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Black Lives Matter


Rich

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Well my point was that while the nurse made a great point, the situations aren't exactly the same.

However to your point, I'm in favour of seeing more money spent on mental health services, even if it means decreasing the police budget. I think there are cases where the social worker/health expert would be better than a police officer. In other cases, you need the police officer. So I'm not in favour of eliminating the police force, which some who are calling for defunding seem to be doing, but I am in favour of reallocating some of that money/changing how we do things (which depending on who you read might mean I am in favour of defunding. Still educating myself on that one).

Edited by rebusrankin
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46 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said:

Im no expert on the history of law enforcement but certainly the police have exploded beyond their intended purpose.  Even when you look at the movement to decriminalize some drug possession.  You have police working highways, pulling over a car for whatever infraction, find weed and now its a felony.  Is that really the intended purpose of policing? .... Its not remotely about safety, its about revenue.  A cop needs a high school diploma, starts at $50,000+ and hits $100,000 after 5 years and they all do tons of OT.    Compare that to nurses and social workers.  

I think your first and third paragraphs put together make a tremendous point.  You look at the federal report on Ferguson MO, which exxonnerated the shooter, but which also pointed out that the Ferguson police force is a shakedown crew plugging holes in the city budget by levying fines that people can't pay, and you can guess the kinds of people that burden landed disproportionally upon. Then you add asset forfeiture in on top of that and you've turned police departments into tax collectors with guns. 

Yet another bad use of the cops.  USA hates taxation, starves the beast, suddenly local governments are turning tax collection over to the goon squad.  And then you wonder why people hate cops?  Who likes tax collectors?

Edited by johnzo
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7 minutes ago, rebusrankin said:

Well my point was that while the nurse made a great point, the situations aren't exactly the same.

However to your point, I'm in favour of seeing more money spent on mental health services, even if it means decreasing the police budget. I think there are cases where the social worker/health expert would be better than a police officer. In other cases, you need the police officer. So I'm not in favour of eliminating the police force, which some who are calling for defunding seem to be doing, but I am in favour of reallocating some of that money/changing how we do things (which depending on who you read might mean I am in favour of defunding. Still educating myself on that one).

As part of the training I and many others were required to undergo was Non-Violent Crisis Intervention, and it has served me well. Despite receiving death treats, (some of which were on the job) I have never had to physically restrain anyone (ok, maybe a relative or two). Police are typically trained to dominate, with force as they see fit, rather than negotiate and descalate.

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41 minutes ago, johnzo said:

I think your first and third paragraphs put together make a tremendous point.  You look at the federal report on Ferguson MO, which exxonnerated the shooter, but which also pointed out that the Ferguson police force is a shakedown crew plugging holes in the city budget by levying fines that people can't pay, and you can guess the kinds of people that burden landed disproportionally upon. Then you add asset forfeiture in on top of that and you've turned police departments into tax collectors with guns. 

Yet another bad use of the cops.  USA hates taxation, starves the beast, suddenly local governments are turning tax collection over to the goon squad.  And then you wonder why people hate cops?  Who likes tax collectors?

And Winnipeg, to bring it home locally, is a shake down crew for police revenue through increased traffic enforcement and photo radar that has zero to do with safety.  We all know the amber light bullshit...they artificially make a short light to generate revenue.  Thankfully its not costing people their freedom or police record, but its ridiculous and its a slippery slope.  Why were cops so upset about weed being legal?  Its the easiest way to violate your rights and dig for something they can get on you that they otherwise wouldnt. "I smelled what I thought was weed, did a search and found a small amount of coke...or a knife"  Fack off with this crap.  Jails get fuller...thats good because the corrections union can press for higher wages and more bodies.   Look at our jails over flowing, guess we need more cops!  ding ding ding, and its so bad they need to be paid more money too.  

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30 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said:

And Winnipeg, to bring it home locally, is a shake down crew for police revenue through increased traffic enforcement and photo radar that has zero to do with safety.  We all know the amber light bullshit...they artificially make a short light to generate revenue.  Thankfully its not costing people their freedom or police record, but its ridiculous and its a slippery slope.  Why were cops so upset about weed being legal?  Its the easiest way to violate your rights and dig for something they can get on you that they otherwise wouldnt. "I smelled what I thought was weed, did a search and found a small amount of coke...or a knife"  Fack off with this crap.  Jails get fuller...thats good because the corrections union can press for higher wages and more bodies.   Look at our jails over flowing, guess we need more cops!  ding ding ding, and its so bad they need to be paid more money too.  

The cops like weed arrests for the same reason as they like speed traps- these are easy ways to pad stats with little to no risk. Pot users are about as resistant as a glass of warm milk.

Edited by Tracker
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just want to point out the the shakedowns in Ferguson MO were not about speed trap robots and red light cameras, they were all about armed cops hitting people up in public for BS fines.

red light cameras, we got a real problem with jackwagons running stale reds in Seattle and I'm all for ticketing those guys.  that's so damn dangerous.

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1 minute ago, johnzo said:

just want to point out the the shakedowns in Ferguson MO were not about speed trap robots and red light cameras, they were all about armed cops hitting people up in public for BS fines.

red light cameras, we got a real problem with jackwagons running stale reds in Seattle and I'm all for ticketing those guys.  that's so damn dangerous.

For sure I was just using a Winnipeg example of cops being tax collectors to justify their bloat.  Traffic enforcement is important but it has to be done fairly.  I think the police should actually do it themselves by targeting problem areas not having unmarked cars looking for people going a bit fast when it poses no danger.  And I have no issue with red light cameras but we know here, its artificially unfair to generate revenue which should be illegal.

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do traffic cops need to be armed?

you see it all the time in the USA, as a traffic cop approaches a vehicle they've pulled over, they are ready on their gun or maybe even have their gun drawn.  How many traffic stops legit need that show of force?  I am whitey mcwhiterson and I still get nervous when a gunned-up cop pulls me over and I describe every move I'm going to make to the cop before I do it, and I ask for permission.  "I'm reaching into my pants pocket to get my license out, is that ok officer?"  And my hands are on the wheel throughout the entire encounter unless i specifically ask for permission to move them off.

...which I guess is the point, a nervous / intimidated me is less likely to talk **** back or otherwise cause problems, but that ain't the way a government should treat one of its people and it's not one that makes me trust cops more, it pisses me off.  and plus, not everyone reacts well to that show of force.

Edited by johnzo
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1 hour ago, The Unknown Poster said:

Why were cops so upset about weed being legal? 

I remember a large wave of stories about the poor police dogs who had to be unemployed because of dope legalization.  example: https://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/may/29/oregon-police-dogs-drug-problem-marijuana

it's weird that all of these "won't someone think of the doggos?" stories popped up at the same time.  love dogs as much as the next guy but imprisoning people should not be a goddamn make-work program for genius dogs with amazing noses.

(boy, that'd be a dog that'd have trouble moving on to civilian life in Seattle.  You couldn't walk that dog anywhere where there are people, she would be constantly finding the dope and confused why that wasn't a thing she should do anymore)

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Trump Spreads Baseless Conspiracy Theory That Video of Buffalo Cops Pushing Elderly Man Was Antifa ‘Set Up’

The president thinks that Martin Gugino, 75, “fell harder than was pushed” and that he could have been an undercover ANTIFA activist.
The video of cops in Buffalo pushing an elderly man so hard that his head smashed off the ground and blood started gushing from his right ear shocked people across the nation.

But President Trump isn’t convinced it’s real. Tweeting Tuesday morning, the president pushed a baseless conspiracy theory with no evidence that the scene was a “set-up.”

Trump wrote: “Buffalo protester shoved by Police could be an ANTIFA provocateur. 75 year old Martin Gugino was pushed away after appearing to scan police communications in order to black out the equipment. @OANN I watched, he fell harder than was pushed. Was aiming scanner. Could be a set up?”

https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-spreads-baseless-conspiracy-theory-that-video-of-buffalo-cops-pushing-elderly-man-was-antifa-set-up?ref=home

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Trump Didn’t Warn His Own Officials About Decision to Cut Troop Numbers in Germany, Says Report

President Trump’s decision to slash U.S. troop numbers in Germany reportedly shocked several of his own national-security officials who first learned of the move via The Wall Street Journal website. Last Friday, Trump directed the Pentagon to remove thousands of American troops from Germany over the next few months, reducing the numbers to 25,000 from 34,500 by September. But Reuters reports that a number of U.S. officials at the White House, State Department and Pentagon didn’t know about Trump’s decision until they read about it in the Journal on Friday. A U.S. official told Reuters the Pentagon still hasn’t got a formal order to cut troops and that the decision caught some Defense Department officials off guard. Senior State Department, Pentagon and some national-security council officials “learned something was up when calls started coming around and the WSJ article hit,” a source told Reuters. The news agency also reported that Germany hasn’t been consulted.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-didnt-warn-his-own-officials-about-decision-to-cut-troop-numbers-in-germany-says-report?ref=home

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36 minutes ago, Tracker said:

Trump Spreads Baseless Conspiracy Theory That Video of Buffalo Cops Pushing Elderly Man Was Antifa ‘Set Up’

The president thinks that Martin Gugino, 75, “fell harder than was pushed” and that he could have been an undercover ANTIFA activist.
The video of cops in Buffalo pushing an elderly man so hard that his head smashed off the ground and blood started gushing from his right ear shocked people across the nation.

But President Trump isn’t convinced it’s real. Tweeting Tuesday morning, the president pushed a baseless conspiracy theory with no evidence that the scene was a “set-up.”

Trump wrote: “Buffalo protester shoved by Police could be an ANTIFA provocateur. 75 year old Martin Gugino was pushed away after appearing to scan police communications in order to black out the equipment. @OANN I watched, he fell harder than was pushed. Was aiming scanner. Could be a set up?”

https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-spreads-baseless-conspiracy-theory-that-video-of-buffalo-cops-pushing-elderly-man-was-antifa-set-up?ref=home

Tense moment for 30 cops in full riot gear....facing down a unarmed 75 year ole woke jihadist.  Measures had to be taken.  Guy pretended to fall down, complete with the fake blood. The officer who dominated this threat should receive a MOF.

 

 

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40 minutes ago, Tracker said:

Trump wrote: “Buffalo protester shoved by Police could be an ANTIFA provocateur. 75 year old Martin Gugino was pushed away after appearing to scan police communications in order to black out the equipment. @OANN I watched, he fell harder than was pushed. Was aiming scanner. Could be a set up?”

What a piece of arrogant siht. Or great piece of acting by Martin.

I’d like to try that move on Trump, pushing him to the ground, but I know it would be a useless move to try and tumble a “stout” figure like that.

I’d need help from Bighill and Whitehead to even move him..

 

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2 hours ago, Mr Dee said:

What a piece of arrogant siht. Or great piece of acting by Martin.

I’d like to try that move on Trump, pushing him to the ground, but I know it would be a useless move to try and tumble a “stout” figure like that.

I’d need help from Bighill and Whitehead to even move him..

 

To move Trump, the most appriopriate thing would be Ex-Lax.

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