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Walters also drafted two rookies in Smith and Shay who really didn't get reps. That's on MOS. Its worse when you see others picked in the first round who started, you know basically all other high picks such as White, Alford, Fortin, Shanks, Shad, Finlay, Veresuk.

Im putting that all on O'Shea. He decides the gameday rosters and they are always chalk-full of his shi**y vets game after game, regardless of outcome or performance.

Didn't necessarily have to can him, but he absolutely had to make the tough calls and let MOS know the pecking order. Exactly. Sometimes the GM has to say, Mike I don't agree with you and at the end of the day this is my call to make. MOS is a professional, I highly doubt he expected to win every argument. Lets just say that for every flaw that certain players showed and were overlooked by MOS, Walters ignored the flaws that were quite apparent with MOS. There was no bottom line.

If MOS pounded the desk for JT cuz he wanted him to play in 2025, I think if I'm Walters I'm rolling the game tape come 2026.

Found it interesting who is on the list and who isn't. Real lack of SSK players on both sides of the ball, especially D. And not a single MTL player at all. Was also a bit surprised to not see a single Bomber defensive back.

well you should have some trust, as that's who you hired, and Osh did sell him and Miller on being the guy to carry out their vision But...how things went since 2023....that trust and rope should have been reeled in, and the hard questions asked....I think that is where we went off the rails.....and need to get that back on track...we are not in desperation mode and really are just a few lil tweeks away from being right back where we were....but not under this current set-up But when the G.M and H.C are buds....who had some early success together...muddies the water...can't go down that road again

Because Jake Thomas has made us all nervous. :-)

Many people don't have him on their re-sign list.

I'm 90% in agreement with everything you said. Disagree that any GM should "trust" any HC about who he wants in free agency, etc. Not his job, not their skill sets. You know well that all coaches have biases, friendships with players, loyalties. And some of that is necessary. Sometimes it gets dysfunctional, like Osh. A pro sports GM is about talent acquistion, retention, cap management, projecting 1 year and 5 years down the road. Not happy, clappy feelings bonding with players like Osh seems to have as his main focus. It's about winning championships. Again, a GM should say thanks for your input HC, now let me do my job and try to build a championship roster and coaching staff, which may or may not include you.

but if the HC at end of yr and in FA tells his G.M this is who he wants....yadda yadda yadda....the G.M should trust in him....not create rifts....Walter's and Osh are both to blame....100%....Walter's more so in not being more the "boss"....but then that also falls on Miller too End of the day Osh picks the roster, and cant be argued he picks some bad choices....so it's his team...he also makes the dumb decisions and poor judgement....in charge of the unprepared team more times than we can count, and rarely able to answer with adjustments....Walter's biggest blinder was not dumping him last yr...lesson learned I guess Agree....and thats exactly what happened here...Osh was given to much currency and rope due to a few cup wins...and Walter's stopped being the damn good G.M he was....And if like you said there was the stand-off....he should have canned him after the debacle of 2024.....or by labour day this yr

This is exactly how I see it. I'm not happy that MOS showed far too much loyalty, but I am also not happy that Walters didn't do his job and save MOS from himself at times. IF MOS fist pounding changed Walters mind on personnel when he felt strongly the other way then he made the conscious choice to not do his job properly.

or ply the ones that could rep into the offence or defence....and they dont develop...until they leave here as other coaches do....Osh's logic just like his coaching is flawed, and will be a good riddance now....you dont larn on the sideline, or even in practice really...theory sure...maybe....playing....not at all yeah...exactly...how do you think we got T.Jones...dumped for a raw rookie...who ended up as RO.Y as well....and is better than any LB we rostered the last 2 yrs...Osh is flawed, and hopefully he can keep the Argo's in the abyss now I have not been one....and have no issues with him back to be honest Sad we have 2 former guys we could have kept on that list too...and would have made a huge difference here this yr....but our dear leder choose to retain his lil fav's in several spots....not allowing us to do so

You make a valid point - if JT wasn't signed by Walters, problem solved. I think most here agree Walters has failed in talent acquistion and retention. To me his biggest failure was allowing Osh too much input into this area. In your scenario, given how Osh touts "his guys" to the media it wouldn't surprise me if he lobbied Walters hard to resign JT and other vets who should have been gone. I have heard Walters say in the media that he and Osh have had some heated player debates before, and at times Osh "pounded the table" for certain players. I think he was referencing the CFL draft, but if that's the dynamic, it's not limited to the draft. Simple solution, and the right solution, would be to say no. To do your job as a GM, thank the head coach for their input, and remind them that you are the boss. Generally speaking that's how successful pro teams in all sports work. Collaborative, but a head coach should stick to coaching. I don't think it's happening here. Walters and maybe Miller too have failed in that regard.

First of all citing Dinwiddie as an example is not really applicable. Pinball was hired and given the GM title in name only, He is a figurehead. His GMing is pretty much completely hands off. Murphy/Dinwiddie were doing it all for years and that was well known. There is no way a team can function with two guys having equal say. One guy has to be the bottom line or else you will miss out on more players than you get. Who they bring in is 100% final say. They sign the guys. I'm not excusing how MOS used the roster he was provided, I am simply stating the fact that some guys that were well beyond their best before were given contracts to come back or extended. That's 100% the GM's decision to make. As a GM, if you have a HC that you know is not using the talent you are providing properly then you remedy that in the offseason by taking the obstacles out of his own way. No one can force Walters to sign JT to three extensions and no one else can register that contract with the league, as an example. This isn't me trying to defend MOS, just putting the reality out there to everyone who thinks that getting rid of him solves all our problems. It doesn't. Both men need to go. They were both equally responsible for JT seeing the field this season. Walters is the bartender who is giving a drunk guy another beer when he knows he should cut him off. If you have a coach like MOS who is deathly loyal beyond reason you cannot enable him to the fault of the team.

GM is responsible with his staff of scouts to bring in talent....not "final say" as well....as it goes with all teams...The HC will parlay the type of player he wants...who he wants to retain, go after in FA etc..etc...and G.M and his team will accommodate that best they can...They not gonna bring in guys, or resign guys/not resign guys that go against what the HC wants or claims he needs.. This roster garbage and fail is all on Osh as he is the the guy who puts the roster together....and the only fail by Walter's is the blind trust and believing in what Osh was saying....He should have tied the can to him at end of last yr, or as this season unfolded and the issues that were responsible again for us listing badly and still sinking...canned him before labour day...That's Walter's fail...and to an extent Miller's too Players were brought in...and cut...many showed real well in camp and in pre-season and above all had potential and upside...youth on their side...but Osh went another direction...kept garbage...aged out....poor talent and nobody experienced to back them up...making it worse Could the guys released made a difference and been better....we can never know but very likely would have because they couldn't have been worse than a lot of what we retained....even guys who were kept, were better than a lot of the guys that Osh choose to play and align his beliefs in...

We have no idea how they came to that arrangement though - that could have been something they (Miller, MOS & Walters) sat down and discussed when negotiating a new deal. Toronto is reportedly offering MOS significant control over personnel if he goes there and Dinwiddie also said he was doing some GM duties for the Argos so this may not be as abnormal as you think.

If MOS has equal say to Walters then that is Walters failing. He is the GM, if he lets other people call the shots on his job, despite reservations he has, is he really doing his job well? I wouldn't think so. I'm not suggesting that MOS didn't have roster input, all coaches do. However, any GM that lets their HC have the final say on matters of contract and roster build that they disagree with should be fired. Simple as that. You or I, if we had a boss, could go to this person and make personell decisions? Nope. Not the way it works. We have no proof anyone else was better. None at all. Also, yes, sometimes a GM needs to save a coach from himself as part of the job. Just as MOS will/should drag his coordinators over the coals if their decisions are poor. Everyone here acting like poor Kyle did such a bang up job only to have MOS play inferior players and there was nothing he could do about it. What a crock that is. Lots he could have done about it and did not. When a coach screws up or is in the beginning of a pattern of screwing up that's on the coach. When the coaches boss allows it to happen over an extended period of time and even contributes to it by providing the personnel then it's more on him than the employee. KW has the final say, he is the GM. This nonsense going on as long as it did was a result of KW not doing his job. I'm not defending MOS here, I am simply stating that KW facilitated and allowed all of this to go on. He is every bit as guilty as MOS for Jake Thomas still playing. Every bit. All coaches have players they tend to live in the past with, most competent GMs make that player go away to save the coach from himself. The coach can only play the players the GM provides. Don't want JT playing, don't sign JT. That was always KW's choice to make.

I Kyle walters puts 4 DTs on the training camp roster and oshea sticks with Jake Thomas over other guys even if the other guys are more skilled who's the issue there? This whole stupid argument comes down to the insistence from one poster that our coach just always plays the best guys and if they are on the roster it's because no one is better.

Stanley Bryant? I don't think it is a case of people wanting to cast him aside so much as the fact that he's old and there was a slip last year and the question is when is it totally going to fall apart? Sooner or later Bryant is going to retire or be too old to be effective.

https://cflpa.com/cflpa-announces-the-official-2025-cflpa-all-star-team Interesting that a certain OL made this list via his peers yet people are ready to cast him aside!

Could be. It's been happening in other cities for years - Winnipeg may just behind the times as usual. 2023 article from Montreal experiencing similar issues: 'Probably organized crime': Montreal police probe wave of arsons, extortion attempts

Yet almost every other team has their rookies taking snaps and, in some cases, starting. Veresuk in Hamilton was runner up as rookie of the year and took over the starting MLB role after 2 games - he would never have gotten a sniff of that here.

Show your work - please provide sources for this, just as you ask others to back up their claims. You've used media reports to back-up other statements but you seem to be ignoring the media reports that say MOS has just about as much say in personnel as Walters. They are both at fault for how this team is composed so it's not 100% on either guy but, IMO, MOS gets more heat as he's more visible of the two and he does get the blame for the gameday decisions. Where Walters can carry more of the blame is the amount being paid to certain players (ZC, I'm looking at you) and how that may have hamstrung us in other areas. Also ZC only signed a 1 year extension, not 2. His 3 year deal already included the 2025 season but he was extended through 2026.