program of forcing "grey water" from their cities and towns into their aquifers. As a result, the aquifers water levels have been rising. But that's environmental socialism. Abhorrent to Americans and many Canadians.

[Fatty Liver]

4 hours ago, Wideleft said:

I'm not sure this is a problem that can be solved either by taxation or spending.  This is an issue of people building where they shouldn't because there is no access to vital resources (water).

Civilizations have been leaving desertified environments for centuries.  These people need to take the "L" and move on.  Libertarians are going to need to learn that they just can't do whatever they want, where they want.

The funny thing is the US stole this desert region from Mexico because it was basically under-populated.

The chickens are now coming home to roost, and I don't think there is a viable solution in sight other than a drastic depopulation of the South-West, which would add stress to many other parts of the country. Realistically what could also happen at some point with unstable US government as it is, once Republicans are back in charge they just take what they need from whomever under the "America First" banner, and keep on consuming.  That means we negotiate to their terms to supply them with water....until that also runs out.

[blue_gold_84]

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/02/27/speculative-tech-to-reflect-sun-away-from-earth-needs-focus-un.html

Quote

Global efforts to respond to climate change are so far insufficient, making it time to begin studying technologies to reflect sunlight away from the Earth to cool it down temporarily, said a new report from the United Nations published on Monday.

Reducing greenhouse gas emissions is the only way to permanently slow global warming, but worldwide efforts to reduce greenhouse gas emissions are currently “not on track to meet the 1.5° Celsius Paris Agreement goal,” the U.N. Environment Program said in a written statement accompanying the release of the report.

With the world not responding to climate change urgently enough, a “speculative group of technologies” to reflect sunlight back away from the Earth have been getting more attention recently, UNEP said in a written statement accompanying the report. This category of technologies is often called solar radiation modification (SRM) or more broadly solar geoengineering.

The report on these technologies, written by an expert panel brought together by the U.N. program, advised that it’s currently not a good idea to use them in an effort to respond to climate change.

[Wideleft]

10 minutes ago, blue_gold_84 said:

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/02/27/speculative-tech-to-reflect-sun-away-from-earth-needs-focus-un.html

Read an article about the potential political pitfalls of this idea just yesterday:

It sounds like something out of science fiction: A country suffering from heat, flooding or crop failures decides on its own to send out a fleet of aircraft to spray a fine, sun-blocking mist into the earth’s atmosphere, reducing temperatures and providing relief to parched populations. Other countries view it as a threat to their own citizens and ready a military response.

But members of the U.S. intelligence community and other national security officials were worried enough last year to plot how to avert a war triggered by this kind of climate engineering. In a role-playing exercise, they practiced managing the tensions that would be unleashed, according to people familiar with the exercise, a sign that they see it as a credible threat in need of a strategy.

The practice, known as solar geoengineering, is theoretically possible. And as the world’s most vulnerable populations suffer more sharply from rising temperatures, global decision-makers will likely come under heavy pressure to deploy the technology, scientists and policymakers say. Compared to other methods to combat the effects of climate change, it’s likely to be cheaper and faster.

Because the technique could weaken the sun’s power across the globe — not just above whichever country decided to deploy it — security officials are concerned about the potential to spark conflict, since a single capital could make decisions that shape the entire world’s fate.

“Parts of the U.S. government are rightfully focused on trying better to understand this,” said Sherri Goodman, a senior fellow at the Wilson Center, referencing last year’s geoengineering exercise. “If you don’t understand it, you can’t manage it.”

The science is evolving, said Goodman, a longtime expert on the intersection of climate change and security. But global discussions haven’t kept up, leaving a powerful technology largely unregulated internationally.

“It could be weaponized by a country to either try to improve the climate and reduce the temperatures in their own location or against an adversary,” Goodman said. “It could be threatened in a way that could cause fear or panic among populations.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2023/02/27/geoengineering-security-war/

[TrueBlue4ever]

Why is it that the most ridiculous Simpsons jokes become the ones that actually come true?
 

[Tracker]

5 hours ago, blue_gold_84 said:

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/02/27/speculative-tech-to-reflect-sun-away-from-earth-needs-focus-un.html

Apparently there are people out there who have not heard of unintended consequences. We humans are nowhere as clever as we think we are.

[WildPath]

9 hours ago, Wideleft said:

Read an article about the potential political pitfalls of this idea just yesterday:

It sounds like something out of science fiction: A country suffering from heat, flooding or crop failures decides on its own to send out a fleet of aircraft to spray a fine, sun-blocking mist into the earth’s atmosphere, reducing temperatures and providing relief to parched populations. Other countries view it as a threat to their own citizens and ready a military response.

But members of the U.S. intelligence community and other national security officials were worried enough last year to plot how to avert a war triggered by this kind of climate engineering. In a role-playing exercise, they practiced managing the tensions that would be unleashed, according to people familiar with the exercise, a sign that they see it as a credible threat in need of a strategy.

The practice, known as solar geoengineering, is theoretically possible. And as the world’s most vulnerable populations suffer more sharply from rising temperatures, global decision-makers will likely come under heavy pressure to deploy the technology, scientists and policymakers say. Compared to other methods to combat the effects of climate change, it’s likely to be cheaper and faster.

Because the technique could weaken the sun’s power across the globe — not just above whichever country decided to deploy it — security officials are concerned about the potential to spark conflict, since a single capital could make decisions that shape the entire world’s fate.

“Parts of the U.S. government are rightfully focused on trying better to understand this,” said Sherri Goodman, a senior fellow at the Wilson Center, referencing last year’s geoengineering exercise. “If you don’t understand it, you can’t manage it.”

The science is evolving, said Goodman, a longtime expert on the intersection of climate change and security. But global discussions haven’t kept up, leaving a powerful technology largely unregulated internationally.

“It could be weaponized by a country to either try to improve the climate and reduce the temperatures in their own location or against an adversary,” Goodman said. “It could be threatened in a way that could cause fear or panic among populations.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2023/02/27/geoengineering-security-war/

This is represented in Kim Stanley Robinson's excellent 'The Ministry of the Future'. A great sci-fi read that is very much grounded in science and what the near future could look like.

[FrostyWinnipeg]

https://www.ctvnews.ca/climate-and-environment/eco-friendly-glass-exists-but-it-s-complex-to-make-researchers-say-1.6319036

[Wideleft]