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J5V does have a point in a weird way...  only time will tell if the cure is worse than the virus...

10 million on EI in the US, massive debt for GenX to figure out (which we don't have the numbers to solve), crime wave coming if this shutdown lasts and more rights given away freely - we have paid a high price to flatten the curve

I mean we're not talking about saving people's lives - we're just talking about spreading out the fatalities over a long time period so as not to overwhelm our system - we just don't know the collateral damage to people who have serious health issues or safety/abuse issues at home 

We've shut down the western world for a hail mary pass on a vaccine - hope this ends like it does in the movies...

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58 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said:

Can someone start a thread for the paranoid, delusional and the deniers of reality?  They can jabber on to each other and the rest of us can continue to discuss the serious situation at hand.  

It would serve no purpose, as it’s existence would be denied...🙂

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1 hour ago, The Unknown Poster said:

Can someone start a thread for the paranoid, delusional and the deniers of reality?  They can jabber on to each other and the rest of us can continue to discuss the serious situation at hand.  

We have that. It's the Climate Change thread and there's only one denier of reality in it.

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1 hour ago, J5V said:

What I find odd is that you aren't asking why we don't take the same measures to halt the spread of the flu? How is it that you can just brush those deaths aside? It's your attitude towards the flu that is completely dishonest and is contributing to far more death.

We do have something, it's called the flu shot, and if more people took that seriously (ie. enough to get herd immunity) the number of deaths from the seasonal flu would likely go down significantly.

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2 hours ago, J5V said:

What I find odd is that you aren't asking why we don't take the same measures to halt the spread of the flu? How is it that you can just brush those deaths aside? It's your attitude towards the flu that is completely dishonest and is contributing to far more death.

Well I and many many others get a flu shot each year... There are lots of places that restrict visitation during flu season to try and help from vulnerable people getting it.... So yeah we do take precautions. 

Here is where you apparently fail at logic, this is a new virus that no one on the planet had any immunity to. That means we are all susceptible to it, unlike the flu which there are people with immunity to, because it's been around for a long time and we have a vaccine for it. 

Stop trying to come up with a smart sounding argument and use a little logic. 

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TORONTO — Ontario Premier Doug Ford says the province will release data Friday showing how many Ontarians could die from COVID-19 in various scenarios.

Ford had resisted calls to release that modelling as recently as Thursday, saying there were many different scenarios, but he now says medical experts will provide a public briefing Friday.

He says Ontario’s chief medical officer of health needed time to compile figures that take into account the large influx of people, including snowbirds, returning to Canada and develop an accurate model.

Ford says the figures released will be stark, and may be “a real wake-up call” for people.

Nationally, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau says he isn’t able to share a national picture yet, but will be able to soon.

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23 minutes ago, Tracker said:

TORONTO — Ontario Premier Doug Ford says the province will release data Friday showing how many Ontarians could die from COVID-19 in various scenarios.

Ford had resisted calls to release that modelling as recently as Thursday, saying there were many different scenarios, but he now says medical experts will provide a public briefing Friday.

He says Ontario’s chief medical officer of health needed time to compile figures that take into account the large influx of people, including snowbirds, returning to Canada and develop an accurate model.

Ford says the figures released will be stark, and may be “a real wake-up call” for people.

Nationally, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau says he isn’t able to share a national picture yet, but will be able to soon.

I'm a bit hesitant about this...  no one released figures for the states to prevent panic, then Trump finally comes out with 2 million or 200-300,000...  then it turns out that everyone is using a 100,000 death scenario

Still bleak - but I expect Ford to release a worst case scenario to make himself look good if its half that

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2 hours ago, 17to85 said:

Well I and many many others get a flu shot each year... There are lots of places that restrict visitation during flu season to try and help from vulnerable people getting it.... So yeah we do take precautions. 

Here is where you apparently fail at logic, this is a new virus that no one on the planet had any immunity to. That means we are all susceptible to it, unlike the flu which there are people with immunity to, because it's been around for a long time and we have a vaccine for it. 

Stop trying to come up with a smart sounding argument and use a little logic. 

Your logic is that we brush aside 29 flu deaths to 1 coronavirus death because some people get the flu shot? I can do without that logic.

Do you realise how ridiculous what you just said is?

We currently have a 29:1 death ratio, almost exactly the same 29:1 death ratio that we are seeing in Ontario and I expect across the country and maybe the world and for that we are going to:

  • collapse the world economy the cost of which will be "at least $1 trillion and possibly $2 trillion world-wide"
  • plunge the world into recession/depression
  • cause world wide supply shortages
  • cause world wide panic buying
  • force the layoff of hundreds of millions of workers world wide
  • cause extreme poverty world wide
  • cause world wide stress, anxiety, depression, suicide
  • cause world wide violence, rioting, theft, looting
  • put troops in the streets world wide

and our part in it will be to stand idly by and: (courtesy Health Canada)

  • stay at home unless you have to go to work
  • talk to your employer about working at home if possible
  • avoid all non-essential trips in your community
  • do not gather in groups
  • limit contact with people at higher risk, such as older adults and those in poor health
  • go outside to exercise but stay close to home
  • if you leave your home, always keep a distance of at least 2 arms lengths (approximately 2 metres) from others, and
  • household contacts (people you live with) do not need to distance from each other unless they are sick or have travelled in the last 14 days

All this for a death rate that is 1/29th that of the flu. Yes I realise that may change as the flu season ends but talk about a fail at logic.

Even if the coronavirus death toll soars to 30 times what it is now we will only just have reached that of the flu. A flu we were happy to live with before destroying the world we knew over coronavirus. 

 

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6 hours ago, Mark H. said:

That's terrible.  My uncle was a patient there a couple years ago - first rate medical facility. 

 

My father spent his last years there from 1995 too 2002. I grew up in Riverview. I was glad he "went home" before he passed away from Dementia. We lived about 2/3 of a km from there on Clare Avenue. He was very well cared for. Sad news. I feel bad for both patients & their families in all long term care facilities everywhere.

Edited by SpeedFlex27
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6 minutes ago, J5V said:

  

Your logic is that we brush aside 29 flu deaths to 1 coronavirus death because some people get the flu shot? I can do without that logic.

Do you realise how ridiculous what you just said is?

We currently have a 29:1 death ratio, almost exactly the same 29:1 death ratio that we are seeing in Ontario and I expect across the country and maybe the world and for that we are going to:

  • collapse the world economy the cost of which will be "at least $1 trillion and possibly $2 trillion world-wide"
  • plunge the world into recession/depression
  • cause world wide supply shortages
  • cause world wide panic buying
  • force the layoff of hundreds of millions of workers world wide
  • cause extreme poverty world wide
  • cause world wide stress, anxiety, depression, suicide
  • cause world wide violence, rioting, theft, looting
  • put troops in the streets world wide

and our part in it will be to stand idly by and: (courtesy Health Canada)

  • stay at home unless you have to go to work
  • talk to your employer about working at home if possible
  • avoid all non-essential trips in your community
  • do not gather in groups
  • limit contact with people at higher risk, such as older adults and those in poor health
  • go outside to exercise but stay close to home
  • if you leave your home, always keep a distance of at least 2 arms lengths (approximately 2 metres) from others, and
  • household contacts (people you live with) do not need to distance from each other unless they are sick or have travelled in the last 14 days

All this for a death rate that is 1/29th that of the flu. Yes I realise that may change as the flu season ends but talk about a fail at logic.

Even if the coronavirus death toll soars to 30 times what it is now we will only just have reached that of the flu. A flu we were happy to live with before destroying the world we knew over coronavirus. 

 

I agree with all of this.. except we need to revisit this in 3 weeks when Coronavirus hits 30x what it currently is...

 

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4 minutes ago, Floyd said:

I agree with all of this.. except we need to revisit this in 3 weeks when Coronavirus hits 30x what it currently is...

 

Hopefully it doesn't....but J5V does make some good points and what concerns me is how long does this last and who decides when we try to get back to some sense of normal? 6 months? a year? How many people can survive a year of this?

Edited by bb1
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